Steve 2 said: "The JW says it's Jehovah's will as revealed through his channel, Moslem's says its Allah, Catholics say it's God's word as interpreted by the Pope and on and on and on and on." My reply: interesting that you should put jehovah, Allah and the Pope all in one sentence. Here is is again. Pope Pushing Idea that Allah and Jehovah are the same God.
Issue Date: January/February 2000 In his weekly general audience in late May of 1999, Pope John Paul II addressed Muslims in a series discussing "interreligious dialog." He quotes from the 1994 Catechism of the Catholic Church n. 841 which states, "... together with us they (Muslims) adore the one, merciful, God." The pope and many other religious leaders today, who are being wooed into the ecumenical movement, are accepting the idea that the god of the Koran and the God of the Bible are one and the same. Here we can see the subtle beginnings of the oneness movement that is coming on. The philosophy that "all gods are the same" and that "all paths lead to god." My Bible says the road to destruction is broad and the path leading to righteousness is narrow and cramped. So, who will you believe folks? Oprah and the Pope? Or scriptures from a man who died because he told the truth?
winnower
JoinedPosts by winnower
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Whats wrong with obeying God?
by real one inmany who post here are always talking about they don't need god and that they don't believe in god and that he dosen't exist.
god does not ask us to do unreasonable things.
most of the things he ask us to do protects our lives.. why don't people get that?
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Whats wrong with obeying God?
by real one inmany who post here are always talking about they don't need god and that they don't believe in god and that he dosen't exist.
god does not ask us to do unreasonable things.
most of the things he ask us to do protects our lives.. why don't people get that?
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winnower
Real one: Your question is vague at best without having given a definition of "god". I do not believe in any god that would require a blood sacrifice. This is against the nature of a True Creator. (The implications of such has to do with changes made in the scriptures by the Nephilim, when the offspring lineage came to work as temple slaves and eventually began to have more responsibility, and later, authority. This blood thirsty god is not Our Father nor the father of Jesus.) Jesus did not come to earth with the exclusive purpose to "die for our sins." He came to this earth to teach us how to LIVE. He came to teach us how to behave toward one another. He came to raise man's consciousness. He came to teach us how to confront the evil against us. He came to let us know he was well aware of the miseries and tests we would face in this world, but for some reason it had to run its course. He also gave us promises of reassurance that one day all would be rectified and we would have a chance to enjoy what the True Creator had hoped for us originally. He was killed by forerunners of a group that still exists today. An evil satanic group. When you focus on "jesus died for our sins" you completely negate what he came and LIVED for. Can you explain what sense it makes to you that "jesus died for our sins"? Please articulate what that really means. Can you explain why a Creator would require the destruction of a creation he supposedly loves? Please be articulate about that, too. And PS...there is no rapture. You are going to be stuck here going through hell with the rest of us. Will you die or will you survive it? One thing for sure, none of us are so special that we get flown out before it happens. Oh yeah, some like you think you get out mid-way and the rest of us blokes will suffer. That's pretty arrogant too. It ain't gonna happen. Something tremendous DOES happen at the very end of the story. But you won't see any reprieve before then.
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Noah, a preacher of righteousness?
by easyreader1970 inif you are familiar with the wbts literature, you are familiar with their version of the story of noah.
it's mostly the same as other christian versions except for one detail.. in only one scripture in the bible (2 peter 2:5), noah is called a preacher of righteousness.
this is the only scripture in the entire 66 books that mentions him in this way.
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winnower
Why Noah and his immediate family were the only ones immune from this great judgment is significant. Genesis 6:9 says, "Noah was a just man." He stood out as an example of righteousness and godliness in a perverse age. Like Enoch before him, Noah also "walked with God." But there was another reason why Noah was spared, one that seems to have escaped most commentators. Genesis 6:9 says that Noah was "perfect in his generation." Does this mean moral and spiritual perfection? Hardly. Genesis 9:20-23 disproves any such perfection. What, then, does the Bible mean by calling him "perfect"? The Hebrew word is "tamiym" and comes from the root word "taman." This means "without blemish" as in Exodus 12:5, 29:1, Leviticus 1:3. Just as the sacrificial lamb had to be without any physical blemish, so Noah's perfection. In its primary meaning, it refers not to any moral or spiritual quality, but to physical purity. Noah's genetic line was uncontaminated by the Nephilim. He alone had preserved their pedigree and kept it pure, in spite of prevailing corruption brought about by the fallen angels. (15) And again: Noah's bloodline had remained free of genetic contamination. This implies, of course, that all the other families on Earth had been contaminated by the Nephilim. It also proves that the assault of Satan on the human race had been far more extensive than realized. It is no wonder that God pronounced such a universal fiat of judgment. As for the fallen angels who participated in the abomination, God put them in custody "in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day" (Jude 6). This is sometimes interpreted as Tartarus or the "nether realms" (2 Peter 2:4). This would also explain why some fallen angels are in custody and why others are free to roam the heavens and torment mankind.
