i thought i'd start a new thread in response to this one: .
what we owe jehovah's witnesses.
and rephrase the statement into a question: what do jehovah's witnesses owe us?.
JWs maybe nothing, but WTS owes us a lot! Because of wts, many had shitty upbringing, fear of the outside world. Lost opportunities because of being discouraged from going to college/university. Wasted time thinking of fairy tales while GB covered up their past from us.
Personally I would love to see wts get sued for everything they've got and GB and their high end sidekicks get kicked to a curb or get a rotten hole in a ground for a jail cell.
indeed thats just what witnesses are.
everyone hates them.
is there any other group in "christendom "that are hated as much as these.?
Celestial:
Maybe I should have expressed that paragraph differently. I didn't mean that JWs act as leeches on a personal level but rather that watchtower strongly discourages higher education and what it creates is a people with mostly manual skills. You have very few JW kids who actually go and get degrees in something that is useful to the society on a higher level. There is no jw contribution to fields in healthcare, or law and order. You don't see scientists or astronomers nor do you see archaeologists. As a world in general we need various field to build a society stronger and majority of religions don't have a problem having their kids reach for these goals and contribute to the humanity in general as we all greatly benefit from the contribution and accomplishments of others. Thanks to wts, as a JW society on it's own, would not thrive. Lack of knowledge in many essential fields would deteriorate JWs as a group if they were separated from the rest of the population. And in that respect wts creates a society dependent on the rest of the people while contributing nothing in return. In that respect if you needed a doctor, you would have hell of a time finding a JW who could help you and if you did, the chances are high that the JW was a doctor prior to becoming a JW and not after or during. If you're depressed due to chemical imbalance, you would be out of lack, after all what are the chances of a JW being able to create medicine to help you out in that area. I think you get my point now what I meant by the above.
Disfellowshipping arrangement only works if you have two witnesses or a confession (generally speaking). Elders have no knowledge, experience or capabilities to investigate crimes and base their decisions on simplistic ideology. Again, as a isolated society, what are the chances of a criminal getting away with murder in JW world? Very high wouldn't you say? Thanks to the outside world criminals have better chance of being caught than if they were in isolated jw society. There is no contradiction to what I wrote above.
I cannot comment on all the links you included or the specific replies, but the one speaking of a link between disfellowshiping and suicide is valid. Many believing witnesses who get disfellowshipped have hard time adjusting to a life where family and friends shun them. It may take people a long time to get reinstated and many feel overwhelming guilt that they've done something horrible against God that makes them deserving death. While it might be a minority that take their own lives, it's the disfellowshipping arrangement that is responsible for these deaths and not a simple depression. Again, many posts are in general terms and may need to be expounded upon so maybe ask for further explanation.
Again, this is an open, almost unrestricted forum so anything and everything gets posted. Don't take everything so personally just because you feel you as a JW with a loss of spirituality. Many of us have been where you are now and many of us are at different levels of getting over our past. The beauty of an open forum is, you can question whatever, you don't have to agree with everything others say but you have a venue to express yourself in any way you wish and back up what you believe if you desire to do so. You wouldn't get this openness in the kingdom hall. Take away what you want from here and ignore what you feel is nonsense. Identifying yourself as a spiritually weak JW tells me you needs to research more, and not always take everything so personally. We all were there, shit, I was duped and screwed up my youth because of it and trying to get some education at my age isn't something I ever thought I would be doing - especially in this system of things ;) After all when I fell for the carrot I was too young and too stupid to see through the lies and deception since why would I have doubted God's Org. in checking their history and there source references - when I could have simply relied on present publications and the words of trusting JWs. Stupid me!!!
By the way, Morbid Tales is one good album, CF has always been my favorite band except during the wts years. Take care.
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credit goes to anonymous*2012 april kingdom ministry-pdf!
