To those who seem to think that judeo-christianity is the same or worse than islam in this regard (as a whole religion, not a few nuts), let's do a quick comparison: Did the Pope (or any other leader) call for the whipping or death of anyone naming their hispanic child "hay-soos" (Jesus) ? If so, about half of mexico is in real trouble. Did any jewish religious leader call for the head of anyone naming anything after Jacob, Isaac, Ruth and many, many others? C'mon..... the "tolerance" meter is sitting at ZERO in islam. To recieve tolerance, one must display it first. Fair, no? If you expect me to respect YOU, then you would show me respect, right? OF course you would! That is about as "duhhhh" as it gets. So how can one of the worlds largest religions expect tolerance when they tolerate NOTHING!
Posts by MikeA
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10In light of the teddy bear named Muhammad.....
by NYCkid inregarding the teddy bear named muhammad by a class in a prestigious private school in sudan and the ensuing controversy, which is a prime example of religious fundamentalism (or religious extremism if you prefer) gone awry, i thought i'd incite some conflict in good 'ol usa..... jehovah is a self-centered tyrantjesus is a wine-loving homeless hippieallah is jehovah's alter-egomoses is warlockjoseph smith is a pedophilebuddah is a pregnant hermaphroditethe governing body of jehovah's witnesses are brainless, racist and closeted homosexual alcoholicsthere, that feels better.. best,.
nyckid.
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Apostate of the Month planning thread.
by wanderlustguy inokeydokey, i started communicating with one of the moderators about this, and i haven't heard back yet, but it doesn't seem like there should be an issue if we are nice about this whole thing, maybe it can be fun.. first off, if no one wants to do it, no point.. <deleted by wlg>.
third, the idea is not to raise someone up on a pedestal, but to recognize personal progress and/or the help given to other people, even if it's just creating a pleasant environment.
<deleted by wlg>.
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MikeA
I like it! If the term "jackass" really bothers folks, you could change it to "Delusion of the Month" and pick on the "thing" vice the individual....... of course, it is fair to give proper attribution for the delusion in question.....
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HOW S**T SCARED ARE THE BORG AT THE INTERNET!???
by shell69 injust strikes me that with all the 'active' dubs, still giving talks, attending assemblies; they must be looking at everyone with total suspision!.
soz if i've hijacked a previous thred.. much love to fellow 'apostates'.
shell69.
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MikeA
Utterly, totally and completely scared. Why wouldn't they be? Anyone who has to avoid ANY semblance of disagreement with their chosen beliefs has a weak faith indeed.
That is one area I never understood. Even as a JW kid I wondered why we were steered so clear of conflicting information. It seemed to me that "we" knew the "truth" (at least that is what all of our elders were saying..... not just "elders," but parents and everyone else involved). Well, if we know the truth, what harm is there is looking at the beliefs and such of others? Not just that crap that is posted on the back pages of Awake, that is entirely dismissive of any other thought.
I remember well reading those little Awake snippets about other religions and came to find out that the WT society's understanding of other religions, particularly eastern religions, was utterly incomplete and usually utterly wrong! Believe it or not, this is one of the very things that started to drive a wedge between me and WT. This began happening very early on. When you would read a little Awake diatribe about Shintoism, for example, and presenting itself as being a cliff-notes version of the "entire" belief system of said religion, well....... it sure brought questions to my young mind. Like, "How could people actually believe this stuff?" "It sound so silly, how is this possible?"
Soooooooo...... as I got a bit older and my vocabulary (and ability to read) began to flourish, I started to read the actual books that represented these religions. Boy was "I" in for a shock. Not a single time did AWAKE present another religion fairly or accurately. Not once!
To say that impacted my young self would be an understatement in the extreme...... they LIED to me! They wrote this crap in OUR magazine and presented it as fact/truth....... and it was all LIES! No folks, Hindus DO NOT worship cattle! There is a very specific reason why they treat cattle with some deference. Hint: Think...... Krishna was a cowherd boy, no? Same thing applies to Cobras. What was it that rose up and protected Krishna in his cradle? Yup....... it isn't worship, it is extreme respect. Even a cursory reading of the Mahabharata would make that utterly clear. COnsidering that Hindus have more written material describing their religion that just about everyone else put together, how on earth can anyone thing they could describe the entire religion in a single, short paragraph?
