Posts by lovelylil2

392

If God Truly Cared About People Wouldn't He DO SOMETHING By Now?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i know what the witness response is to this but what do you say now?.

lovelylil2

happyguy,

The fact that some countries have unclean water with parasites in it that can blind children IS absolutely because of the fact that man governs himself independent of God. Ask yourself this, why aren't these countries cleaning the water? Why isn't man being the proper stewards of the earth that God intended him to be? I do not see how you can blame God for man's actions and non actions in caring for the earth. We were made "Lord" over all things on the earth. The responsibility for clean drinking water is on us, not on God.

You may find my position foolish but I am standing by it. Just because you feel God is not doing what you feel he should be doing, does not mean he is non existant or that he does not care.

God has already shown his care for us in many ways including in creation, the way he created us to enjoy this life, by sending his Son to release us from future condemnation and death, by setting up his kingdom on the earth, the subjects of which have created outreach programs through out the world helping literally millions of people with food, shelter, medical care, clean water, clothing, housing, etc. the list goes on and on.

He not only HAS done something, he continues to do so. You just don't accept what he is doing since you want him to do what you feel is right. Well, God does not jump thru hoops because we say he should. If he did he would not be the infinite God. He has his own plan for us and that is just the way it is. Also, like Mouthy said, HIS own timetable to carry it out. But at this time, we will continue to live in a world that is far removed from God, and so we should not be surprised by all the suffering we see in it.

This being said, It would not do any good to go further on this thread, or we will just be going around in circles. This Q about why God continues to allow suffering and has not stepped in to end it has been going on for thousands of years I am sure and I do not think there is an answer that will be sufficient for you, especially since you admit you do not believe in God in the first place. Peace, Lilly

46

Making Sense of God's Silence

by lovelylil2 in

there is a wonderful 4 part radio program on the plain truth ministries website this week about making sense of god's silence.

you can find it here www.ptm.org just click on radio and you can listen online or download free mp3s of the program.. here is the order of the 4 part series and topics discussed;.

1. is god really there?.

lovelylil2

There is a wonderful 4 part radio program on the Plain Truth Ministries Website this week about Making Sense of God's Silence. You can find it here www.ptm.org just click on Radio and you can listen online or download free mp3s of the program.

Here is the order of the 4 part series and topics discussed;

1. Is God Really There?

2. Is God silent or are we not listening?

3. When God broke his silence

4. Where is God when I need him?

This series is good for Believers and Non Believers alike. A lot of the Questions it answers are ones that those who do not believe in God ask. Such as why God permits suffering in the world, and whether or not he is currently doing anything in the world. I really enjoyed this and hope others do to. Peace, Lilly.

17

Idolization of the Watchtower logo! in March WT

by Gayle in

jw
friends

http://www.jwsupportforum.com/index.php?topic=8694.0.

lovelylil2

Thanks for sharing that!

How ridiculous that the WT is totally twisting the scripture in Matthew 13:43 to say that their logo is what is prophesied about in that text that is "shining like the sun", when it is clearly speaking about faithful Christians during the end time seperating work done by Christ. And how they will "shine like the sun" in the fathers kingdom. This text has Nothing to do with a logo owned by a corporation.

here is the text in it's context;

Matthew 13:37-43

37 He answered, "The one who sowed the good seed is the Son of Man. 38 The field is the world, and the good seed stands for the sons of the kingdom. The weeds are the sons of the evil one, 39 and the enemy who sows them is the devil. The harvest is the end of the age, and the harvesters are angels.

40 "As the weeds are pulled up and burned in the fire, so it will be at the end of the age. 41 The Son of Man will send out his angels, and they will weed out of his kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42 They will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the kingdom of their Father. He who has ears, let him hear.

If anyone reads this WT article about the logo being the thing that "shines like the sun" and still stays in this organization, then I feel sorry for them because they are in a severe spiritually darkness. I really hope this stupid article has the oposite affect and causes an outrage in the organization. Peace, Lilly

22

Anyone here on their own found a bible most true to original language?

by EndofMysteries in

okay, let alone which scrolls it was translated from, in reading a hebrew scriptures old testament interlinear, i am not too happy.

it shows the hebrew word, the english translation, then the phrase in it's bible.

genesis 5:2 - he created them male and female, and blessed them and called them adam in the day they were created.

lovelylil2

Hello and welcome!

Personally for the OT, I like to read the Tanakh itself and that is because there are subtle differences that reflect on the text. The one I have was translated by the Jewish Publication Society and is a very accurate translation of the OT from the original Hebrew.

Another Bible I have that I enjoy is the "Holy Bible in Modern English", by Ferrar Fenton. This bible translates directly from the original Hebrew, Chaldee and Greek languages.

I have several bible translations I use. I do find that they have subtle differences, like you said it depends on the particular view of the translator. Although I do like the New International Version because when there are 2 or 3 different accepted views of the text, it gives you them and lets you decide for yourself which to accept. I think this one is a good study Bible version.

