Posts by Metamorphosis

14

Who is GUILTY for the JW's killed in the concentration camps?

by Metamorphosis in

jw
friends

obviously the nazi's hold bloodguilt in part for the jw's who died in the concentration camps.. but unlike jews who could not change who they were, could not become un-jew and would have been killed anyways, jw's were often offered release if they renounced their faith as a jw.. since it is obviously a false teaching they were led to believe - that their eternal salvation rested on being & staying a jw - does the governing body (leadership) hold some bloodguilt, are they accountable in some way, for the atrocities that fell upon jw's?.

or is it merely a principle thing - that no matter what religion/belief was held, one should not be asked to give it up at the whim of a dictator?.

does the individual jw hold any fault based on whether they refused to sign over principle of freedom of belief or whether it was fear of losing their salvation by leaving a certain denomination?.

Metamorphosis

What the hell kind of logic is that?...is this a serious question, or are you just effing with us?

I didn't tell you what i thought. I presented 3 possibilities and wanted to see a debate if it was strictly one possibility or a combination of them and what YOU ALL thought.

I definately think the Nazi's hold bloodguilt as stated.

I also think the org holds some bloodguilt because people didn't sign that paper for fear of losing their salvation

I personally don't think any individual JW has any bloodguilt. (edit - when i say this i mean i don't hold a JW who Died responsible for themselves - I'm definately not referring to the Judge - he's lumped in w/ the "org")

I was just throwing it out for discussion - mainly because last night was the first time I ever thought of possibily the ORG being somewhat bloodguilty in God's eyes for what happened.

Morph

3

My Song Dedication to the Org

by Metamorphosis in

jw
friends

just like you - 3 days grace.

i could be angry.

i could be fake.

Metamorphosis

Just Like You - 3 Days Grace

I could be mean
I could be angry
You know I could be just like you

I could be fake
I could be stupid
You know I could be just like you

You thought you were standing beside me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you
You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

I could be cold
I could be ruthless
You know I could be just like you

I could be weak
I could be senseless
You know I could be just like you

You thought you were standing beside me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you
You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

On my own, cause I can’t take liven with you
I’m alone, so I won’t turn out like you
Want me to

You thought you were standing beside me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you
You thought you were there to guide me
You were only in my way
You’re wrong if you think that I’ll be just like you

I could be mean
I could be angry
You know I could be just like you

21

Boundaries

by The-Borg in

jw
friends

it's amazing but since leaving the borg, i've learned to set proper boundaries.

it's had a big impact on my personal happiness.

this may sound stupid to some people, because 'worldly people' have and respect these boundaries natuarly.

Metamorphosis

I am trying to fade and have been getting some comments re my lack of meetings and asked if I am alright. It makes me feel very uncomfortable having to make up excuses. You are right because I don't have to give them reasons! I will adopt a new strategy from now on!

Glad I could help. If they ask if you are all right simply say - yes, doing great - how was your day today. You'll get some strange looks (like how in the world can you be great when you haven't had your serving of spiritual food from the FDS class) - but just find them amusing in your knowledge that you are now finding the courage and strength to see what they can't. We are pounded home with the thoughts of not wanting to stumble anybody i think that carries over into what we feel we have to do/don't do in regards to meetings and field service.

You and I and so many others have the real truth now - I can only hope I stumble somebody because of my inactions - maybe if they see somebody that was as gung ho as I was not believing anymore they will ask themselves why....

Morph.

4

The New Fall Premieres

by mrsjones5 in

i'm having so much fun tonight watching "life" on nbc.

have any of ya'll been watching the new fall premieres of new shows and continuing shows?

what are your favs or what are the ones that look like they could be your new favs?

Metamorphosis

I enjoyed Chuck the other night...about the geek who's been privy to state secrets and has the hot CIA protector....

Morph

25

A deflating talk with my brother re: anti-witnessing,,,,thoughts?

by smellsgood in

jw
friends

**edited to say, my brother is not a jw, never has been, nor have any of my family.

i'm referring to jw's i don't know who came to the door finally (i posted about it a couple weeks ago in personal experiences) i was just talking to him about it because he got word of it and doesn't like the idea of it** .

talking to my brother today, he doesn't like the idea of me getting involved debating with jw's (i've done this plenty, just not in person:).

Metamorphosis

I like the quote in your initial post:

"evil endures when good men remain silent."

Even though we know that the things we have learned may indeed "bounce" off most good JW's, that they may fall upon deaf ears - when the opportunity presents itself I think we should attempt what good we can. Who knows what seeds of malcontent we may lay?

Morph

32

"Honey, how was the meeting?"

by OnTheWayOut in

jw
friends

do any of you with spouse or close family in ask the question?

regularly?.

i often ask the wife that question.

Metamorphosis

On the way out - you and I seem to be in a similiar situation. My wife is very similiar to yours in that she still believes even after a few discussions of very topics, but doesn't like to rock the boat between us.

Also - we have a great relationship outside of this spiritual difference - so again, like you, I have no wish to leave her.

Keep posting your experiences and I'll try to do the same. Hopefully one day we'll both be able to celebrate freedom with our wives. Until then perhaps we can pick each other's brains for ideas.

