Posts by tec

290

What hope is there then?

by sayitsnotso in

if jws don't have the truth; if there is no paradise earth; if there is no end of this system; if death is all there is, then what hope do we have to look forward too?.

tec

I haven't read all of these pages, whew, but I wanted to give my personal opinion on this point, if I may:

JWs have an interest in the last days prophecies and present evidence that seems to show fulfillment of those prophecies. As regards saying that 1914 would be the end of this system, or 1975, or any other date. Yes they were wrong. The apostles were wrong in thinking Jesus would restore the Kingdom in their times. Jonah prophecied that Nineveh would be destroyed in forty days, yet that didn't happen. All these examples illustrate the humans can have wrong ideas about something. It doesn't make them false prophets or liars.

They don't seemed to have learned anything about this though. You would think that they might pay closer attention to the scriptures saying that no one knows the dates concerning the end; not the angels nor even the Son, but only the Father. (Matthew 24: 36) Yes, we're told to keep watch... but after so many mistakes, you would think they would stop setting specific times for people to put their hopes in. Perhaps they should follow Paul's example also - when he spoke about unbelieving spouses, he specifically said that it was him speaking and not God, but that he thought he had the mind of God. He was very careful about relaying something that God had not told him. (1st Corinthians 7 :12-39) Does the WTS make such a distinction, specifically and spelled out?

They should, because the people within believe and do everything they are told - as is expected of them.

And please tell me how an outsider could possibly believe that the WTS has the only source of the truth (because they do teach that they, and only they, are God's representatives in teaching the truth, yes?) when the dates and predictions have not come true? Sounds like false prophecy to anyone outside. How can it possibly be their fault for not listening or believing - and yet if they do not listen and believe then they die at Armageddon, never to be resurrected, yes?

They might not be outright lying. But they are certainly speaking presumptuously and irresponsibly, considering the authority they wield, and the trust given them.

Tammy

38

Are you SEEKING the TRUTH of the bible unaided?

by EndofMysteries in

jw
friends

hey,.

i'm hoping some on here, maybe realizing that what the bible really teaches, no church or religion has it.

your learning and working hard to uncover it's true message.

tec

EOM - I've been where you are, and done what you've done. Perhaps not to so much detail, mind you. But I learned, and I did what Stephen (Chalam) spoke about in the above post.

Don't assume that truth and life lies in the scriptures. Neither does. They can help, they are certainly interesting and they can be very exciting. But they do not replace the actual Word of God - Jesus.

You don't need to know the mysteries of the bible. You only need to put your trust in Christ. Peace and joy will come to you - and you'll be able to view scriptures with more clarity.

I have my parents with me this week, so I'm unable to be on here much until next week. I don't care too much about end of days/armageddon anymore. If we're acting in faith and love, then the date of the end should not matter! But I would be more than happy to discuss any of my understandings on what I think are important at that time, if you choose. If not, I understand, and I hope the best for you in your own personal studies.

Tammy

290

What hope is there then?

by sayitsnotso in

if jws don't have the truth; if there is no paradise earth; if there is no end of this system; if death is all there is, then what hope do we have to look forward too?.

tec

No organization here on earth could be perfect as it is made up of imperfect humans. - Sayitsnotso

Which is why you put your faith directly into Jesus' hands, and not the hands of any human organization. I say Jesus' hands, because we only know God through Jesus. And it is not disrespectful to go directly to Christ. Take a father passing on his estate to his son. The father wants all workers to go directly to the son, out of love for his son. That son in turn does well with his father's estate, tending it as his father wants, out of respect and love for his father.

This is the relationship I see between Jesus and his Father. With all authority as God has given Jesus, Jesus does everything as his Father wants him to do. If we go to Jesus, we are respecting and loving both him and his Father. I mean, no father on earth is going to feel slighted or jealous because people have turned to the son he loves, especially when he commanded that they do so. God certainly isn't going to feel slighted either.

"This is my son, whom I love. Listen to Him." Mark 9:7

Tammy

290

What hope is there then?

by sayitsnotso in

if jws don't have the truth; if there is no paradise earth; if there is no end of this system; if death is all there is, then what hope do we have to look forward too?.

tec

You don't need the WTS to have hope - hope in Jesus, God, or even in an afterlife. Perhaps you no longer have things spelled out for you in black and white, and I know that this can be terrifying and daunting when you thought you knew it 'all' and now you have to rethink and reevaluate. But really, you don't have to go somewhere else to have this hope. As Sylvia and Aguest have pointed out -PSac also, I think - you really only have to go to Jesus. He is the mediator; you don't need a mediator to get to Him.

This is what I did. I started slow, mind you. I put my faith in God, then I eventually became comfortable by putting my faith and my love directly in Jesus, as the Father has told us to do. Peace and hope will flow from Him, to you. My faith, after a bit of a struggle I admit, brings me this peace and hope.