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winnower
wor ship.....war ship
Maybe there is something to the alien theory.
Nephilim's were aliens.
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Public Talk & Bookstudy Changes - the real reason
by bud2114 ini havn't been able to keep up with all the discussion in this forum as to why the gb has suddenly decided to implement these changes and perhaps someone has mentioned this already, but to me the most obvious reason has nothing to do with control, or money.
it has everything to do with the serious shortage of qualified brothers who can (or who are willing to) be used.
i have been involved in the organzation for 40 yrs and i have never seen the level of apathy and disillusionment among those serving in some capacity in this organization.
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winnower
meeting Junkie No More said: Here's my take: It makes no sense this change being announced now, but taking effect January 2009 . My reply: I so agree with this. I would just have to ask....well gas is high now. Since this doesn't take effect for 8 months...just how high do you think gas is going to go? Does the GB have some insider trading info on it? Meeting Junkie No more said: This is very likely similar to the conditional donation arrangement, announced in plenty of time BEFORE the actual government implementation of new laws took effect, so that the 'publishers' would not put 2 and 2 together and realize the change was not actually motivated by the scripture "You received free, give free". My reply: There is a high echelon of freemasonry power behind the Towers. And those in the top KNOW something is about to happen. Just like you said...what happened with the donation arrangement being PRE-arranged before the new laws were announced. It tends to make the GB look like they have perfect timing because of this "Divine Communication." It's divine all right! The Tower is part of the conspiracy and those who make the decisions (GB) are given instructions from behind the curtain. Meeting junkie no more: There's something more to this, and I'm just not sure what it is, but it will become clear sometime in the next 8 months. We just have to keep our eyes and ears alert, so that we put 2 and 2 together at the right time! The GB and their lawyers want this to be totally off the radar when the real reason becomes clear... You can bet your bippy. Your intuiation is right on. Keep listening to it. You are truly one of the aware.
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Could This Be The Watchtower's Endgame?
by metatron insuppose you had a business that didn't make money.
you would try to make the thing more efficient and probably lay off.
some workers to cut costs.
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winnower
WTWizard says:
Something tells me that they are soon going to make a vicious effort to reclaim their property (that is, those people that have left) in the near future. Coupled with this plugging all the information leaks that the witlesses are exposed to, it's going to be one miserable trip for anyone that's in.
Some theories I have seen include a hounding campaign, probably starting in early 2009. Hounders will be assigned those inactives that are in their former book study group to hound and round up while everyone else is in field circus. They are going to play on fears of the economy and worsening world conditions to get people back in. What they won't say is that conditions in the Washtowel Slaveholdery are deteriorating even faster, and are going to be even worse.
Wizard, I wonder how many people have the same sense of knowing this?
One of the Society's planned campaigns sometime after this "catalyst event" will be to put out a "last call" to the "lost sheep"...that's you....the faders and (maybe) some apostates. Expect a short campaign of hearing from former friends and estranged JW family members. There will be strict rules about the interaction. They will implore you to repent and return. Because of the economic chaos and panic that will ensue over the next few months, many defectors may return to the Mother at this time. (Thus, the new importance of "family night bible study") This lost sheep campaign is an act of "duty"--- not love. This is a maneuver so that the wbts captives will feel vindicated later when you are totally cut off from their grandiose "paradise plans" and they can say "we tried". It is merely a tactic to alleviate the R and F of future personal guilt toward family members and any sense of loss of family or friends. When the final implementation of the program comes about in a year or so, there will be no second thoughts of you. http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/157356/1.ashx
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Elitist Blueprint For World Government Revealed
by What-A-Coincidence inhttp://www.jonesreport.com/article/05_08/01elitist_blueprint.html.
elitist blueprint for world government revealed.
new book written by insider - 6,000 globalists control the planet and plan to completely end national sovereignty, manifesto for dealing with "antiglobalist" resistors unveiled.
