I know my experience is nothing new to many of the people on the Board...it is just amazing to see how such a well read, intelligent woman can become so unable to see anything but what she has been indoctrinated with. I just sat there fascinated by the whole conversation as it unfolded...it was as if it were scripted and that script was distributed to every JW family member to use for "helping lost ones come to their senses"! It is certainly a slippery slope to see how far you can take the discussion before you are labeled an apostate.
tenyearsafter
JoinedPosts by tenyearsafter
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26
Had a Frustrating Discussion with Mom...
by tenyearsafter inmy 80 something year old mom is a die hard jw, but to her credit, she has not shunned me.
as would be expected, she is always "praying" that i return to jah and get reinstated.
is consistent...every time my wife and i see her, she always tries to steer the conversation to "how bad the world" has become.. today, she escalated the "theocratic attack" by coming out directly and asking me what i thought of world conditions.
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Had a Frustrating Discussion with Mom...
by tenyearsafter inmy 80 something year old mom is a die hard jw, but to her credit, she has not shunned me.
as would be expected, she is always "praying" that i return to jah and get reinstated.
is consistent...every time my wife and i see her, she always tries to steer the conversation to "how bad the world" has become.. today, she escalated the "theocratic attack" by coming out directly and asking me what i thought of world conditions.
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tenyearsafter
Hi Shirley, I actually have been on the site for a long time...I just managed to keep my mother at arm's length when it came to this type of discussion. I have been out for 16 years, and this is the first real "sit down" we have had. I just found the timing interesting...she is really pressing now, which would go hand in hand with the new emphasis by the Borg on how "close" we are to the end. It still is sad to see how such an intelligent woman can be so blinded to reason, but as I like to say...it is what it is!
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Had a Frustrating Discussion with Mom...
by tenyearsafter inmy 80 something year old mom is a die hard jw, but to her credit, she has not shunned me.
as would be expected, she is always "praying" that i return to jah and get reinstated.
is consistent...every time my wife and i see her, she always tries to steer the conversation to "how bad the world" has become.. today, she escalated the "theocratic attack" by coming out directly and asking me what i thought of world conditions.
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tenyearsafter
My 80 something year old mom is a die hard JW, but to her credit, she has not shunned me. As would be expected, she is always "praying" that I return to Jah and get reinstated. Her M.O. is consistent...every time my wife and I see her, she always tries to steer the conversation to "how bad the world" has become.
Today, she escalated the "Theocratic attack" by coming out directly and asking me what I thought of world conditions. I finally took the bait and told her that I thought some things were worse and others were much better than in past years. I pointed out that war casualties were the lowest in the past 25 plus years versus other times in history, death through epidemic was lower, etc. I pointed out that in the Dark Ages, 2/3 of the known world population died from the Black Plague. She just gave me that "deer in the headlight look" and said that she didn't agree...times are far worse today.
She then asked me why I had become ignorant of what the Bible teaches. I responded that I wasn't ignorant, but that I had now had a chance to actually study the Bible versus being told what I believed about it. The discussion went that way for over an hour, when I finally told her my main problem with JW's was the veneration of the Organization. She kept saying that JW's don't place the GB on a pedestal. I told her that I could never be reinstated as long as I didn't believe and follow exactly what the GB says is "current" truth. She flat out said that was wrong...sheesh! I then asked her what would happen to her if she went to the elders and said she no longer believed that 1914 was not the date of Christ's Presence, and Mom actually said that that would be fine...we all can have questions and doubts. I told her that she would be disfellowshipped if she didn't immediately recant her belief...she denied it. I finally asked her the big "Ah Ha" question..."if I believed all of the core doctrines of JW's such as two classes, no Hell, no Immortal Soul, no Trinity and lived an exemplary life, but I wasn't a member of the Organization, what would happen to me at Armageddon? She wouldn't answer the question. She side stepped any hard question I asked, ie: changing doctrines, 1914, 1975, the Generation...it was always, "we are adjusting our understanding as the light gets brighter". I asked her if the GB was God's Channel on earth, didn't they reflect badly on God with the constant changes in belief? God is infallible, so why would he give flawed information to his channel? Again, no response.
When all was said and done, she just kept saying I needed to "get back to basics and study the Bible". She said she couldn't do it with me, but that an "older man" could help me regain my Bible knowledge. I told her that I would be happy to sit down and study only the Bible with an "older man", but I refuse to sit down and study a WT publication with someone. That set her back, and she just kept repeating I needed to get right with Jah.
