Posts by teel

19

In your experience how many DFd return to the WTS?

by teel in

from the 11/15/09 wt study article: "it is heartwarming to know that a large number of such ones [disfellowshipped ones] later return to jehovah and his congregation...".

this is a typical cult phrase, where they use a generic unverifiable statement to prove a point.

so, since we're not likely to get an official answer from the wt, how many of the dfd ones in your vicinity has actually been reinstated?.

teel

From the 11/15/09 WT study article: "it is heartwarming to know that a large number of such ones [disfellowshipped ones] later return to Jehovah and his congregation...". This is a typical cult phrase, where they use a generic unverifiable statement to prove a point. So, since we're not likely to get an official answer from the WT, how many of the DFd ones in your vicinity has actually been reinstated?

I can recall a total of 7 disfellowshipped persons, out of whom one returned, so that's 14%. There are a huge number of faded persons here, only in our congregation there are at least over 15 who are well and healthy and stopped visiting the KH - they don't seem to care about the Watchtower. As for the article it only mentions the actual DFd ones, so they don't count then.

75

Jonestown cult and the JWs

by jonathan dough in

jw
friends

anyone see the recent cnn special on jonestown?

it really bothered me, particularly when listening to the survivors talk about the amount of control exerted over them; they were afraid, terrified, couldn't just walk away, family members were snitching on each other, families were split up in the end, tugged out of arms, they were well dressed seemingly happy people who were clapping and cheering until you looked in their eyes.. the similarities with the jws isstaggering.

jones preached obedience, obedience, obedience.

teel

There are indeed similarities to Jonestown. However I do not believe the GB would make such a call, not in the next decade anyway. In the hypothetic case they did, the flock in majority wouldn't follow that. It would take some years of preparations, of indoctrination to make them more receptive of such "counsel". As of yet I do not see any sign of this.

Just a short off-topic to Dread: don't draw conclusions out of a very little sampling. The question is not whether one can be sure he will survive if he takes the transfusion, it's all about probabilities. You saying "look at this guy, he died because of transfusion, but look at that guy, he survived because he didn't take blood" sounds like a heavy smoker arguing his grandpa always smoked and never had a problem until his death at age 90, but his friend never smoked and got leukemia and died at age 35. In many cases one has better chance to survive taking a transfusion than when not taking it.

15

Jesus or Governing Body...Who's the Mediator?

by AwSnap in

what do you think the jw response would be if i asked if the faithful&discreet slave is considered to mediate for jw's?

would they admit that?...or would they say that jesus is?

from what i've seen here, they seem to acknowledge that the governing body/fds mediates.

teel

As much as J.Rutherford disliked Christendom's Bishops and Priests he developed his own system for elevating a few over many.

One could come to the conclusion he didn't have dislike of the system in itself as much as of the fact that he wasn't part of those few

34

Time of The END ????

by wobble in

a number of religions ,not just the wacky dubs, claim we are in the "time of the end ".

now, leaving out silly numbers and 1914, which was blown away years ago, what do such apocalyptic doom-mongerers have from scripture to give this idea credence ?.

the only thing i can think of , apart from the "cry of peace and security " which is no proof at all, is daniels dream image in dan chap.

teel

there are so many disasters everywhere in the world: wars between nations, ethnic conflicts, terrors, famines, earthquakes, and deadly cold or heat or flood caused by changes in weather patterns

So have these disasters increased these days? Statistics shows otherwise. The truth is in many counts these "disasters" have lessened during the 20th century, and currently we have less wars, less famines than ever before. And roughly the same amount of natural disasters as ever.

20

Le sigh. Disfellowshipped.

by hecouldbewrong in

jw
friends

i got banned from exjehovahswitnessforum.

the yuku site.

comfort me..

teel

So.... if I am member on that forum I should not talk to you right? Lest I get banned too.

Edit: consider the above to be written with invisible ink. Just in case.

66

Did you Exit the Witnesses Gradually - Or Exit Suddenly - Your Reasons ?

by flipper in

jw
friends

i thought it would be good to discuss it to understand what caused some of us to exit suddenly, or some to exit gradually .. myself , i had been in 44 years , had mentally had doubts for years before exiting - but injustices by the elders and my doubts about the " generation " doctrine led me to exit suddenly one night before a meeting.

the elders pissed me off , i went to my seat, picked my books up and walked out - never going back.

so what is your story and reasons ?

teel

In the latter days I did have some problems with the JW - I would describe my state as a mental numbness, maybe my mind was starting to revolt against the opression. Yet I kept doing the rounds, did all that was required to do. Then my wife left me (separated) because of her personal reasons, and I felt the elders didn't handle the whole matter quite as they should have. So just suddenly from one day to other I completely stopped going to KH, FS, even the memorial. Yet my mind was still not free, I remember when I first started reading anti-JW material (half a year after my dropout) I was scared, like when I was a kid and smoked a cigarette butt hidden from sight - I think some of you know this feeling. This alone is a proof to me of the mental abuse I was subjected to.