*http://www.sendspace.com/file/o96cfs**atlantis
Another convention advertising campaign three weeks prior to the convention. They sure love to keep jws running in circles. How sad that so many are so busy wasting time they have no time to catch a breath and think for a minute what GB are doing to them and their families.
i regard the information below as true until proven false because of corresponding with a young man in s. africa for a few years whose story i posted on my website: http://www.watchtowerdocuments.com/stories/caleb.html, "freedom from an unsafe haven, by caleb.
" although some of the accounts of abuse of children in s. africa in the story below are older, calab wrote me details of abusive treatment meted out to young people in his area that he chose not to put in his story for fear he could be identified.
calab in now in university in another part of africa and very happy after breaking the chains that engulfed his mind.. barbara.
Horrible but if it's a cultural problem it only shows that jws are greatly affected by their environment while Crooklyn boys look the other way or have no idea how other cultures differ from their plush western lifestyle.
indeed thats just what witnesses are.
everyone hates them.
is there any other group in "christendom "that are hated as much as these.?
Only delusional people think that the whole world is set against them, why? Because watchtower programs people to have guilt and fear or everything around them. When a jw is programmed there is no reasoning with that one. Bible? Who says NWT is the best translation? Who translated it? And what qualifications did they (he) posses?
These programmed ones also too stupid to realize that people dislike the twisted, lying deceptive organization and not general JWs! But if we must speak of these lovely people in general, why is there so many problems with depression, suicide, child abuse and others hidden crimes all within the congregations? Very lovely world they would create, I would propose taking all these people and placing them on the island all on their own and see how long they would survive without everything the hard working society provides for these people who are leeches on the system.
As for preaching and growth. They preach because they are forced to, general witness thinking is that if they don't go door to door they won't make it to the new system so they do it. You remove this BS teaching and the preaching work would come to a halt almost immediately! The fear of dying would be gone and guilt of not working for the big guy would be gone as well, only very few would do it. Preaching work is not genuine! As for growth? That's a funniest and dumbest point witnesses bring forth! LOL 1.7billion hours spend preaching, with 260,000 baptized! Most baptized are born-in who were programmed from childhood which for most part have the most miserable upbringing. That gives you 6,500 hours to get one baptized, if we imagine that half of these were recruited which the number is most likely quite smaller, but with 50% recruits that would mean JWs need to waste 13,000 hours to find a sucker! That is sad! If witnesses were interested in actually reaching the public they would use tv, radio, internet and billboards to spread the message not knocking on empty homes when people are at work. Mormons have better success in reaching people because many times they call on people in the evening, in fact I only have Mormons call on my house in the afternoons when people are home and not when homes are empty! Door to door is an exercise in futility to keep witnesses busy and away from thinking too much on stupid doctrines they believe in.
So instead of coming here and telling us total shit, why don't you get your head out of your ass and do some research into your deceptive cult. Why does wts need to misquote others and show partial information to try to support their beliefs as can be seen in their last articles dealing on Jerusalem's destruction? Why are misquotes used on regular basis by wts articles?
the pressure on children growing up with jehovah's witness connections can make their childhood extremely difficult.. .
http://www.familylawweek.co.uk/site.aspx?i=ed95530children: private law update (february 2012)alex verdan qc reviews the most significant of the latest judgments in private law children applications.. .
alex verdan qc, 4 paper buildings.
The only way he didn't know is if he didn't care enough to want to know more about this girl before getting into her pants, an all to common case of the south-head thinking instead of the northern one.
This is partially true. One thing that many of us think about, while the general public doesn't, is religion. When a non-jw meets a jw who is hiding their beliefs to do their own thing, the non-jw doesn't judge the other on the basis of religion and doesn't even consider a religion to be a problem in today's world - in the western countries. If one meets a mate at a bar (ex.) and they began to date, religion doesn't really come up, since the non-jw partner may do their weekly church ritual, while the jw obviously is hiding their own background due to the fact they're breaking wts' laws in the first place so if this relationship does progress and usually these relationships progress rather quicker than usually because the dub wants a ring on the finger be married to continued with their BS faith. The unsuspecting mate has no clue what s/he is getting themselves into until it's too late.
