I believe the internet is THE BIGGEST THREAT EVER to the WT Society. In previous years, if a witness had doubts or questions, where could he go for more information? The local library, a local priest, a fellow witness? But now anyone can find information and answers with complete privacy and without leaving the house.
I think what will provide the starting point for most witnesses will be sites like Wikipedia, where they can research without the "apostate" label over what they're viewing. These sites I believe will become a huge prevention to the baptism of new ones, and also will open the way to more internal questioning among the congregation.
Just as a side point, has there been a graph made outlining any increase in JW's leaving since the advent of the internet?
hotchocolate
JoinedPosts by hotchocolate
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48
The Future of the Watchtower Society and the Internet
by DT init seems that the watchtower society was very ill prepared for the advent of the internet.
perhaps, some of the governing body thought the end would come before it became a big problem.
now it is a big problem and is only going to get worse.
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hotchocolate
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23
What proof is there of evolution?
by hotchocolate inbeing raised a witness, throughout my life i've always switched off when i heard an argument for evolution.
so i know almost nothing about the subject, except what i was taught in the "evolution vs creation" book, and i'm guessing that wasn't entirely impartial.
i think of the arguments put forth by witnesses about the amazing design in nature, thereby proving a creator.
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hotchocolate
Thanks for those tips, and links.
I'm not quite ready to start reading books on the subject, I have a pile of reading material in regard to coping with my current situation (the upheaval of my life!) which is higher on my priority list right now.
So in asking this on JWD, I'm actually being a little lazy. :-)
I'm hoping there's others that have spent time researching this and might throw me some interesting thoughts on the subject.
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23
What proof is there of evolution?
by hotchocolate inbeing raised a witness, throughout my life i've always switched off when i heard an argument for evolution.
so i know almost nothing about the subject, except what i was taught in the "evolution vs creation" book, and i'm guessing that wasn't entirely impartial.
i think of the arguments put forth by witnesses about the amazing design in nature, thereby proving a creator.
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hotchocolate
Being raised a witness, throughout my life I've always switched off when I heard an argument for evolution. So I know almost nothing about the subject, except what I was taught in the "Evolution vs Creation" book, and I'm guessing that wasn't entirely impartial. ;-)
I think of the arguments put forth by witnesses about the amazing design in nature, thereby proving a creator. Actually, these arguments seemed to push me further toward evolution - from a very young age I felt that if the creaTION was so impressive, how much more so would the creaTOR be impressive. And yet He didn't need a designer but these things did? I know it simplifies the argument, but this childhood logic still seems hard to deny.
SO. I'm after a crash course in evolution, JWD style!
What can you tell me that could convince me there is truth in evolution?
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49
Did You Consider Yourself a "Good Witness"?
by minimus inwere you considered by others as "the cream of the crop"?
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did you view yourself as a pillar in the congregation or were you "spiritually weak"?.
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hotchocolate
Third generation witness, I've kept out of trouble, regular pioneered for years, always done heaps of Bible study, answer three times at every meeting. Over the years I seem to attract witnesses asking me for advice spiritually, and a couple of younger girls have told me that I was their spiritual mentor.. eek.
At the same time though, I love a good time, so when I was pioneering every six months the elders would drop in to let me know that the last party was too loud, or that someone had reported something about me that they didn't like, usually my skirt being too tight or something like that (the downfall of having a hotter body than most of the sisters *sigh* ;-) LOL)
I know that any move to leave on my part will be a pretty big deal, not least because of the fact that I'm one of the primary social organisers around here.. haha who's going to arrange all those loud parties when I'm gone?
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49
Did You Consider Yourself a "Good Witness"?
by minimus inwere you considered by others as "the cream of the crop"?
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did you view yourself as a pillar in the congregation or were you "spiritually weak"?.
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hotchocolate
Oldseeker, that WT point sounded interesting, I missed that - will go and check it out..
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Memorial conundrum - "So good to see you. Where have you been?"
by Meeting Junkie No More inok, gearing up for the memorial - our annual have to attend.
this is the first year that we will be showing up without having been to meetings in months.
on the last meeting i was cajoled into attending, i was bombarded with the above question.
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hotchocolate
Walk into the hall with a huge saccharine smile.. And when someone says, "So good to see you, where have you been?", smile warmly, lean in, and give them a condescending rub on the arm, and say, "Oh thank you sister! Wonderful to see you too!" and then enquire, "So how's Bill? Still cleaning windows?" and shake your head while tsk'ing sympathetically during the reply.
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75
Why Guess About Dates At All?
by Pickled ini posted this on another thread and realized that it was really off topic, so i made it a separate topic because i would really like to read your thoughts about this... .
does anyone know if any reasons are given by the wtbts about why they feel it is such an important part of their teachings to keep guessing about dates and the years things are going to happen?
it seems that it adds nothing to whatever they believe about the bible, and it has only served to create such confusion among their members over the years.