Well, I can tell you the answer to that, too...... Hide from the congregations the fact that there are such books and that the oldest known writing is in ancient Sanskrit (apparently) ....... and heck of a lot older than the "young earthers" would have you believe the age of the earth. But I'll end my diatribe here......
JW's.... ALL OF THEM..... have the weakest possible faith..... and for good reason...... their faith is in a shadow of a religion..... it is a CULT! -
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Your countries flag
by DJK infive years ago i purchased my first home.
one of the first things i did was hang the flag.
(american).
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MikeA
This thread warms my heart...... it really does. I am impressed that any former USA JW (excluding myself, of course) has taken the time to learn the proper protocols with regard to our National Ensign. Good job folks! *BIG smile*
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Golden Compass Movie, to be avoided?
by cab1000 ini had a chance to be with a group of jw's yesterday.
my wife thinks she overheard a couple of them talking about an announcement from the platform about avoiding the "golden compass" movie coming out.
i know that other religious groups have spoken out against this film, but i would not have expected the witnesses to announce that formally.
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MikeA
NOW, it is a movie to be watched..... thanks! :)
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Would Bigfoot Stomp Creationism?
by metatron ini suppose that any fact can be denied ( there's a hilarious scene in woody allen's "everything you ever wanted to know about sex".
in which a husband is oblivious to his wife's observation of his adultery).
however, i do wonder if they ever found a "bigfoot" body, would it.
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MikeA
Jaguar...... hmmmm......
"I call this planet the forum of many truths."
Ok, but make sure you qualify the term "truth." Does it include "fantasies" presented as truth or just things that are backed by ample evidence?
"There is all kinds of data supporting evolution."
Indeed, it is overwhelming evidence. Hard, testable, reviewable evidence.
"There is all kinds of data supporting creationism."
Where? There has yet to be hard, testable, reviewable, evidence of any kind to establish or even hint that this would be the case. As it is said, "absence of evidence is NOT evidence of absense," but it follows that "absence of evidence is NOT evidence of presence," either.
"There is all kinds of data supporting a young earth."
Where? See above.
"There is all kind of data supporting an old earth.
Indeed, it is overwhelming evidence, see evolution above.
"Google whatever you want. There are even people that have data supporting a flat earth."
You ARE kidding, right? They have NO data supporting a flat earth. None, zero, nada, zilch. They have a belief system that excludes science, but they have no evidence or data that could be called those names. The internet is one of the worst places to gather hard data, unless you apply healthy dose of skepticism. In other words, as I stated in another post, you need to ask, "What, where, when, who, etc." You will find that when you start asking the "who" question, for example, when presented with the ever popular "they" statements, that those dissipate right before your eyes. The question, who, cannot be answered because "they" don't actually exist or if they do, they have zero education in the subject.
Fantasy does not equal "truth." Fantasy isn't even a hypothesis, much less a theory. -
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Islam Diss'ed Again....
by chappy inseems a 54 year old british school teacher who is teaching grammer school classes in the sudan has committed a despicable act by blastpheming and showing no respect for the prophet!
can you believe it; she actually allowed the children in her class to name a teddy bear being used in a class project muhammad!!
the sudanise government, carrying out its god given duty is putting her on trial.
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MikeA
Hillary, sorry but you again try to sway the conversation with things that mean nothing to it. Whether I study religious texts or not is my business and my reasons for doing so are likewise. I study or have studied them carefully. I do so that I might understand what it is that peoples believe and why. Some make more sense to me than others, and despite your hidden assertion, the Bible itself NEVER really made sense to me. Too many places where it contradicts itself or is completely out of line with known fact. So don't try to put me in those boxes.
I am an astrophysicist by education. Thus my heavy science background and my attitude towards religions (fairy tales), in general. I feel reasonably confident in calling religions "fairy tales" because most, if not all, statements of historical or so-called scientific fact written within their pages are utterly incorrect when properly researched.
The danger here is that these believers in a "horror" story are following that story as if it were real. Insisting that you and I believe the same. To the point that they will bullwhip a person to death for naming a teddy bear after their so-called prophet....... whose only REAL motive was to have ultimate power and "profit" from his fairy (horror) story world. Get it?
