Posts by respectful

37

Why would Adam or Eve choose the tree of knowledge instead of the tree of life.

by smiddy in

please help me out here .. in genesis 2:16 it says " and jehovah god also laid this command upon the man: from every tree of the garden you may eat to satisfaction.

17 but as for the tree of the knowledge of good and bad you must not eat from it , for in the day you eat from it ,you will positively die.. ok we get that , but what about this ?.

wouldnt it make more sense to forbid the eating of the tree of life first ?

respectful_observer

The Tree of Life recently came up in conversation with some JWs recently. A pioneer posed the question whether the Tree of Life was a literal tree; another JW (Elder) very quickly stated that the WT has always taken the stance that it was not a literal tree. The pioneer then opened her Bible and read Genesis 3:22-24:

22 Jehovah God then said: "Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad. Now in order that he may not put this hand out and take fruit also from the tree of life and eat and live forever, --" 23 With that Jehovah God expelled him from the garden of E'den to cultivate the ground from which he had been taken. 24 So he drove the man out, and he posted at the east of the garden of E'den the cherubs and flaming blade of a sword that was turning continuously to guard the way to the tree of life.

She said (paraphrased) "to me those verses seem to say that the tree of life was a real thing, maybe even it was something that Adam and Eve ate from to ensure their enternal life. Verse 22 quotes Jehovah as saying they could physically touch its fruit and eat it. Verse 24 says that the cherubs and flaming sword were posted specifically to prevent Adam and Eve from accessing the tree of life."

"But the Watchtower says it wasn't a real tree."

"I understand that, but look at what those verses say."

"I DON'T CARE WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS! I CARE WHAT THE WATCHTOWER SAYS!!"

I couldn't believe it. Everyone just looked at each other and it got really quiet. The elder realized he'd just yelled at this pioneer and how crazy he sounded. So he followed it up with this gem...

"Sorry, all I meant was that we need to trust what's in the Watchtower. Even if the actual Bible verses seem to say something different, we need to trust the Slave, otherwise run the risk of apostate thinking."

19

Do Wills Ever Affect Shunning?

by Cold Steel in

a man has several sons and daughters who are active jehovah's witnesses.

so was his wife, who died two years ago.

he has since lapsed into apostasy and has been openly critical of the governing body.

respectful_observer

I know of a situation where some J-dub parents whose oldest adult child is disfellowshipped with a young son (their only grandchild). They have recently re-written their will to leave the disfellowshipped son money...in a trust that will only pay out if he gets reinstated. If he remains disfellowshipped, he doesn't see a dime and the money will go to the grandson upon his 18th birthday...provided he is baptised. If he isn't, he doesn't get a dime either.

33

why isnt the Revelation book on the jw website.

by Sojae in

jw
friends

i asked my mother( still very much active).

she said books made from '86 and before would not be online.

so we both looked at her physical revelation book and it was made in 88 so it should be there.

respectful_observer

Ah...memories of the 2006 updates.

There was a brother in my hall who was the Bookstudy Assistant. Although he was the reader every week, he was told that he would not be allowed to continue reading if he didn't replace his "old" edition with the new one...even though he was dutifully, accurately, and articulately reading the updated notes. The Book Study Overseer told him that the friends might start thinking he was resistant to "keeping up with organizational changes."

He told me the only reason he wanted to keep using his old book was that it was 1. hardcover; and 2. already underlined, so he wouldn't have to waste his time re-studying it each week! Instead he was forced to replace it with the cheap paperback version that fell apart and make an attempt at underlining it so the B.S. Overseer would stay off his back.

He's since moved halls and misses quite a few meetings.

31

Today's Daily Text is a Convoluted Mess

by TTATTelder in

wednesday, december 11. his heart did not prove to be complete with jehovah.1 ki.

will we let solomons course be a warning example for us?

(1 ki.

respectful_observer

Haha...I remember this paragraph from when it was studied at the hall. I voiced to my S.O. that I found the paragraph very odd:

- "marry 'only in the Lord.' (In the Bible)

- "underreport taxable income" (In the Bible ("pay Caesar's things to Caesar...") not only against God's law, but can land you in Federal prison)

- "or tell untruths" (In the Bible and can land you in prison in certain situations)

- "share in extracurricular sports or clubs at school" (Whhaaaaatttt???? Seriously? Lump playing varsity tennis in with cheating on your taxes, lying, and violating a Biblical directive?)

