so i have a friend in a congregation in new jersey who recently called me to tell me that he got a divorce.
nothing surprising there at first but it is the fact of when it happened.
his wife began pioneering april 1, and after about three weeks she came to him and told him that about 4 years she had engaged in loose conduct (fondling the penis and the guy kissing her breasts) during a time that she was inactive.
That's not a valid ground for "scriptural divorce" by any stretch of the most insane imagination. There is no way this is valid by JW standards, absolutely NO WAY. Those elders have gone native, and way, WAY off the reservation. I can only think they must've really hated her for some other reason.
--sd-7
i mentioned i was cleaning the forum archive when i bumped this thread by oompa:.
damm i miss jwd...this place will always be jwd to me.... rather than turn that into a discussion of the archive, i'll answer slimboyfat's concern here.. the things i'm clearing up are either:.
time specific and non jw related (e.g.
Guess I better make sure I save the Beast-Tower Library Index, then! There's a lot of fine instruction I'd hate to lose forever!
--sd-7
the drama continues, i log on to facebook this morning and notice that i have about 20 some odd personal messages from people calling me an apostate to they will return to me when i return to jehovah.. all of this based upon my brother informing others that i have "apostate thoughts".
my mother also encourage long-time famil friends to "unfriend" me because i have taken my stand on the side of satan... wow.
don't you just love this international brotherhood.
If it wasn't clear before, it's clear now--it's the one thing I understood BEFORE I decided to start researching the JWs. I told myself, "This is a one-way trip. If it turns out it's all a lie, no one will ever believe you. You will lose everyone you have ever known. Are you prepared to do that?" Once I learned all that I could, I realized that I simply didn't want friends who were willing to obey this sort of teaching without question. I shut myself down and distanced myself from everyone... ...Almost everyone. And the one person I cared about most was my greatest downfall in the end. I learned to turn off those feelings as much as possible from then on.
There is no limit to how far they will go to turn against you once they know you've got major doubts. As has been said, you may as well take the initiative to cut them all off yourself, delete all of their messages, unfriend them, etc., and be done with them. Because they are done with you. It's a matter of sanity, in my opinion, to be able to do this. (Then again, the guy who married into the cult knowingly probably ain't in any position to be giving you advice. See to your own house, sd-7!)
It's war, from the second they found out about you, and there are no rules in war, only people getting hurt. Tear every feeling for them out of your heart, or it will make you vulnerable. They can use their bond with you as emotional blackmail in the long term, and that would be torture. Don't give them a chance to do that.
--sd-7
as i continue to post these letters just to let people see what they can expect through a fade, i hope they are not annoying anyone.. if so please let me know and i will no longer post them.
however i think these letters help you to see how cultish and crazy this religion causes people to become:.
evening <name removed>,.
This reminds me of my mom wanting to get rid of some video games and giving them to me. She then changed her mind and left me a note saying that the games were "evil" and would "lead you further away from Jehovah". The note was shorter than this letter, but equally as creepy. Especially since we had all been playing those games for decades up until now.
Of course, for me it really was kind of annoying because she was worried I'd be 'tempted' to play the games rather than getting rid of them. If it weren't for my wife I would never have any dealings with my mom again in life. But it's the sort of thing that doesn't exactly inspire me to 'repent'. Knowing I won't be able to play Zelda at home without having a fight with the Mrs. over it is the last thing I need.
Anyway, yeah, you have to shut down. Since this sort of personal attack is going on, you really do have to just cut her off. Emotionally at least, and the rest is easy from there.
--sd-7
...totally freak out and drop something if your child fails to say "please.".
http://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/please-thank-you/.
the woman is clearly a nervous wreck, and very easily offended.. if this is her reaction to caleb forgetting his manners, i shudder to think how she will cope if she ever finds him doing drugs.. .
While the flesh was yet between their teeth, ere it was chewed, the anger of Jehovah was kindled against the people, and Jehovah smote the people with a very great plague.
"You see, Caleb? Jehovah got very, very sad with the Israelites. And he murdered them. Thousands of them. Over quail." [crazy eyes [O] [O]] "So what do you think he will do to you over the BEST SANDWICH EVER???!!"
"Please, Mom--don't hurt me! I'll do anything!"
"I don't want you to do anything, Caleb. I want you to obey..."
--sd-7
...totally freak out and drop something if your child fails to say "please.".
http://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/children/become-jehovahs-friend/videos/please-thank-you/.
the woman is clearly a nervous wreck, and very easily offended.. if this is her reaction to caleb forgetting his manners, i shudder to think how she will cope if she ever finds him doing drugs.. .
