Posts by civicsi00

15

Need Questions

by ufo1 in

i used to post here a while back as 2112 and i am posting again.

i have continued to read but have just been too busy to post.. anyhow, over to past few years my jw wife has aced if the elders could "talk" to me.

i have always said no, only because i didn't want to bother.

I just had a hearing with the elders at my house last week. It did not go well because they are trained to not answer your questions and question your motive or outright assume you're being influenced by the internet/apostates.

I haven't had a chance to post up a full summary of what took place, but it was very revealing, at least to me.

I was prepared with a few quotes and scans of Watchtower magazines, but they didn't care. At one point in the conversation, I stated that IF Jehovah and Jesus picked the 'faithful slave' in 1919, then there would be ample evidence of it at least in the magazines of that year. I then stated that there was none, only that it was being taught that Russell was that 'slave'. One of the elders then stated (and I do not joke when I say this): "Well OK, so Jehovah didn't have a 'faithful slave' in 1919.. But the Bible clearly states that He would have one on earth, and that's at Matthew 24:45."

This elder, whether he realized it or not, just confirmed for me how blind they are. It doesn't matter what the Society says, said, or did, they are still blindly obedient. It doesn't even matter if the Society's history is accurate.

UFO1, if you make yourself sound sincere, then they won't immediately label you an apostate and continue with a good conversation. But, and I mean this with all due respect, what do you expect to get out of this by talking to the elders? If you make a stand, you risk losing your family.

You said:

I think if I did it this way by letting them come to me they can’t then say I’m attacking them.

Unfortunately your family may not see it this way. They may come to see you as the enemy, even though the elders are/will be pursuing you. The elders of my KH came after me (I haven't attended since 2007) and even after I told my mom this, she still thinks I need to be "humble" and "accept the discipline of Jehovah".

45

What's with all the 'Imminent' nonsense?

by AK - Jeff in

could it be that the proximity of 2014 is at the heart of it?.

i have no contact with jw's - except on this board - but my wife does at times with her family.

imminent is the cry of the sky for the jw's it seems.. i recall the years leading up to 1975 with a lot of that sort of thing.

civicsi00

To make you feel better, they could also use these synonyms:

about to happen, looming, coming up, forthcoming, pending, impending, at hand, nearby, just around the corner, within reach, near, close, close by, in sight, about to happen, approaching, on the way...

Oh wait, they already do. Damn.

10

Is there a copy of the September 2009 OKM available for reading/download?

by insearchoftruth in

civicsi00

From page 1: "If you discern that a question comes from opposers who may be trying to start an argument, imitate Jesus by limiting your response."

Gee, let's not try to defend "the truth". Let's instead decide that they're only trying to argue with you, so leave.

31

Serious Omissions in New Watchtower Book

by metatron in

jw
friends

the society's latest book, "bearing thorough witness about god's kingdom" contains two serious omissions.. first, on page 105, it offers an outright lie about the organization and the bible.

"they do not force the scriptures to fit their views.

impartial observers have recognized this fact.

civicsi00

Thanks for posting that about alternative service, Yesidid.

I understand that cognitive dissonance is involved, and that it is a dangerous mind control cult, but GB politics to get a majority and waiting for someone to pass away shows that it is not Jehovah guiding decisions. Can't they fu*&ing see that?

I think you answered your own question when you stated that you understood they're "a dangerous mind control cult".

Anything goes, at the cost of many lives, in this cult.

There needs to be another 'Ray Franz' incident. That would be spectacular.

33

Asking for money at the hall.

by GapingMouth in

jw
friends

i don't go to the meetings anymore for i am fading, but a short while ago something happened in a meeting i'd never seen in my entire life as a jw.

the local needs discussed the fact that the local branch had bought a new kh for a whopping 1 million euros.

that's insane, but not the part that got me.

civicsi00

Maybe they should hold garage sales at the KH to help raise cash.

Or hold bake sales...like other churches...LOL

I remember they used this same arrangement in the hall I grew up in. They'd pass around a little piece of paper and you'd have to write down how much you were going to contribute (for improvements or building a new hall). We were in the spanish hall, and now that I think about it, I feel sorry for all those that donated. Our hall had mostly poor Mexicans but they still contributed. Sucks..

