Unless otherwise indicated the Word should probably be identified as Jesus. Even indirectly it when God is said to speak it can be understood to represent Jesus. For instance the Genesis 1 creation account has God speaking and through his word bringing things into existence. NT Christians understood this to apply to Jesus. There is pre-Christian basis for this as in the OT the Word of God is personified.
donuthole
JoinedPosts by donuthole
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When the NT references the "word of God" what is it referring to?
by WalkTall inthe nt references the 'word of god' in a number of places.
(for example: hebrews 4:12-the word of god is alive and exerts power and is sharper than a two-edged sword).
it can't be referring to the ot and the mosaic law because those authors writing after jesus's death were trying to put away the old law traditions, and it can't be referring to any of the nt books because many were not even written yet or known to be scripture per se.
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Were you told by JC that God will no longer listen to your prayers?
by Hortenzie ini was df-ed 3 years ago.
during the process nothing extraordinary happened.
everything proceeded as if according to a script.
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donuthole
Having researched this in the 2008 CD-ROM I can find no outright statement that disfellowshipped ones do not have the privilege of prayer. I do not see such in the elders book either. Yet this is a common statement made during Judicial proceedings. Here is what the WT teaches
- Jehovah hears the prayers of his "faithful servants", his "friends", and the "righteous", in other words Jehovah's Witnesses.
- Only baptized servants have an "unrestricted" privilege of prayer (He hears the prayers of those progressing toward baptism to a point but they can lose this if they hold off baptism.)
- JW are specifically instructed to avoid the prayers of non-JW's, to say silent prayers when in the presence of a non-JW who is praying.
- When the Watchtower gives experiences of prayers that are answered it is mainly in the context of JW's prayers, the exception is when non-JW's with "honest hearts" pray to find the true religion and subsequently come into the Organization.
- While not specifically speaking of disfellowshipped ones, the Watchtower encourages repentant sinners to pray, again leading back into the Organization.
- JW's are given permission to pray for DF'd ones only to the extent they are giving evidence of repentance.
Putting all of this together you come to a scenario where Jehovah doesn't hear the prayers of disfellowshipped ones because -
- They are no longer Jehovah's Witnesses (Being outside the organization they lose their righteous standing)
- At the time of their DF-ing they are considered unrepentant sinners and wicked
Though I find no direct statement yet the thought is present in the literature.
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Were you told by JC that God will no longer listen to your prayers?
by Hortenzie ini was df-ed 3 years ago.
during the process nothing extraordinary happened.
everything proceeded as if according to a script.
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donuthole
Yes I was told this and know of others who have experienced this as well. I have been researching the background of this for an article I'm writing. Technically the Watchtower teaches that Jehovah only hears the prayers of Jehovah's Witnesses, those who have relative righteousness by association with the slave class. Once you are "no longer one of Jehovah's Witnesses" you no longer have the privilege of prayer since God does not hear the prayers of the wicked but only the righteous.
I would be interested if some elders could weigh in on this. It is common enough but as we know there is often some variation between elders and how they deal with things.
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What is the Biblical Support for Observers at the Memorial ???
by RubaDub ini have never gotten a good answer for this questions from any other jw's other than "everyone was of the annointed back in the first century" or "we are showing our respect for the arrangement" or some other nondescript comment.. even the notion that we "celebrate" the memorial is not accurate since the "celebration" part is limited to 8 or 9 thousand people and the 15 million or so that attend are merely observing or watching.. is there some other biblical support for people to observe the celebration ???
in all my life as a jw, i still don't quite understand the significance of it from a biblical persective.. rub a dub .
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donuthole
Nobody is worthy but it is offered and is rude to reject this gift.
Consider this - according to Luke's gospel Jesus presented the symbols of his body and blood to none other than Judas. Yes the very guy that was getting ready to betray him.
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where can i find solid evidence of the UN connection?
by highdose ini want to be able to use this unknown fact about the wtbs with jw's of my aquintence, but they are going to want to see somthing to back that up before they belive it.
can anyone help please?.
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donuthole
The best source is probably straight from the United Nations --
http://www.un.org/dpi/ngosection/pdfs/watchtower.pdf
-- of course even this isn't enough for most JW's. Good luck.
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THE FINAL VERDICT IS DELIVERED!!!
by Hobo Ken inthis is the final of my series of podcasts in which the 3 circuit overseers decide my fate as a jehovah's witness.. my blog- deathorobedience.blogspot.com.
podcast 12 the final verdict- play the audio.
also available free on itunes (just search on itunes).. .