I have never found that these subtle differences between texts affected the Bible's overall harmony with the other scriptures, or that they change the overall message trying to be conveyed by the author, so I do not let these differences affect my view of the Bible in general. And I am saying this after comparing many bible translations myself.

Hope this helps, Peace, Lilly

17

Jan 15, 2010 apostate teaching?

by EndofMysteries in

the last article teaches how human rule does not work and is not gods way.

how israel wanted a human king and the price for that was paying for the kings turning them astray.

"the fact impresses that those taking the lead among christians that, although they are not rulers like those ancient kings, they must always set a good example of faith.

lovelylil2

Anointed Christians, aka "born again" are Ambassadors for Christ. An an ambassador we represent Christ here on earth but are no way a substitute for him. Yes, that is an apostate teaching. And it is the same one the Catholic church teaches about the Pope that he is Christ's substitute on earth, meaning he is one and the same as Christ himself. This is an apostate teaching of several organizations, the WT included, and is the way they try to put themselves in God's judgement seat in place of Jesus Christ, and is a heresy.

Look up the word "Ambassador", we are representatives, not substitutes for. Here is the scripture it is based upon.

2 Corinthians 5:19-21

The an19that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting men's sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 20 We are therefore Christ's ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ's behalf: Be reconciled to God. 21 God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.ointed Christians (aka born again, of which I am one) are not substitutes for Christ. We are ambassadors for him here on earth.

God uses "us", meaning Christ's disciples to appeal to people of the earth to be reconciled to God and to preach the message of the reconciliation of the world thru Christ. It is "as if" God is appealing thru us, but it is not "we" that are making the appeal by being a substitute for God. The message is God's alone and we are simply his vessel's here on earth to distribute it. Again, An ambassador is a representative of, not a substitute. We can in no way substitute the Christ. Peace, Lilly

22

Anyone here who left JWs, and then their spouse left later as well?

by JimmyPage in

jw
friends

would love to hear how.

i'm sure many others here would also..

lovelylil2

gold,

Unfortunately no because I forgot to save the file with my letter on it when my husband cleaned out the hard drive because our computer was acting up. He reset it to factory setting to try and fix it. That was a few years ago. I have a new computer now. I wish I had kept a copy, a lot of people asked me to see it.

Basically I scripturally refuted the major doctrines of the WT including the teaching that the faithful servant is an organization appointed by Christ. I also showed that Christ did not yet return, that he is not an angel but God in the flesh, That Jesus' resurrection was bodily like the Lord said it would be, and not invisible to all but a few. And the biggest revelation to them had to do with the anointed.

I told the elders in my letter in 2003, that the door to heaven was not closed in 1935 and that they should brace themselves for the near future when they see the number of the anointed go up, and not down. This is because the bible's parable of the late coming workers in the vineyard is not completely fulfilled yet. It is currently being fulfilled and the church of Christ is still growing.

This was my biggest issue with them because I became anointed with the Spirit while I was still a JW but knew they would never let me partake in the organization. Nor did I want to partake in that organization because I knew they were apostate. I had a friend too who also became anointed (we call it born again). So I knew I had to get out fast, and I sped up my exit.

Many people read my letter because I sent it out to friends. Most of them are not currently in the organization. A few have contacted me and said my letter helped open their eyes. My husband too, now has conclusive proof I am not nuts, because the number of the anointed partakers has indeed risen in the WT. And it will continue to do so. I wish I could know what the elders who read my letter are thinking now?

Anyway, I am really sorry I do not have the original letter. But, I did keep all my scripural notes and in the years since leaving the WT, I compiled them into short essays addressing key WT doctrines and show how they are easily refuted biblically. If you are interested, I will gladly email you my essays. Some of which I post on this website from time to time as Q's come up about certain WT teachings. Just pm me your email address and I will send you what I have.

I will gladly send them to anyone else too if they would like to read them. Peace, Lilly

392

If God Truly Cared About People Wouldn't He DO SOMETHING By Now?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i know what the witness response is to this but what do you say now?.

lovelylil2

Jeff,

I understood the Q perfectly. My answer is he IS doing something. He is just not done doing it yet that is all.

When I stated we see the results of man governing himself I meant the atrocities man commits against his fellow man, food shortages, crime and violence, not natural disasters. Natural disasters are "unforseen occurances" that befall all of us on earth. The Bible states that these events have affected mankind through out time and will continue to do so during our time period called "the last days".

what happens after this period, well that is another thread.

Peace, Lilly

392

If God Truly Cared About People Wouldn't He DO SOMETHING By Now?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i know what the witness response is to this but what do you say now?.

lovelylil2

minimus,

you made a good point. We all have to do something when we see little children suffering and starving that is for sure. There are thousands of outreach centers run by churches that feed the hungry and help those in other need.

Of course, people who are not christian also do this type of work so I am not knocking them at all. But many of these services are given by Christian people too who are trying to show love for nieghbor. If their faith moves them to do good to others than so be it I say.