Are you muslim or are you just "anti" everything considered western? To the point that you will excuse the activities of these so-called educated people because someone else did the same thing a thousand years before they were even a religion...... I am speaking of a religion, an entire religion here.... not the acts of a few morons. -
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Islam Diss'ed Again....
by chappy inseems a 54 year old british school teacher who is teaching grammer school classes in the sudan has committed a despicable act by blastpheming and showing no respect for the prophet!
can you believe it; she actually allowed the children in her class to name a teddy bear being used in a class project muhammad!!
the sudanise government, carrying out its god given duty is putting her on trial.
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MikeA
stillajwexelder, What a name :)
That is about the "size" of it....... pun intended. -
59
Islam Diss'ed Again....
by chappy inseems a 54 year old british school teacher who is teaching grammer school classes in the sudan has committed a despicable act by blastpheming and showing no respect for the prophet!
can you believe it; she actually allowed the children in her class to name a teddy bear being used in a class project muhammad!!
the sudanise government, carrying out its god given duty is putting her on trial.
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MikeA
Hillary,
Didn't take it personally. Be aware that I am NOT christian, jew, muslim, buddhist, taoist or anything else. I am an agnostic at the very best (if you consider that "best"). In truth, I am closer to atheist. Therefore, I "cling" to no religion.
You call it laughable that people should learn from the mistakes of others. I don't think so. When was the Koran written? Hadith? THe answer is long after the Torah or Bible. It is not an "ancient" religion. Additionally, despite what you might be thinking, the christians didn't start the battles that were eventually called the crusades. Despite what it is that muslims would tell you, a simple look at who struck the blow that caused the pope to react so violently should be read carefully. THe muslims overran the area and it was decided it was time to remove them. While I don't agree with what happened, necessarily, the victims were most certainly NOT the muslims. They were the cause of the problem.
Again, personally, I consider most religions to be the things that caused most conflicts. People following an imaginary "god" need others to bolster their belief in that fairy tale. To make myself clear, I am not saying that god is a fairy tale, but that every blasted religion is..... all of them. Are some worse than others? Surely. Reading their books usually tells the tale. In the case of Islam, that is a fact.
Read the Hadith...... I have and what it says, due to the recent nature of its production, is easy to understand. Translation from arabic to english is a piece of cake, unlike the ancient tongues the other "bibles" are written. But "believe" what you wish. The issue is Islam. Read the books and it becomes more than obvious. Mohammed was NOT a nice guy, especially in later life... which is significant in their religion since allah can change his mind in that religion. The book says so..... and he apparently does...... but you would have to read them to understand that.
Again, not taking it personally. This is a discussion about a fairy tale and the incredibly debilitating effects of believing in a fairy tale. In my opinion, the reality of the whole thing is that they could say they believe in sleeping beauty and it would have as much validity as religions in general.
By the way, have you actually read Mein Kampf? Again, I have. Do you know where hitler got his ideas concerning the jews? You really should read about some of his allies before answering. When you figure that one out, you will be as shocked as I was when I was first introduced to the FACTS and the extraordinarily heavy evidence to support it. -
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Islam Diss'ed Again....
by chappy inseems a 54 year old british school teacher who is teaching grammer school classes in the sudan has committed a despicable act by blastpheming and showing no respect for the prophet!
can you believe it; she actually allowed the children in her class to name a teddy bear being used in a class project muhammad!!
the sudanise government, carrying out its god given duty is putting her on trial.
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MikeA
Hillary, I don't "vomit" this material in deference to any other religion. But.... that argument concerning the long-past Judeo-Christian ethic doesn't wash. Why not? Because EVERYONE other than islam seems to have learned the lesson. So why didn't they look at the bad example that was initially set by the Judeo-Christians and say to themselves, "not here, not us."
I find the tactic of redirecting the conversation to be fairly common. This is about islam, not any other religion. Please pardon me for being forceful about it, but that is a fact. I don't care WHAT the Jews or Christians did centuries ago..... I care about this century. We don't have the time to let them figure this out for themselves..... they have or will have nukes, germs, chemicals aplenty. No time left to be "patient" with a religion that is based, fundamentally, on what we would ALL call extremism.
Again, read the Hadith. It is nasty beyond belief. Look at who it says it is ok to kill, specifically who it says. It names groups of people specifically. And it sounds an awful lot like Mein Kampf..... more than the bible ever did, that is for sure.