2

Charity ,what is the correct (biblical or christian) view?

by Koiné in

hallo again,.

we all apreciate the good work (charity) done by religous groups.. do you think jehovah's witnesses do enough in this matter?.

please read the comment from jehovah's witnesses in australia (2001) about their view on charity.. can you agree?

teel

From Wikipedia:

In modern usage, the practice of charity means the giving of help to those in need who are not related to the giver.

Now, what does that paper write about? First, they consider "spiritual help" the greatest help one can give. Yet the vast majority of the people doesn't need that kind of help, so per definition that's not charity. If I give a pair of shoes to someone who just had both legs amputated, you won't really call me a charitable person will you? As we know very few of the baptized are new converts, most are born-ins, from which we can conlude that the people don't really want any help from JWs, no matter how much it's stressed in the literature that they are weary and in need of spiritual leading. They are not.

Second, charity is help given to someone "not related". JWs consider each others as brothers - and if we take their words for it, they fail on the definition again. They do extremely little for the not JW ones. As a parenthesis I read on this forum that when they help a JW to rebuild a house after a catastrophe, they ask the money back when they get it from the insurance or the state? Can someone confirm this maybe with some proof? Because if that is true, then the JW charity indeed converges to 0.

Third, they fail the Bible's interpretation of charity too. Mathew 6:2: "So when you give to the needy, do not announce it with trumpets, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and on the streets, to be honored by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full." On the very small occasion they do help the outside needy ones, they blow the trumpets, and give wide publicity to it in the literature.

22

Are the JWs really short of cash.....2 weeks in Hawaii anyone!!

by losthusband in

why spend $100 million going to hawaii!!.

http://www.starbulletin.com/news/20091112_jehovahs_witness_convention_to_generate_100m_in_spending.html.

i was under the impression that wtbts were selling up because they were short of funds......wouldn't this money be better spent donated elsewhere?.

teel

Hm... $100 million divided by 24,000 visitors = $4,166 per person And that's only the money spent in Hawaii, not including the price paid to get there! How many window washing hours that is? Surely none of the JWs going there have succumbed to materialism, right?

41

Demonic Possesion of Inaminate Objects

by cantleave in

this is a phenonoma often discussed by jw's.

how unique is this idea to jw's?.

anyone got any good stories on this subject?.

teel

sir82, I always had a similar thought whenever I heard about possessed items. The story is that you buy some second hand item, which was of a Satan worshipper, thus it's possessed. My question is: are the demons really that weak? One person can simply command them to be bound to a piece of item? Then there's no real danger from them, is there.

Logically (not that I believe that happens) I could see the point of a demon "possessing" an item so to make the "Satan worshipper's" faith stronger, but once the item changes owner that demon would have absolutely no reason to stay and cause trouble out of that item! If he wanted to cause trouble, surely he could just come into my house and do anything he wants without a certain object being there. As long as we're talking about demons as the creatures the Watchtower paints them to be. Now if we're talking about "pagan" demons then right, by all means they can be bound to objects.

19

2012: Doomsday

by cattails in

just saw the 2008 movie called "2012: doomsday" by faithfilms.. what a waste of time and a waste of a dvd!!!.

here's the plot if one can call it that:.

"the final day on the mayan calendar finds four faithful strangers convening at an ancient temple in the heart of mexico in this apocalyptic thriller starring cliff de young and dale midkiff.

teel

I'll probably go see the new film. Seen the trailers, and looks like some heavy duty SFX, I'm a bit of a sucker for that. I expect to be the usual "catastrophy-movie" style plot, lots of dramas, families crying over loosing each other, people doing heroic deeds, things getting fixed just in the very last second before dying, etc. Been there, seen that dozens of times already.

As for the Mayan calendar, no, I don't think it means anything. As I've seen it from my little research even the Mayans didn't hint of 2012 being the end of the world. Their calendar goes on without problem, it just passes a mark, like the Gregorian will after 9999.