My point is God has done something and is active in the lives of many today. The suffering and pain on most of the earth is done by humans and not God. And many of these humans are the same ones who don't believe in God at all, nor would they want to submit to him. I think God is giving us (humans) exactly what we want at this time and that is to govern ourselves independent of him. What we are seeing are the results of that.

One thing I really hate about the WT is how it points out all the bad in the world and how people are suffering, in pain, starving, etc. and YET they refuse to do any type of outreach to anyone. They have no charities whatsoever. That really bothered me even when I was a Witness. If everyone helped their nieghbor (the entire earth), then imagine what we could accomplish.

Anyway, I have to go off to work. Peace to all, good Q raised min. Lilly

392

If God Truly Cared About People Wouldn't He DO SOMETHING By Now?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i know what the witness response is to this but what do you say now?.

lovelylil2

God has done something. He has already established his heavenly kingdom on the earth, the subjects of which are all the members of his universal church. His church is currently outreaching to the whole world so that while we are still living amidst suffering and evil, with wicked men harming the innocent, much good is also being accomplished by literally millions of people in this world, demonstrating their love for others. You can say we (the church) are God's hands and feet on the earth doing his will for the good of all people.

God has also made the way for death to be eventually done away with for all people, and for all things to be reconciled back to him, and that way is through Jesus Christ. We the church are Ambassadors for Christ and proclaimers of the Good News of the reconciliation of the world, thru the Son of God. And that is what we preach and have been for 2,000 years. And will do so until our Lord returns again.

At which time, all peoples, nations, governments, etc. literally all things will be judged and then brought together as one in Christ. And there will be no more sorrow or pain, and peace will reign forever. Not just the current peace that reigns in the hearts of believers but a literal time of peace through out the earth. Amen.

Peace and love, Lilly

22

Anyone here who left JWs, and then their spouse left later as well?

by JimmyPage in

jw
friends

would love to hear how.

i'm sure many others here would also..

lovelylil2

Hi, Good Question.

I left the org first. It was very hard telling my husband. He knew something was wrong for months because I was missing many meetings and when I went out in service I would not hand out the WT magazines only a small tract about the Paradise. Also the last meeting I attended, I walked out during the WT study and sat in the car. That day we had the inevitable discussion about what was wrong.

I simply told him I no longer believe the WT teachings and could not support them.

My husband blew a complete gasket. He yelled, screamed for hours on end. Threatened me with divorce and financial ruin. I did not have a job outside the home at the time and had two young kids. He called me stupid, unspiritual, mentally ill and demented. And told me that our kids are going to be destroyed because of me. That is because the kids did not want to attend the meetings if mommy didn't. Since I was the one who trained them spiritually.

The children were very traumatized because they never saw their father behave like this. Also my son had nightmares because of fear of being destroyed by Jehovah. He is fine now though. But through out this ordeal, I stayed calm and told him I would happily explain the reasons why I could not support the WT. And that if he wanted to remain a jw I would support that decision of his. He accused me of going on Apostate websites, which I had not at that time. It was not until I left that I went to those types of sites.

In actuality, I started seeing the discrepencies in the WT's own mags and while reading the bible in its context discovered they were twisting many scriptures to prove their own teachings. Viewing apostate teachings had nothing to do with my leaving. Once I saw the discrepancies I did research the origins of the WT and thats when I discovered the pyramids, etc. and how the WT was apostate from the beginning.

Anyway, within a week of telling hubby, I wrote a 10 page DA letter including scriptural proof the WT was in error and hand delivered it to the brothers. I told them not to bother to contact me for any judicial meetings and they were welcome to come by ONLY if they would be able to prove I am in scriptural error and wish to correct me.

I am still waiting 7 years later, no elder has ever tried to speak with me nor correct my views.

Meanwhile...........hubby continued with the meetings for 3 months, waiting for the elders to speak to him about his wife now being an obvious apostate. After a month went by and no one spoke to him or even looked at him at the meetings, he asked to read my DA letter. By this time, he accepted that I was not going back and was curious as to why I left. He was calmer too, so I gave it to him. He retreated upstairs with the bible and the letter and read it in private.

He never said a word about my letter and continued to meetings 2 more months. Then one evening out of the blue he didn't get dressed for the meeting. I asked if he was going and he told me he was quitting the WT. When I asked why he said because after 3 months not one elder approached him to see how he was doing, or ask what happened with your wife. And he felt the way they avoided him that they were afraid to even approach the subject, maybe because they had no response to my Q's raised. He also looked up all the scriputures I quoted in my Da letter and read them completely in their context and felt what I stated was true and accurate scripturally and that the WT was the one in error.

Anyway they showed themselves for not being spiritual shepherds at all (one of the points I raised in my letter) and he decided to leave. So he gave in his one line DA letter the following week simply stating "I no longer wish to be considered one of Jehovah's Witnesses". Since then and until now, not one elder has stopped by or called regarding our decisions.

Thats my story. Peace, Lilly