The conversation ended with that, and she is still "associating" with me, but it was an extraordinarly frustrating two hours. It is the first time I have seen how blinded to thinking JW's are. I guess the only good thing to come out of the whole thing was that she didn't label me an apostate and tell me never to see her again.
Sorry to ramble on, but I now see how frustrating trying to reason with JW's on simple issues can be. I have a better understanding of some of the frustration others on the Board have had in discussing things with JW family and friends. JW's just can't grasp the concept of critical thinking, and that is the saddest thing of all...they truly are "captives of a concept".
TYA
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What is the most embarassing moment you've had while still a JW?
by african GB Member ini remember having to preach to my girlfriend/classmate while i was still at school.
i was with one of the elders and it was my 'house' to preach.. wished i could vanish from the surface of the earth..
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tenyearsafter
The worst for me was when I was in field service and I knocked on a door, and the "hot" girl I lusted for at school answered the door. No one really knew I was a JW at school, so when she asked why I was there, I just stammered and made up a lame story...I am sure she figured it out, but she was cool and never made a big deal out of it. I can't remember being more embarrassed in my life.
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Why are so many JWs and exJWs unaware of the New World Order and the World Goverment?
by Infowarrior inwhy are so many jehovahs witnesses and escpecially ex-jws so unaware and ignorant of the new world order and the world goverment?
and is the watchtower a part of the new world order and the world goverment under the united nations and the vatican?
my rrsearch says this is the case.
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tenyearsafter
Huh?
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Do You Miss Even A Little Bit Your "Friends" From The "Truth"?
by minimus ini miss a few but honestly i could count them on one hand after being in the organization for almost 5 decades.
some jws are ok but most, i simply tolerated, due to being an elder..
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tenyearsafter
Not really...
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Why Women Are Treated Second Class In This Organization?
by AvocadoJake inthe best bible scholars have been women in my realm of this religious world.
the women study their husbands watchtowers, prepare the parts, write their talks, put their ties on, get the shave cream out of their ears.
it must be hard and you must have the patiences of job, to be able to listen to, the many arrogant men and how you will (if you are a female annointed.
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tenyearsafter
designs, I agree...the WTS enforces their orthodoxy via judicial discipline. Christendom has the very conservative denominations, but the majority seem to be much more "equal" in the treatment of women. It is very common for women to lead prayer or teach in a worship service...something you would never see in a mixed sex JW meeting. I am not saying these Christian churches are without fault, just that they tend to treat women more inclusively.
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Remakes Of Songs
by minimus ini always loved al green's let's stay together!
still, tina turner's version is very different and i love that too.
crying, by roy orbison is great and so is k.d.
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Why Women Are Treated Second Class In This Organization?
by AvocadoJake inthe best bible scholars have been women in my realm of this religious world.
the women study their husbands watchtowers, prepare the parts, write their talks, put their ties on, get the shave cream out of their ears.
it must be hard and you must have the patiences of job, to be able to listen to, the many arrogant men and how you will (if you are a female annointed.
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tenyearsafter
LF...I certainly understand how women would feel like second class citizens in the Borg. I don't know that I would go so far as saying that Christendom in general treats women like JW's do. There are many women in positions of ministry and teaching. Paul's teachings are viewed as a bridge between Jews, who were strong believers in women having a lesser role, and Christians who would be encouraged to not "stumble" those who were still influenced by old Jewish law and the many cultural traditions existing in the 1st Century. I think the attitude towards women JW's eschew is more a result of their taking a literal interpretation of Paul's words than looking at them in the context of the day they were spoken. With that being said, there are plenty of conservative denominations of Christendom, along with Islam, etc. that view women in a diminished role.
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What was one of the most difficult Scripture for you to understand?
by jam infor me, 1 peter 4;6 "for this is why the gospel was.
preached even to the dead, that though judged in.
the flesh like men, they might live in the spirit like god.".
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tenyearsafter
Any scripture that can be interpreted as either literal or symbolic, ie: Ezekial 38 or the majority of Revelation. JW's tend to mix interpretations, ie: the 144,000 is a literal number of "anointed Christians" while Christendom interprets it to be a literal number of Jews...the bulk of Revelation JW's read as symbolic while Christendom sees the majority as literal events. Same with Ezekial 38, JW's see it as symbolic and Christendom interprets it as literal. It was very confusing to me as a JW when I was asked to defend our interpretation, especially by a knowledgeable Born Again. They would feel we were very inconsistent with interpretation.