Posts by wobble

6

How many?...

by tenyearsafter in

i couldn't find if this has been discussed in the past, but do we have any idea how many former posters/apostates from this forum have actually returned to the jw's?

i am not talking about those that were reinstated for family reasons, but rather, those that actually had a change of heart and "repented" to become active jw's again?

i can't imagine it is many, but would be curious if anyone knows individuals that have gone back because they truly believed again?

wobble

I do not understand how anybody could go back, or stay in, and feel they were an honest person if they had examined the religion in any way.

How can you support a shedload of lies, and have any personal integrity? Now I know that many stay "for family reasons", and I am not having a go at you guys, do whatever it takes and what you think best. You are engaged in under-cover work of the finest order.

But for a person who is not trapped in a Catch22 situation, knows TTATT , and stays or goes back, they must be some kind of weirdo masochist with no integrity.

1

Cal for cult-related papers, music, etc. for "The Phoenix Project"

by Dogpatch in

jw
friends

call for work.

the phoenix project, an exhibit of art and literary works that have been created by former cult members, seeks art, musical, and literary submissions for the annual conference of the international cultic studies association, to be held in montreal, july 5 -7, 2012. .

if you are a former member of a cult or high demand organization, we invite you to participate in this upcoming exhibit to present art, musical, and literary (english or french) work related to your experiences while in your group or during your recovery.. if you have not yet created your work, but have had some ideas, now might be the time to bring those ideas to fruition, if you would like to bring to light the realities of your group experience for others to see.. creations may be in any art form, including but not limited to: literary (such as poetry, drama, short story, or other writings), music of any kind, dance, and the visualarts (such as paintings, drawings, collage, sculpture, fiber arts, photography, film, video, or multi-media).. if desired, your work may be presented anonymously, or through another presenter.. this exhibit will shed light on the nature of cult and high demand organizations and their effects on individuals.

wobble

bttt

29

How important is or will be the WWC case? too good to be true?

by Aussie Oz in

how important is it now and how important will it be?.

i think of some of the cases in history that the wt has fought.... the 40s and 50s were spent defending the right to preach.

ok pretty important gains for everyone in freedom of speech etc.

wobble

Dear Vidqun,

Whilst agreeing with A.Oz above, I would like to say, A BIG WELCOME !

And if you are inclined, post your story, introduce yourself to us !

87

Spong: "Why We Must Reclaim The Bible From Fundamentalists"

by leavingwt in

jw
friends

john shelby spong, the retired american bishop, has written a new book.

his article, below, briefly explains the purpose of his new book.

why we must reclaim the bible from fundamentalists.

wobble

soft+gentle said "........ that Christ is found in interstitial spaces everywhere. And this is where what we say is divine meets us."

If that is Spong's conclusion then he is not a million miles away from many of the thinkers of the past, and present, not that many of them would identify the divine with the possibly fictitious Jesus of Nazareth . (fictitous as far as what we have that is written about him, he may well have existed).

The Jewish philosophers called this divine force "En Sof" or similar, and many eastern philosophies have a similar concept, again of course , even such a "god" is not supported by testable evidence.

6

"Mentally Diseased" And Political Correctness

by Bangalore in

"mentally diseased" and political correctness.. http://www.tomsheepandgoats.com/2011/10/mentally-diseased-and-political-correctness.html.

an article by a jw apologist regarding the recent controversy about the "mentally diseased" issue.. .

bangalore.

wobble

Sizemik is spot on about the clouding the issue with the usual methods of arguing about the meaning of words, I laugh though at the result, after all of "Tom's " hot air a couple of others have a go at the meaning of the Gk. word and come to the consensus that it means "mentally defective" !!!

Is it any better to call someone who simply feels your beliefs are wrong "mentally defective" than "mentally diseased" ????

They shot themselves in the foot there.

And of course the point is, not that the words were in parenthesis in the article, as Tom says, it is that they are said about "Apostates", i.e any who disagree with the WT interpretation as it stands this week (it may change 180 degrees next week, and you may not be Apostate then).