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winnower
When the US economy bottoms out, the powers that be will allow people to suffer and get a good taste of severe economic depression. How long will it last? I don't know. But it will be long enough so that people will finally be so desperate they will be manipulated into grabing any solution offered by their government. This is when the plan for economic recovery will be put into place. It has all been planned. The resolution offered will be to open the borders of the USA, Canada, and Mexico . When this happens no one will have "birthright citizenship" anymore. That's a thing of the past. You will now be expected to go with the current flow and become a "world citizen". There will be certain oaths, loyalties, and rules you must adhere to. You will have to agree to these terms in order to participate in society and receive your (mark) chip. It will all be voluntary. However, you will find, as time goes on and the banking system does away with paper checks, drivers licenses are no longer issued on a laminated card, etc. etc. that you have to make a choice about living in the digital world---or not. I have previously written on this subject. What some of you may not know is that these plans have already been put into place. I posted a video concerning the Nasco corridor in an earlier post. excerpt: Trade Corridor One of the key trade corridor initiatives that Transportation Policy and Service Development focuses on is the Mid-Continental Trade Corridor. Manitoba’s position at the heart of North America makes it a key part of the Mid-Continent Trade Corridor, connecting Canada to a central North American market of 100 million people. Through a system of connecting highways and rail routes, the corridor provides seamless and efficient transportation linking major commercial centres in the Canadian and American Midwest, through the Southwest, and deep into Mexico . Intermodal in nature, the corridor allows cost-effective and safe movement of goods and people, minimizing both travel costs and time. The corridor is shown in the graphic below.
Here's another tidbit....and I am just wondering how many of you know this? I don't want to be dredging up old news and bore anyone. excerpt: Roads and bridges built by U.S. taxpayers are starting to be sold off, and so far foreign-owned companies are doing the buying.
On a single day in June, an Australian-Spanish partnership paid $3.8 billion to lease the Indiana Toll Road. An Australian company bought a 99-year lease on Virginia's Pocahontas Parkway, and Texas officials decided to let a Spanish-American partnership build and run a toll road from Austin to Seguin for 50 years.
Few people know that the tolls from the U.S. side of the tunnel between Detroit and Windsor, Canada , go to a subsidiary of an Australian company which also owns a bridge in Alabama . Article quote: "when in reality the elite created monopoly capitalism and have been a hidden-hand manipulating world events and offering solutions to problems they created for centuries." Do you think these elites are....ILLUMANITI? Top of the heap of the various Freemasonry organizations? Do you think they have created the monopoly capitalism and are now going to crash it and destroy all this "excess population" as part of a new agenda? If they created the problems to start with, and then turn around and offer the solutions...isn't that kind of like setting a house on fire and then returning with a bucket of water to "look like a hero"? Same set of folks playing good cop/bad cop? Higher echelons letting the lower groups take the fall? What's your take on all this, WAC? Article quote: "Watch Rothkopf give a lecture on the power of the global elite. He identifies Bohemian Grove as a key meeting venue for the globalists. " Bohemian Grove??!!! Now THAT's a SUBJECT. Are we allowed to discuss that here? Do you think anyone will talk about Molech, and the meaning of the owl found so often in heiroglyphics and how it relates to our modern day society? I have a little piece of news about BG if it's ever discussed here. For those not familiar with Bohemian grove..here's some good places to learn: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bohemian_Grove photos http://www.jonesreport.com/articles/011206_bohemian.html -
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do you still believe god's name is "Jehovah"?
by winnower insorry this is in red.
i do not see a way to change it to black.
this is excerpt from web page by fellow poster here at jwd.
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winnower
So, is Jehovah "His" name?
It would seem that Watchtower is backing out of this statement also.
This is from the Watchtower Publication "The Divine Name that will Endure Forever" (1984). Page 20
"The word Jehovah does not accurately represent any form of the Name ever used in Hebrew".
Isn't ACCURACY one of the things they stress and claim to have?
Do you remember when you used "The Name" as your calling card in door-to-door work?
"Hey! Do you know God has a name?" (incidentally, how many of you are here because of that opening line grabbing your attention?
Were you aware of the admissions of inaccuracy by the tower when you advertised the name jehovah for the organization?
Did any of you feel that this was a retraction of what you had been previously taught? This is only one of several admissions of "vagueness" about the name. Do you feel deceived about this?
Do you realize that even though they are admitting it's "not exactly true that the Tower still continues to capitalize on it as a Truth? How do you feel about that?