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hotchocolate
Hi Pickled! Your posts are really awesome, beautifully expressed and insightful. You have some great reasoning, I love it. :-)
So, yeah, why WOULD they guess about dates at all? This question is one that has run through my head a lot, and in many ways I think it is the biggest clue to a major failing of the FDS. I was thinking about the Professor you mentioned, who could never admit "I don't know". It's easy to see that he had a problem with pride. And this is the scary bit. The more WT quotes I read on these predictions, the greater the impression that there is a pride issue. To claim direct understanding from God is a pretty big call. Personally, if I was making this claim and asking my followers for complete submission, I would want to be sure that I had it right. There is a link between making these claims and pride, as this scripture shows:
"Do not go beyond the things that are written, in order that you may not get puffed up individually in favor of the one against the other. For who makes you to differ from another?" - 1 Cor 4:6-7
I've also noticed is when an understanding or prediction is reversed, it always seems to;
1. Be written in third person:
WT 95 Nov 1 - "Eager to see the end of this evil system, Jehovah's people have at times speculated about the time when the "great tribulation" would break out, even tying this to calculations of what is the lifetime of a generation since 1914."
or 2. Pass blame:
WT 76 - "But it is not advisable for us to set our sights on a certain date, neglecting everyday things we would ordinarily care for as Christians, such as things that we and our families really need. We may be forgetting that, when the "day" comes, it will not change the principle that Christians must at all times take care of all their responsibilities. If anyone has been disappointed through not following this line of thought, he should now concentrate on adjusting his viewpoint, seeing that it was not the word of God that failed or deceived him and brought disappointment, but that his own understanding was based on wrong premises."
Which only confirms the pride issue in my humble opinion.
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Does anyone know? Question about early JW beliefs.
by hotchocolate inhelloooo people .
i was under the impression that the witnesses didn't have any belief in an earthly class until 1935-ish.. and yet in 1925 (?
) they built beth sarim in san diego to house the faithful men of old when they returned to earth.
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hotchocolate
Hi White Dove, thanks. Yes, despite well-intentioned advice from my elders to "just stop thinking too much" I'm still researching like crazy.
And I'm actually starting to feel good about my discoveries. xx -
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Alternative Service Banned - Cite?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inas most of us know, alternative civilian service (e.g., working in a hospital) as a substitute for compulsory military service was banned by the society until 1996. my understanding is that this ban was instituted in the 1940s.
does anyone have a cite to a watchtower article or other publication that explains the basis for this position?
in my research, i have found several of wt articles and yearbook experiences that mention that jws consciences won't allow them to perform anything that is a "substitute" for military service.
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hotchocolate
Oh sorry.. FIRST printed I don't have. x
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Alternative Service Banned - Cite?
by Olin Moyles Ghost inas most of us know, alternative civilian service (e.g., working in a hospital) as a substitute for compulsory military service was banned by the society until 1996. my understanding is that this ban was instituted in the 1940s.
does anyone have a cite to a watchtower article or other publication that explains the basis for this position?
in my research, i have found several of wt articles and yearbook experiences that mention that jws consciences won't allow them to perform anything that is a "substitute" for military service.
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hotchocolate
Hey, any of these any good? x
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uwchap.21p.167par.14"TheyAreNoPartoftheWorld"***14
An examination of the historical facts shows that not only have Jehovah’s Witnesses refused to put on military uniforms and take up arms but, during the past half century and more, they have also declined to do noncombatant service or to accept other work assignments as a substitute for military service. Why? Because they have studied God’s requirements and then made a personal, conscientious decision. No one tells them what they must do. Nor do they interfere with what others choose to do. But when called on to explain their position, Jehovah’s Witnesses have made it known that, as persons who have presented themselves to God in dedication, they are obligated to use their bodies in his service and cannot now hand these over to earthly masters who are acting contrary to God’s purpose.—Rom. 6:12-14; 12:1, 2; Mic. 4:3.
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w869/1p.20par.16ChristianNeutralsinaBloodstainedWorld***16
These Christians continued to pay back Caesar’s things to Caesar. They obeyed the laws of the land as upright citizens. (Matthew 22:17-21; Romans 13:1-7) But more importantly, they paid back to God the things that belonged to him, including their dedicated lives and Christian worship. Hence, when Caesar demanded to have God’s things, they acted in harmony with the principles stated at Acts 4:19 and 5:29. Whether the issue was shedding blood, noncombatant military work, alternative service, or saluting an image such as a national flag, faithful Christians took the position that there was no middle ground. In some cases they were executed because of this stand.—Matthew 24:9; Revelation 2:10.