Funny side note on the Sep KM. I purposely printed out a copy from the internet and left it laying on my desk where she would see it BEFORE we got our official copies. I know she picked it up and read it because it was out of place one day. The other day she brought home our copies from the Hall and said ' well now you can get it from the horse's mouth'. So she knows i probably got it somewhere i shouldn't have and that i have a problem with it. Like your wife she seems content to not say anything and let me find my way - but hopefully it causes her to look into it deeper than she might have.

Morph

70

The fade is over, talked to my parents last night. (very very long)

by Paralipomenon in

jw
friends

there would never be a good time to have this conversation.

quite different from most people raised a witness, i have very few horror stories about my upbringing.

my family was just a family, my mom and dad fought and argued, my siblings and i misbehaved and got in trouble.. .

Metamorphosis

Congrats Para on having the courage to have that conversation. Recently I had a similiar one with my wife - I only hope she can follow your wife's path and join me in my opinion of the org. You mentioned your parent's looking at you like 'dead man walking' and sometimes I feel I get that look as well - it's not easy to deal with - but holding back those thoughts and feelings inside is just as hard to deal with.

Soon- i will probably have to have a similiar conversation with my parents who live in another state and aren't really aware of the extent of my fade. Your story and example helps give me resolve. Thanks.

Morph

14

Who is GUILTY for the JW's killed in the concentration camps?

by Metamorphosis in

jw
friends

obviously the nazi's hold bloodguilt in part for the jw's who died in the concentration camps.. but unlike jews who could not change who they were, could not become un-jew and would have been killed anyways, jw's were often offered release if they renounced their faith as a jw.. since it is obviously a false teaching they were led to believe - that their eternal salvation rested on being & staying a jw - does the governing body (leadership) hold some bloodguilt, are they accountable in some way, for the atrocities that fell upon jw's?.

or is it merely a principle thing - that no matter what religion/belief was held, one should not be asked to give it up at the whim of a dictator?.

does the individual jw hold any fault based on whether they refused to sign over principle of freedom of belief or whether it was fear of losing their salvation by leaving a certain denomination?.

Metamorphosis

Obviously the Nazi's hold bloodguilt in part for the JW's who died in the concentration camps.

But unlike Jews who could not change who they were, could not become un-Jew and would have been killed anyways, JW's were often offered release if they renounced their faith as a JW.

Since it is obviously a FALSE teaching they were led to believe - that their eternal salvation rested on being & staying a JW - does the Governing Body (leadership) hold some bloodguilt, are they accountable in some way, for the atrocities that fell upon JW's?

Or is it merely a principle thing - that no matter what religion/belief was held, one should not be asked to give it up at the whim of a dictator?

Does the individual JW hold any fault based on whether they refused to sign over principle of freedom of belief or whether it was fear of losing their salvation by leaving a certain denomination?

Thoughts?

Morph

21

Boundaries

by The-Borg in

jw
friends

it's amazing but since leaving the borg, i've learned to set proper boundaries.

it's had a big impact on my personal happiness.

this may sound stupid to some people, because 'worldly people' have and respect these boundaries natuarly.

Metamorphosis

Well I'm still in fade mode - but the biggest new boundry I've set is to not feel obligated to discuss/talk about everything with the elders. If they say they want to stop by or meet I just say No. I don't make up an excuse, i don't say it's a bad time, or let me check my schedule - I simply have nothing to talk about with them right now, thanks for their concern. This was a huge realization that they weren't some special spirit appointed person that I needed to be subservient to. I respect everybody, but no longer am held captive to that concept.

So that's also made it's way into other aspects of my life - i no longer make excuses to people why I wasn't at a meeting ( or the last 3 weeks of meetings) or where I have been. I tell them thanks for missing me and move on - sometimes leaves a bewildered expression on their face, like 'but, WHY???", but I don't feel the need to explain my every action/inaction anymore.

Morph

11

Bush to Skip U.N. Talks on Global Warming

by nvrgnbk in

jw
friends

bush to skip u.n. talks on global warming by steven lee myerspublished: september 24, 2007washington, sept. 23 dozens of world leaders are to gather at the united nations on monday for a full agenda of talks on how to fight global warming, and president bush is skipping all the days events but the dinner.. his focus instead is on his own gathering of leaders in washington later this week, a meeting with the same stated goal, a reduction in the emissions blamed for climate change, but a fundamentally different idea of how to achieve it.mr.

bushs aides say that the parallel meeting does not compete against the united nations process hijacking it, as his critics charge.

they say that mr. bush hopes to persuade the nations that produce 90 percent of the worlds emissions to come to a consensus that would allow each, including the united states, to set its own policies rather than having limits imposed by binding international treaty.. its our philosophy that each nation has the sovereign capacity to decide for itself what its own portfolio of policies should be, said james l. connaughton, the presidents chief environmental adviser.

Metamorphosis

He probably just realized the U.N. is the beast in Revelation and doesn't want to associate with such scum that would turn on true religion. After all the aim to reduce Global Warming has to just be against God's wishes.

Or something like that.

Morph