They feel free to insult who they like, and cast aspersions on people's mental health or ability, and think they will get away with it, not if we have anything to do with it.

66

Oct. 22nd Zone Meeting: Here's some facts and figures presented to ticketed-only audiences

by AndersonsInfo in

jw
friends

if we weren't invited, this is the "bragging" information we missed last saturday, oct. 22, 2011, at the zone meeting with tie-in from patterson, ny .

59 locations tied-in plus spanish.

anticipating 258,000 attendance from tickets given out.

wobble

According to some people, size isn't everything !

39

Is The WTBTS' View Of Homosexuality Softening?

by JW GoneBad in

or at least the public may be given the impression that jws and the wtbts are fair minded and do not discriminate against the homosexual lifestyle.

check out this quote from the nov 1, 2011 watchtower (public edition).

the article on page 4 is entitled 'ten questions about sex answered'.. question 8: does god approve of homosexuality?.

wobble

Hopefully, if any JW's actually read the Public edition, it will make them even more aware of how the WT lies,by telling half truths, or with holding the truth.

I know I was aware of this when I was "in", and I swallowed the line that peoples faith had to be built up before they learned all the WT secrets, faith in the Organization of course.

They don't know how to love or be compassionate towards any who are not JW, and are extremely hard hearted towards any with an alternative lifestyle or sexuality.

They just wont show any of that attitude in the Public WT, how deceitful, even the Westboro' Baptist Church are open about their evil beliefs.

87

Spong: "Why We Must Reclaim The Bible From Fundamentalists"

by leavingwt in

jw
friends

john shelby spong, the retired american bishop, has written a new book.

his article, below, briefly explains the purpose of his new book.

why we must reclaim the bible from fundamentalists.

wobble

If you get in a Cab in London and say "follow that car!" you will get a slow turn round of the driver's head, follwed by "Wot car?" by which time the quarry is half way across the city, but if you just want to say it , be careful you could get the smartass Cabbie who hares off after any old car and runs you up a huge bill.

Anyway, I double dare ya to try it !

As for Spong I agree, but he is readable in a way, although I see the same faults with his logic, as to the basic concept of the thread title, it would be good if the Bible were taken away from all believers from the point of view of it being somehow true, and it became what it really is, a somewhat curious but nevertheless fascinating collection of literature, because it is nothing more than that.

42

How did you do it?

by GeneM in

wobble

I was born in, stayed in for 58 years, then just stopped going, not DA'd or DF'd, just viewed as inactive but dangerous to talk to, I could ruin their faith apparently, so easily.

I had intended to fade gradually, go to one or two meetings, but in the end I just could not face going back for even one more Meeting.

They didn't bother about us much, I got a visit from two enforcer Elders, they couldn't hang anything on me, so they left never to return, my wife never got a visit, she too was born in and in for 58 years.

I suppose I should be happy my exit was so simple, others have been harassed and bullied for ages.

79

WT Flip-Flops on Jesus Inspection Was it in 1918 or 1919?... Did the WT PASS or FAIL?

by Alfred in

this is utterly ridiculous.... .

the more i research this particular subject, the more flip-flops i uncover.

it seems the fds cant even make up their minds regarding what happened in 1918 (or should i say 1919?).

wobble

Dear Shades, Yes Indeed, I was born in to the relgion.

So my critical thinking skills were pretty non-existent for all those years, but I could think for myself to a degree, I never swallowed the whole shebang.

I think my comment that you quote above comes over as though I am beliittling those still in, for which I apologise, but it sprang from frustration, I have made so many efforts to wake up my JW family, but the entrapment of their minds by the WT is so complete that it has all been to no avail.

They are programmed to reject any criticism of the WT. and any information that counters what they have been told to believe, so whatever you present is rejected, despite its truth and validity.

How could anyone look with an honest appraisal at what has been presnted on this thread and still say they support the GB and their claims ?

It is that dishonesty and lack of courage from my own family that makes me impatient, and perhaps a little scathing about JW's in general.

But yes, I hold my hands up, for decades I too was a DumbDub.l