just an excerpt: (sorry it goes red. I don't know how to change this)
Dr. J. B. Rotherham states in the preface of his Bible concerning Jehovah: "Erroneously written and pronounced Jehovah, which is merely a combination of the sacred Tetragrammon and the vowels in the Hebrew word for Lord, substituted by the Jews for JHVH, because they shrank from pronouncing The Name, owing to an old misconception of the two passages, Ex. 20:7 and Lev. 24:16...To give the name JHVH the vowels of the word for Lord [Heb. Adonai], is about as hybrid a combination as it would be to spell the name Germany with the vowels in the name Portugal - viz., Gormuna. The monstrous combination Jehovah is not older than about 1520 A.D." The Encyclopedia Britannica (Micropedia, vol. 10) says: "The Masoretes, Jewish biblical scholars of the Middle Ages, replaced the vowel signs that had appeared above or beneath the consonants of YHWH with the vowel signs of Adonai or of Elohim. Thus the artificial name Jehovah (YeHoWaH) came into being. Although Christian scholars after the Renaissance and Reformation periods used the term Jehovah for YHWH, in the 19th and 20th centuries biblical scholars again began to use the form Yahweh, thus this pronunciation of the Tetragrammon was never really lost. Greek transcriptions also indicate that YHWH should be pronounced Yahweh."
They view 'Yahweh' as the only correct way to spell and pronounce the divine name. They are completely ignoring the fact that the English letter 'w'--used in the name Yahweh--was invented two hundred years later than the first symbol for 'j'. In addition, the letters 'a' and 'h' were not invented until the 1500's. Thus the same argument that they use against the name Jehovah could be used even more strongly against 'Yahweh.' The spelling 'Yahweh' was impossible before 1500! This same argument could be used against 'yahshua' as well. Since lowercase 's' was not invented until the 1500's, and lowercase 'u' did not come into regular use as a vowel until the 1500's, the spelling 'yahshua' was also impossible before that time. The truth of the matter is that the invention of the letters of the English alphabet neither proves nor disproves the pronunciation of the Hebrew name (YHWH). Although some of the letters in the English alphabet were invented in later centuries, the sounds that they represent existed from the earliest times. Only the symbols used to represent the sounds changed. "The name Jehovah occurs a few times in the KJV Bible. But according to Harper's Bible Dictionary, this name is 'the result of the translators' ignorance of the Hebrew language and customs' (1985, p1036). The book of World Religions from Ancient History says 'The name Jehovah is a medieval misreading and does not occur in the Hebrew Bible' (p.386)." -
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A Question For Christians..what would you do if........
by chrisjoel ingiven the chance, if we made contact with an extraterrestial life form that came to dwell among us for even a short period of time, would you preach the gospel of jesus to it with a view to possibly baptizing the "alien" into christianity?
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winnower
The very nature of your question shows the JW mindset. Why would you assume such a superior position that the alien needs you to teach it something? I find one of the biggest problems with JWs is that they have mouths and no ears. Perhaps the wisest move upon any such encounter would be to see if the alien has something of importance to tell you. Determine if it might be a intellectual life form before you adopt that Jw smug know-it-all I'm-special attitude. One of my pet peeves with Jws was always that they wanted to tell you what they wanted you to know instead of listening to see what questions or true concerns others might have. Even though door-to door opens with a question, it often turns quickly to a one-way conversation. I always saw ineffective communication skills with most Jws. They are like robots. Even today that's why you cannot carry on a progressive conversation with most of them. It's as though they are only programmed to respond with certain set answers. It's rather like questioning an 8 ball. Any JW on this earth is going to give you one of the same 15 memorized answers. (whether it makes any sense or not. Usually NOT.)
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when the other shoe drops.....
by winnower inso the rumor mill threw you a bone to chew on and now you assume the society is crumbling.
in true tower fashion, they have once again only allowed you to know a half truth.
in the next few months you will see the society's stronghold on your loved ones become stronger than it has ever been.