Aguest wrote some very worthy things. About religion and what it has done to us by taking Jesus' place. Put your trust in Jesus, have hope in Him, and be patient with yourself.

There is no need to give up hope for the future.

Peace to you,

Tammy

45

Honest Question..........

by thraxer68 in

well, first off, iam new to the forum here, i registered maybe a week ago???

sometime around there, but anyway, i do have an honest question.

i guess a little background about me might be helpful and if not, at least therapeutic.

tec

First, welcome!

I'm coming in kind of late to the discussion, and there might not be much that I could add to the good advice you have already received. I would just like to add that you should be patient with yourself. You don't need to know everything today. I'm not saying to put God on the back burner, because my faith brings my immense peace and joy. But I drove myself crazy trying to find the truth, before and after my experience with JW's.

When I decided they didn't have the 'truth' (though they seem to have some truths, but not a monopoly on the whole truth as they claim), I went into panic mode. What do I do now? How can I find God? How can I ever trust my own judgment again? The stress and worry were unbearable (and I have a low tolerance for stress as it is)

One day, I simply and sincerely placed myself in God's hands. I gave complete trust to Him, asked Him to lead me where He wanted me, and no matter how long or bumpy the road.

It felt as if a huge pressure lifted from my shoulders at that moment. I still read the bible myself. (NIV translation, not the NWT) I still reflected on things that I read as I went about my daily life. But the pressure to know everything now had lifted.

I lost my way a couple of times, but I now have such a close and personal relationship with Christ, and I have so much peace and strength from placing my trust in Him.

I don't go to Church, btw. I have nothing against anyone who does go, but I personally do not feel as close with Christ in a Church setting. I'm a quiet person, and I think that's why my faith is quiet also. (Perhaps not so quiet on this board, mind you ) But He is rarely ever out of my thoughts, and my faith and relationship with him continues to grow.

So... that was a long post when really I just wanted to advise you to breathe, take your time, be patient, and place your full trust in God, through his Son. You'll find your peace.

Tammy

17

Garden of Eden, Tree of Knowledge, not quite literal

by EndofMysteries in

i share this hoping motivates some into some bible reading, and stimulating your critical thinking.

is the concept of the tree of life and knowledge of good and bad anywhere in the bible?

read ezekiel chapter 31, the entire chapter.

tec

I did not quote it, but yes, in EZEKIEL 31, it makes garden of Eden appear symbolic.

So it does.

Tammy

17

Garden of Eden, Tree of Knowledge, not quite literal

by EndofMysteries in

i share this hoping motivates some into some bible reading, and stimulating your critical thinking.

is the concept of the tree of life and knowledge of good and bad anywhere in the bible?

read ezekiel chapter 31, the entire chapter.

tec

Are you asking if the people in the bible ever referred to Adam and Eve/Tree of knowledge as being symbolic?

I don't remember reading anything that supports that they did. But they didn't have the scientific knowledge that we have also, and so would probably have had no reason to think it was anything other than literal. The message was what mattered.

Also, I think there are a lot of Christians that teach this as symbolic. In fact, I'm pretty sure Catholics teach this as symbolic even.

Burns?

Also, the story can be symbolic without losing its meaning. That at some point man chose to disobey God, and that we continue to do so, and so the significance of Jesus obedience and sacrifice is still just as meaningful.

Tammy

16

Dreams of the Second Coming of Christ

by sacolton in

i don't believe dreams have any divine meaning, but i had the most vivid dream last night and wondered if others have had dreams of the second coming of christ.

from what i remember, i was at work and there was a huge trumpet blast and the sky split in two with a bright light.

christ and all the angels appeared and i fell to my knees.

tec

This is a good thread, Sacolton.

Thanks.

Tammy

16

Dreams of the Second Coming of Christ

by sacolton in

i don't believe dreams have any divine meaning, but i had the most vivid dream last night and wondered if others have had dreams of the second coming of christ.

from what i remember, i was at work and there was a huge trumpet blast and the sky split in two with a bright light.

christ and all the angels appeared and i fell to my knees.

tec

Yes. Humbled beyond words is a great description. I felt that as well.

16

Dreams of the Second Coming of Christ

by sacolton in

i don't believe dreams have any divine meaning, but i had the most vivid dream last night and wondered if others have had dreams of the second coming of christ.

from what i remember, i was at work and there was a huge trumpet blast and the sky split in two with a bright light.

christ and all the angels appeared and i fell to my knees.

tec

I had a similar dream. Not so much about the appearance of Christ and the second coming, but about judgement afterward. A few other people and I were gathered around a woman who was naked. Jesus was there, and I don't remember any words, but I do remember feeling that he was saying, you are all responsible for her nakedness. I remember getting up and putting my coat around her, and leading her away to take care of her. To make amends, and because it was what Jesus wanted us to do.

I remember feeling a sort of stern approval for taking responsibility.

It also felt very emotional. Lots of tears, but from hope and joy, thankful to finally be doing the right thing.

Tammy