Hmm. I do have issues getting my daughter to show good manners, and after awhile it does become irritating when a child speaks to you in a way that is, frankly, rude. But there's no context to Caleb's mother's reaction, which in itself strongly suggests that she was really angry about something else or stressed from other events. Because a generally calm person would not react that way on a child's showing poor manners alone. But from the other videos, it seems like she's got some real emotional problems herself and may need therapy and/or medication. I don't say that to insult her--as she's not even a real person TO insult--just from observation.
But it's kind of weird that the voice of the dad is narrating when presumably he should actually, you know, be there in the scene instead. Elders' meeting? Elders' meeting.
But the part where he says "Even Jehovah says please" would have been a great time to include an actual scriptural example of that. Genesis 13:14 is an example: "And Jehovah said to Abram after Lot had separated from him: "Raise your eyes, please, and look from the place where you are, northward and southward and eastward and westward". See? There's a please in there.
"At district conventions, attendants hold up signs that say "Please Be Seated". Are we not thankful that such kindness is shown even to disobedient ones who have failed to return to their seats promptly for the convention program?" [Applause]
--sd-7
thanks for reading the 3-part series on the contradictory characterization of lot in genesis vs 2nd peter, analyzing genesis 19 and comparing it to 2nd peter 2. in the articles, i took a step-by-step approach to show how 2nd peter's declaring lot as "righteous" was exactly the opposite goal of the author of genesis, since the point of the story is how unrighteous lot was saved not due to his righteousness, but on behalf of his righteous uncle abraham (the star of the torah).. of course, the book of 2nd peter is widely acknowledged by nt scholars to be a fraudulent work, written under a pseudonymous (fake) name in order to 'patch up' some loose ends in the torah, likely to support then-blossoming doctines of christianity.
of particular interest to ex-jws is that one intent was to support the duty to warn others of the coming end of days, including the jw's beloved scripture, matt 28:19, that justifies their preaching work: "go thereforth and make disciples...." the only support for the claim that noah preached before the flood is found in 2nd peter, so it's a dubious claim.. in the latest article, i examine the flood account in genesis 6, showing how god had already condemned mankind even before he offered the covenant agreement to noah, so there's absolutely no reason for noah to be a "preacher of righteousness", as 2nd peter claims, since god's judgment had already been passed, and death sentence had been handed down.. .
http://awgue.weebly.com/genesis-vs-2nd-peter-noah-didnt-preach-bupkis.html.
I always assumed that Peter had access to other sources (ie. like Jude quoting from the Book of Enoch) from which he was retelling that story about Noah. I figured it was another indication of a different Bible canon back during that time.
So there are folks who say it's a fraud, Peter's letter(s)? Tell me more about how the entire Bible has been debunked...
--sd-7
my dad is currently attending a week long elders school.
dad is in his 70's and not in great health at the moment so this is adding to my anger that he is having to leave the house at 7am and doesn't return until 6pm and then has to lock himself away to study further in preparation for the next day.. he has also been told he is not to discuss anything about the school with other elders until they have all attended.
what are they learning about that isnt' already out there for all to read anyway.. they can't be learning more bible stuff as the bible is there to be read by the general public so i can only assume that its all top secret stuff that the rest of the congregation can't know about.
As much I don't much like elders, I'd still say they have good intentions with what they're doing and genuinely believe they're doing the right thing. I guess there are no particular surprises to me, hearing about what is said at 'elders' school'. I mean, the literature kind of lays out ideas from time to time that are clearly aimed at elders and how they should approach things.
Still, an interesting thread. Hmm.
--sd-7
page 20:.
the unwary may adopt the same view of theocratic arrangements.
they may be unwilling to go along with congregation procedures and may even complain about anything not to their liking.
Bible-based counsel? Using Watchtower reasoning, Joseph, Moses, Solomon, Daniel, Paul, Matthew, and Luke would be bad examples amongst 'God's people'. They were all well-educated, some of them educated by outside (non-Jewish) sources, even completely isolated from opportunities to engage in 'pure worship'. But no, that doesn't count for anything. Those guys were useless, self-seeking, glory-hoggin' bastards and weren't used by God to do anything! --sd-7
"in a similar way, at the beginning of the 20th century, there were a number of wrong expectations among true christians regarding the last days.
(2 tim.
3:1) for instance, in the year 1914, some thought that their being taken to heaven was imminent.
You know, maybe after all these "expectations", it might be a good idea not to "expect" anything the Watchtower predicts to actually happen.
But it's your fault that you don't have a choice but to believe what we tell you even if it's incorrect.
So, is this like a bizarre twist on the angel who went and fooled Ahab? It's all part of God's plan to fool you so that he can get rid of people that actually believe what he says...
As I'm sure has been said before, either by me or someone, JWs are trapped in a neverending losing game of "Simon Says".
--sd-7