When people fall in "love" they think they can overcome practically anything, and delude themselves that the other partner will change some of their personality or that they will work on their faults. We as humans delude ourselves all the time, and when it comes to dating a cult member, it is no different. They seem fun and good people when they're outside of their element but once the marriage is a done deal and the jw or other cult member returns to the herd, the problems start to arise that the other member couldn't foresee due to the complexity of the situation.
It's true that sometimes jw/non-jw relations work out, and there are many examples but what are the reasons for these? Is it because one partner is willing to put up with the other's crazy ideas more than otherwise? Is it because the cult member is not strictly following the wts' line on dos and don'ts. Was a jw partner a born-in, a convert or could one be an undercover apostate ? Personally I wouldn't advise a non-jw to date a jw but than again we learned this from our own past that in any future relationships we would ask about our prospective mate's religious beliefs before we would go into a serious relationship while the general public doesn't even think about the possibility of dating a cult member.
i was just wondering what everyone here found the most frustrating to talk to jws about, list as many as you feel..
Why witnesses will trust strangers over their own family members. They accept GB teachings as if coming from god, but if a member researches in detail and chooses not believe GB the majority of families will disown the individuall but will choose the teacings of men whom they've never met, and don't even know how they look like for most part.
okay, so i am new to the site, but i have been following ur threads for awhile now, and i am finding great comfort in them!
no, i am not a witness and i have never been, and never will be!
i did however, date a witness for about three years.. it was our typical 357th biweekly 'man hating' girls night out, and meeting mr. right was the last thing on my mind!
Madge:
The reason he didn't want you around his "friends" is because he wasn't supposed to be with you in the first place and was hiding his actions from other JWs which would have got him disfellowshipped long time before he did.
JWs view outsiders as world, bad association who cause problems for JWs. He didn't witness to you probably because he was ashamed to be with you frm the start thinking that he was breaking God's law in the first place so in his mind he was bringing reproach on God's name which is probably why he kept his religious background hidden from you as long as he did. If the fear and guilt that makes witnesses act as they do. Because there are so many crazy witness beliefs that they we ourselves were ashamed of which is why many times we never gave straight answers to question which is what he seems to do. Witnesses teach all non witnesses will die but that is not what they would tell you at the door when they preach, likewise many other questions they will dance around trying to avoid straight forward answers. Is he reinstated right now?
ps. I use JW in a general sense, not all JWs are total drones, and not all shun and not all would avoid direct answers but IMO majority would.
okay, so i am new to the site, but i have been following ur threads for awhile now, and i am finding great comfort in them!
no, i am not a witness and i have never been, and never will be!
i did however, date a witness for about three years.. it was our typical 357th biweekly 'man hating' girls night out, and meeting mr. right was the last thing on my mind!
Hello,
As long as he believes Watchtower bullshit, you should stay away from him. Get him to research his organization or read Crisis of Conscience if he actually allows himself to do so. Since his family has hard core cult mentality, it boils down to him choosing you and the child or the cult which at this point he will most likely choose the cult. If for some reason he says he won't go back to the watchtower but has not researched the cult you can bet that he will go back down the road since the instilled guilt and fear will eat at him until he returns. Only if the man rids himself of the psychological damage that watchtower caused him, can he be more normal person.
Those with deep instilled fears and guilt are not good mates to live with. They will have intimacy problems, control problems and many other undesirable traits you don't need in a relationship and the relationship will only deteriorate in time.
So many people have been hurt by the cult or by having relations with someone attached to the cult. Wish you all the best.
mentally replace the word 'spirit' with 'magic'.
14 jehovah has equipped us to resist the spirit.
of the world.
"Holy spirit is even stronger"
What is this based on? Did the spirit work out so it's stronger today than last year? Did Jehovah get more spirit now so that there is more of it? Will it be even stronger tomorrow? Should we wait til it's so strong it can't contain itself. LOL HS stronger, good one. :)
