Posts by Gopher

23

BILL BOWEN R U THERE?

by plmkrzy in

"why is bill bowen not df'd or d'ad or shunned?

" he is "in good standing" is he not or was that a false statement?

Gopher

Plm,

I guess you could call it intuition! I don't read hearts, really!

But as far as Bill and his Silentlambs campaign, my take on it is this: if it's fraudulent, he's sure going through a lot of pain and sacrifice on behalf of the fraud. I don't know him personally, but I do know he's put his finger on a real and vital issue that cannot be ignored.

As with anyone who takes a chance like he does, and puts himself at the forefront, he will have doubters and detractors. Such is life.

I guess maybe if you read www.silentlambs.org some more, it may sink in for you that this is for real. Maybe.

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

23

BILL BOWEN R U THERE?

by plmkrzy in

"why is bill bowen not df'd or d'ad or shunned?

" he is "in good standing" is he not or was that a false statement?

Gopher

Hey plm, calm your racing heart!

From what I understand, Bill Bowen is OFFICIALLY in good standing, not having been DF'd. He voluntarily removed himself from the position of presiding overseer when his concerns vis-a-vis child molestation were not being addressed.

And, in practice, he is being shunned by his Kentucky congregation. But they have not brought any charges against him, either out of fear or out of lack of anything with which to charge him!

Plm, this guy is for real! And his concern for the children is real too.

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

6

Ashi's Apostasy--Part 4 FBF's Committee

by 25ashitaka25 in

so many things happened that i havent mentioned.

my wife almost died of an asthma attack along with an allergic reaction in 1999. in 2000, we saw all of our friends abandon us.

yet, we as a couple were as strong as ever, and continue to be.. in the fall of 2000 my brother-in-law did something remarkable.....he said no to the abuse his parents were bestowing on him.

Gopher

Ashi,

Good story. Well told. You've got talent! Thanks for sharing, and as always, looking forward to parts 5 and 6.

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

37

Canada and USA Hockey score

by orangefatcat in

jw
friends

usa 1, canada 0, booobooo

Gopher

Great game. LB is right. Canada HAD to win. It's their game.

It was closer than the 5-2 score indicates. The goaltending came through for Canada at just the right time, and then Canada broke through once in the third period, and that was the game baby!

I loved these Olympics, overall. Except for the ice dancing.

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

11

PART ONETHE STORY OF ZEV***

by zev in

with all the stories coming out on the board, which i know gwen and i greatly enjoyed reading them, prompted me a few weeks ago to start my own.

this is part one, and thanks to amazing, duncan and hillary for their inspirations and getting me motivated.. cheers!.

part one...the early years.. this will be a work in progress folks.. as i write ill post the parts.

Gopher

Zev,

I'm about your age, also baptized at 16, feeling like any real friends were few and far between. Your story strikes a real chord with me. I know this is going to be a good account!

Ashi, you're not waiting. Waiting is waiting!

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

27

Love amongst the "brothers"

by Thirdson in

the one thing that jws claim is the love they have for one another.

i am well aware of some of the things that have been done in the congregation for members and i believe real love was shown.

in times of natural disaster jws have been very good at caring for their own.

Gopher

Undine,

I am so sorry to hear the sad background story. It sounds like your daughter is still at a somewhat impressionable age. At some point when she exerts some independence, you may again have a chance to have the relationship with her that you both so deserve. May you have strength until then!

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

38

Gender discrimination?

by teejay in

sixty minutes covered this story a month ago and meet the press brought it up again this morning when rumsfeld was interviewed.... when stationing troops in foreign countries, the u.s. military tries to abide by the rules of the country.

in saudi arabia, the custom for women in public is that they wear an abaya, a floor-length, long-sleeve, loose-fitting garment that covers everything but the face.

air force lt. col. martha mcsally filed a lawsuit against the pentagon, arguing that the policy was discriminatory because men are not required to dress in traditional muslim garments.. when interviewed on sixty minutes, mcsally was so offended by the garment that she would not put it on just to demonstrate what it looked like.

Gopher

This raises a couple interesting points.

Yes McSally and all who serve in the military should abide by the rules. She shouldn't go in there and try to make all her own rules. That seems like a part of the assignment to me.