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winnower
I said there will be a CATALYST EVENT in May that will cause all this to happen. And even though you have twisted my words...all of that information was intended as background clarification for the real intention of my post, which is the change of teachings that will be coming from the Society. To back up and clarify for you, "catalyst" is something that sets other things in motion. If you think back to the tsunami of Dec. 2004, an undersea earthquake errupted. Like a domino effect, it took a period of time for the silent tsunami to show itself. It was several hours before the world knew what had happened. And those that witnessed the tsunami only knew it at that instant when it was upon them. It came sudden and with surprise! The scriptures tell us that Babylon will be destroyed in an hour. Of course Watchtower says it has already happened...but it should be obvious to anyone with common sense and a little discernment that it is still a future event. Babylon is still in full swing and will not be completely destroyed until the return of Jesus. This catalyst event is the beginning of this "last hour". It will set a chain of events in motion. It could be like the undersea earthquake ( I am using an analogy here...I am not predicting a literal earthquake and don't want people twisting my words again) and will take a few "hours" until you see the domino effect. OR it could be the tsunami right on top of you that you did not see coming. "If a day is like a thousand years", then an hour would be.......(where's OBVES when you need him?) Anyway, I am sure this "last hour" is not a literal "hour" as applied to our time values of sixty minutes. I am using this word metaphorically, in case there are readers who are inclined to twist my words on this. The tsunami itself was a catalyst event for further repercussions. This domino effect not only caused tragic death and destruction, but also, those areas affected continued to suffer the slow destruction of the natural resources....contamination of the soil and gradual death of vegetation in the area long after the tsunami swept ashore. A catalyst event can have far reaching consequences and may exact great changes in lifestyle, landscape, and spiritual philosophies. As far as the result of the current "catalyst event" at hand, the exact words given to me were "All hands will drop". This indicates to me a great economic crisis. Businesses will fold up and employment opportunities will be dry, dry, dry. If hands are not busy, that indicates NO WORK. I should like to turn attention to the main purpose of my post now. The focus should be on the changes coming about with the Society's teachings during this time. In a time of chaos, their focus will shift away from the reality of what is at hand, to something fantasy and escapist. Isn't this in keeping with what they have always done? (when times were good, they advertised coming doom; in the midst of doom they will advertise the "paradise and promised land") Also, by not acknowledging the chaotic plight at hand, there will be no help or solutions forthcoming. Only more fairy tales to distract you from the reality and lead you "onwards to paradise". It will be rather akin to telling a person on deathbed with pneumonia.."oh, it's just a little cold. Have some chicken soup." Just as you were taught that the best way to help the poor, starving, and unclothed was to hand them a magazine, so The Tower will do unto its slaves in their greatest time of trouble. In their hour of need, The JWs will receive nothing more than new spiritual fantasy food...like a plastic fruit arrangement...it will look appealing, it will even deceive some, but in actuality, it can never "nourish" anyone. Once more, the food is not real. There is NO paradise coming. This new flurry of literature on bringing in the paradise is just to keep the masses calm. When people are frightened, they are more vunerable. Since they (JWs) are not used to thinking for themselves, they will look to their leaders to tell them what to think now that this "doom" is upon them. "What next? What now?" they will ask. And the Society will feed them the next mental trip. Another "mind game". ...What? You have no food at home? How can you think of such trivial things when the KINGDOM IS SOOOOO CLOSE. Why, there will be a chicken in every pot soon enough. What have you done for the kingdom today? The Society is gradually becoming reconciled with aspects of worldly christendom. This is another of my points. They will begin to gently usher their captives into the oneness movement. This will take a period of a couple of years to accomplish. They begin by "accentuating the positive"....bringing out the similarities. At the same time, christiandom has been going through some transformations as well. This is given in more detail in the above post. In my previous post I mentioned the "Marriage Feast". My bad. It will probably be referred to as the Wedding Supper. (Marriage Feast is after the wedding.) There will be upcoming articles on "Sharing the Table". The underlying focus will be on the union of all religions. As far as the rumors about "changes in disfellowshipping" ... the only thing I know is this. Although many religions have used different reasons for baptism...."remission of sins" "to receive the holy spirit" "to publically acknowledge Jesus" "to be born again as a new person" "to become a church member".....all of these reasons are now going through a unifying change in all denominations. It is now being said that Baptism is a SEALING. A Baptism cannot be undone. Many churches now will not re-Baptise unless your Baptism was as an infant or if your baptism has been declared "invalid". When changing from one faith to another, many denominations now have done away with the practice of re-baptising into a new faith. Many are now conducting some sort of confirmation ritual instead. (Annointing your head with oil; or asking a person to give a public declaration of faith, etc.) Because you have been "Sealed into the Kingdom" you have been "marked" with this seal of baptism. For the christians, they are being told they have been "sealed into the family of god". (just a slight distinction of words here.) The reason for this is because the words "seal" and "mark" will be used interchangeably. WHY? Because when the chip implants become the current reality, these people will be told the chip implant is not "mark of the beast" and besides, you have already received your "mark" for the kingdom through your baptism. They will tell you that taking the chip implant does not mean anything. (It is just another part of this Great Deception that will soon be taking place over the next couple of years.) When the Society begins to speak of this sealing, and the fact that those who are DA and DF are still sealed for the kingdom but will loose out if not repentant, that will be the catalyst for the "bring back the lost sheep" campaign. You may receive "special literature" or maybe even a personal letter from active JWs you haven't heard from in a while. As I said before, the ultimate reason for this is so there can be complete detatchment from you later without any second thoughts. This is to assuage all guilt from relatives and friends by "having tried" to get through to you. My words are to the Overcomers.
Here's another tidbit....and I am just wondering how many of you know this? I don't want to be dredging up old news and bore anyone. excerpt: Roads and bridges built by U.S. taxpayers are starting to be sold off, and so far foreign-owned companies are doing the buying.