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donuthole
Having gone through this sort of thing myself, I can say that the elders are more interested in getting you to make self-condemning statements against the FDS/Org than offering any real help for you to see the error of your ways. That was the thrust of my JC where the elders tersely demanded that I answer certain questions and they angrily silenced another elder that was moderately attempting to reason with me. The pretty much mirror the religious leaders of Jesus' day that kept trying to get him to make self-condeming statements and were furious when he met them with silence. The same spirits are at work today.
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Funerals and Disfellowshipped Individuals
by lepermessiah innot to "hijack" dogpatch's recent thread, but the experience he relayed in the above topic struck a nerve and i was curious for more input.. http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/188715/1/my-aunts-funeral-at-the-kingdom-hall.
if there is ever a time when a shred of human dignity and compassion is deserved, it is at a funeral.. i am appalled by the way disfellowshipped individuals are treated, but especially at witness funerals.. the flesh and blood relatives have the right to be there if they choose.
if you are a witness and you are offended by a disfellowshipped person attending, dont let the door hit you in the @$$ on the way out.
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donuthole
This is tragically common - I recently had an aunt pass away. Her disfellowshipped son was forced to deal with his grief alone; while he was allowed to attend the funeral, he was not permitted to attend the luncheon afterward.
I questioned my JW dad about this - I remarked how Witness funerals were used as occasions to share their resurrection hope with non-JW's. I asked him what would make the biggest impression on an outsider that day, the funeral talk or the fact that the son of the deceased was harshly shunned and not permitted to share in the funeral activities. I know that other non-Witness family members were absolutely apalled by this treatment.
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WTF! Only JWs have a RIGHT to pray?
by Mythbuster in*** w90 5/15 pp.
11-12 fear jehovah, the hearer of prayer ***.
a restricted privilege.
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donuthole
I was specifically told during my judicial appeal meeting that I should try to return to the Organization as soon as possible so I could have the privilege of praying again.
I can't stress what a disgusting lie this is. No man has the right or authority to stand between a person and their Heavenly Father and tell them they do have access to him. To do so is to treat Jesus Christ with gross disrepect. They thus say that the only way a person can come to their Father is through them, and their organization, not through Jesus Christ.
At the time I knew this was an evil lie and could reject it as such; sadly, I have met others who believed this. They have been cut off from the congregation due to moral failings and believe they are consequantly cut off from Almighty God as well.
I believe there are serious consequences to the religious leaders that promote this lie just as Jesus heaped scorn on those of his day that "shut up the Kingdom of the Heavens."
Also per the WT info Blondie posted -
In the final analysis, it is not for humans to decide which prayers God hears. If a Christian on occasion made an utterance to God and overlooked using such an expression as "in Jesus’ name," there would be no need for him to burden himself with guilt. Jehovah is fully aware of our limitations and wants to help us. (Psalm 103:12-14)
This article tips the hand that the Watchtower religion, and Jehovah's Witnesses by extention, have no idea what it really means to pray "in Jesus' name" limiting it to some mere formulistic expression, dare I say secret password, tacked on to the end of a prayer to have your prayer heard by the Father. Sadly, if it wasn't for that custom Jesus would rarely be mentioned in a JW prayers at all.
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John 9:38 in NWT renders it as formerly blind man "did obeisance" to Jesus. Other translations state he,"worshiped Jesus". Who's right?
by miseryloveselders inthis is the story regarding the man blind from birth, whom jesus healed.
the verses in question go in context, ............... .
(john 9:35-41)35 jesus heard that they had thrown him out, and, on finding him, he said: are you putting faith in the son of man?
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donuthole
Similar to what is said above, at Rev 22:8 an angel forbids John from rendering him obeisance/worship stating that he is a fellow servant.
So in the New Testament Peter forbids receiving obeisance/worship stating that he is simply a man, an angel forbids receiving obeisance/worship stating that he is simply a servant, yet Jesus readily receives obeisance/worship without rebuke from the man born blind.
Evidently (to use JW lingo) the honor that Jesus receives is greater than man or angel.
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New video exposes the flat-earth cover-up
by Shepherd Book inmade this a while ago...just got around to posting it:.
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flattened.
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donuthole
Good parody and impersonation!
LOL @ Flatearthers ... reminds me of people that believe life on earth was intelligently designed by advanced space aliens that came to exist through Darwinian evolution.