However, she does raise an interesting question. What WOULD the changes be for American military men if they too were required to wear local garb? Would it be too much to ask? Or are the American men not asked to do so, only because the locals don't impose the same penalties on men for violating dress codes than they do on women?

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

27

Love amongst the "brothers"

by Thirdson in

the one thing that jws claim is the love they have for one another.

i am well aware of some of the things that have been done in the congregation for members and i believe real love was shown.

in times of natural disaster jws have been very good at caring for their own.

Gopher

Undine,

Sorry to hear about your tribulations, losing the affections of your daughter. Losing the love of the morons in the congregation, that I can understand.

But the natural love of your daughter was hijacked from you. That's what you get for taking a stand.

You said your ex-husband doesn't honor the joint custody....Isn't there something your lawyer can do to enforce the custody arrangement? After all, it was set down in legally enforceable terms by a judge or court official, right? Isn't his denying such access to her on par with kidnapping? (Not to say that your reunion with your daughter would necessarily be easy, but hey, you gotta start somewhere!!)

If I didn't get to see my daughter, I'd go nuts!! Best wishes to you.

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

6

Ashi's Apostasy---Part 2 Marriage

by ashitaka in

in september of 1997 i met her.

close your eyes, and epitomise beauty.

water goddess (as you guys know her) was just a beautiful girl out of my reach in september 1997. she had just been out of the hospital, and seemed a little down.

Gopher

I'm so glad you got the girl of your dreams, and she has you!! What a fight you had to get it, though! Wow!

I had to comment on this part... writing poetry makes you unspiritual? Excuse me, have they ever heard of Kings David and Solomon? Or how about perfect man Adam when presented with Eve? Or Moses and his victory song? Yes, these men were all terribly unspiritual when they wrote their poetry!

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)

7

Here Goes

by KissAFish in

here goes...i left the jws, nearly 10 years ago..i was 16 when my hand was helped along by firstly getting kicked out my parents home, (my dad had been an elder but was stood down for various family issues..me being one...and my mum was a ferocious terrier of a doorknocker..) anyway, i as a child was conditioned to please...as all jws are, and thought id give it another go, so went to live with my sister and her family ( jws too)... lasted a year before i got into"worldly hands", and my sister kicked me out... so, i went to share with my brother ( at least he wasnt a jw now, my parents threw him out too)..and got to hear from my dad that mum was dying of cancer, she was terminal...my brother and i grappled with feelings as we still wanted to see our parents and yet constantly had this cloud of ..you not being a jw are killing your mother..and my mum would beg us to come back to the "truth" so we would "live forever", this was my only ever hesitation in leaving the "organization"..and the emotional blackmail that was laid on was enormous....i managed to sit with my mum during all of her chemo treatments( something my 2 jw sisters never did) and she would constantly beg me to come back..i held my ground though it hurt to see she truly thought i was evil and would die at armageddon..my brother bore and still does the worst of this guilt..i managed to hold my ground even after my mum died an excruciatingly painful death and my dad publicly disowned my brother and i...i went to counselling and was told how well i had coped... so i went on to study and meet a great guy..marry him..a catholic!!!

(wg)...but, listening to my brother, just recently... after he went on jw sites.

( he feels he has to have answers to all of it..).

Gopher

KAF,

Welcome to our humble abode! I read your account and it seems you see things quite clearly. You didn't "give in" to the guilt trips that could have happened when your mom was ill and dying. You were there for her, where were the people whose organization supposedly is the "only loving brotherhood" on the planet?

And as far as fading away, don't worry... you did it beautifully!! No need to DA yourself as long as you got away. Your circumstances (and perhaps because you didn't get in too deep) have led to a more graceful exit from the "BORG" then most people are able to make. Count your blessings and move on!!

You made your points quite well, and hope you continue to share your thoughts occasionally on this forum.

Your quote about fractions is funny.... But it also applies to JW's... and their confusing teachings about allowable "blood fractions" that they can take. Their whole blood doctrine has become a mess since they allowed fractions. (Sorry, went off on a tangent there.)

J.R.Why shouldn't truth be stranger than fiction? Fiction, after all, has to make sense.
Mark Twain (1835-1910)