18

Reverse Engineering the WTS CD ROM

by besty in

has anyone ever done this?.

would be cool to be able to run custom searches like the overall incidence of certain words or scriptures on an annual basis.

i'm sure smarter than me could come up with some handy uses..... thoughts?.

civicsi00

I would be interested in knowing how many times the U.N. has been mentioned or quoted since the N.G.O. membership was "discreetly" terminated.

SWA, seems to me they've been mentioning the U.N. less and less. Although I thought I heard or read somewhere that the WT is now teaching that the U.N. is no longer going to be the "eighth king" that's supposed to take power and destroy religion. The latest Revelation book still mentions the U.N., right? I need to check for myself...

31

Serious Omissions in New Watchtower Book

by metatron in

jw
friends

the society's latest book, "bearing thorough witness about god's kingdom" contains two serious omissions.. first, on page 105, it offers an outright lie about the organization and the bible.

"they do not force the scriptures to fit their views.

impartial observers have recognized this fact.

civicsi00

This book is a thorough review of the Bible book of Acts, which includes Acts 15. Yet, it says nothing about blood transfusion and simply passes by James' remarks with little comment.

This is interesting. As much as I would love to speculate (and forgive me if I do) about why the omission, I wonder if they left it out because they've already put their opinions about blood transfusions in their other latest book, Keep Yourselves in God's Love (or whatever it's called).

I do believe that the GB is going to allow JW's to accept the 4 main components of blood soon (as in the next 5 years). Some of the members of the GB are probably waiting for Jaracz and Barr to hurry up and croak so that they can change the stance.

So many changes have been made as of late, that it's impossible for the GB to keep ahold of possibly thousands of JW's from leaving without changing the blood doctrine.

Of course, if the changes do come about, there will never be an open, honest apology. Look at what they did when they changed the alternative service stance in 1996. They blamed it on God.

19

Reasoning From the Scriptures - are they working on an update?

by insearchoftruth in

a couple of questions on this, firstly, is there a pdf of this book available??

.

secondly, is anyone here aware of an update, due to the changing of the doctrine, this book is starting to become sprinkled with 'old light'........

civicsi00

Given that their doctrines change every few years, I bet they're still waiting on changing a few more things before releasing a new Reasoning book. Once they iron out whatever it is that's holding them back, they'll publish one. Just my opinion...

20

Dated Fulfillments of Bible Prophecy (the faithful slave)

by Son of Man in

.

4 and in answer jesus said to them: look out that nobody misleads you; 5 for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, i am the christ, and will mislead many.

[it is more than apparent that many were misled even by the w.t.s.

civicsi00

By what authority do you claim these things?

42

Upcoming Study with a Bethel Brother

by PSacramento in

so, after a lengthy discussion with my mom on friday, she asked me ( again) to have a study with a bethel brother because the question i ask are too "above" her knowledge and she feels that only a well trained bethel brother can show me the "truth".. i voiced to her my issue:.

i love my mother, father and sister that are jw's and the last thing i want is to lose them, we had already drifted apart because of their new found faith ( my mom was first, about 8 years ago, then my older sister and just recently, last july 4th, my dad), i told her that if i have these study with a bethel brother i will, most likely, sya thing and state sources that may get me brnaded as an "apostate", i asked her, to be honest and truthful with me and to tell me that, if i get branded that and they are told, suggest to them, to stop dealing with me, would they?.

she said that no organization tells her who to deal with, even more so in regards to family.. i was not convinced, nevertheless i agreed and this wednesday will have my first study with him, first topic the mwt, my issue with certain translations ( such as romans 10:13, colossians and so forth) and the name "jehovha".. .

civicsi00

Before doing anything, you will first have to determine his cult status.

Was he born-in or raised in it, or converted when he was older? Depending on which one he is, this will tell you what you can and can't bring up.

For example, if he was born-in and his parents were somewhat zealous JW's, then he should be familiar with 1914 and 1919, and possibly 1975 and the "generation" teachings. These are meatier subjects that you will want to discuss with him.

If he should happen to be someone who later converted, he will likely not be familiar with most of the dates and their significance. He is likely a JW by behavior and not by being convinced with the NWT (not the Bible) that the WT is God's channel of communication.

Good luck...