23

I AM CONFUSED WITH THE JAN STUDY EDITION?? Help me

by Sittingstraight1212 in

2 jehovah will use the kingdom to unify his family in heav- en and on earth.

that divine purpose will be realized.

(isa.

respectful_observer

Ask a JW: "How long is Jesus' reign?" Answer: "1,000 years"

Ask a JW: "When did Jesus take his throne as King?" Answer: "1914"

Ask a JW: "So he's already done with 10% of his reign?" Answer: "Well no, you see...."

I guess the Jan 2014 WT answers everything by just saying that Jehovah is really King. (?)

R_O

31

USA, Oklahoma | Jehovah's Witness church elder Ronald Lawrence arrested over sex abuse claims dating back to 1980s

by jwleaks in

usa, oklahoma | jehovah's witness church elder ronald lawrence arrested over sex abuse claims dating back to the 1980's.

a 76-year-old mcalester man was arrested tuesday on 19 counts of sexual abuse after police received claims he molested several children while in a position of authority more than 30 years ago.. mcalester police detectives were alerted to the alleged sexual crimes conducted by ronald lawrence back in august when his first accuser reported abuse at the hands of a jehovah's witness church leader.. a woman now in her 40s told detectives lawrence, an elder at mcalester's kingdom hall of jehovah's witnesses, abused her when she was just eight years old, inviting her to his home, where he fondled her and raped her in his bathtub, according to her testimony found in lawrence's arrest warrant, which was issued tuesday.. two other accusers, also in their 40s, then came forward with similar stories of abuse.

both said they were very young, with one telling investigators the molestation took place from the time she was 10 until she was 13 years old.

respectful_observer

Wow, so based on the news reports he supposedly admitted to all of these sins back in 2005 to get reinstated. So he was still disfellowshipped for this disgusting behavior, but today he's serving as an elder??? I wonder how long it took them to reinstate him in 2005, promote him to MS, and then have Holy Spirit direct them to re-appoint him as an elder?

20

new watchtower on jw.org Americans don't know their own history

by hoser in

jw
friends

i started reading the feb 2014 public watchtower about a war that changed the world.

i had to do a double take in the very first paragraph.. .

"a century ago, millions of young men left the security of their homes and went off to war.

respectful_observer

RO said-

Haha...I saw you're thread title and expected to open it, read an example in the Watchtower demonstrating that Americans don't know their own history...followed by your observation of how ironic that would be since most J-dubs don't know the real history of the Organization TM .

Shouldn't this one (sung by Brother Sam Cooke), be included the official JW Song Book, the religious anthem for legions of home-schooled publishers?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNO72aCnVr0

I love it! (oops...looks like I needed more coffee this morning..."you're" "your")

20

new watchtower on jw.org Americans don't know their own history

by hoser in

jw
friends

i started reading the feb 2014 public watchtower about a war that changed the world.

i had to do a double take in the very first paragraph.. .

"a century ago, millions of young men left the security of their homes and went off to war.

respectful_observer

Haha...I saw you're thread title and expected to open it, read an example in the Watchtower demonstrating that Americans don't know their own history...followed by your observation of how ironic that would be since most J-dubs don't know the real history of the Organization TM .

97

First post

by thedog1 in

jw
friends

this is a very strange thing for me to do.

i have been an active witness for over 25 years.

i currently serve as an elder and i conduct the watchtower study.

respectful_observer

"...so maybe I will just use the line I have used sometimes in the past, ' our understanding now is...'"

I made a decision several years ago to never say something from the stage or in comment that I do not personally believe in. You could always just "call a spade, a spade" and say, "The Governing Body now teaches...". That way, your not forcing yourself to state YOU believe a teaching/interpretation when you really don't. But since it's factually accurate, no one should be able to criticize what you're saying.

(Now that the GB claims to make up the entire membership of the "Faithful and Discreet Slave Class", I've completely stopped using the term and just refer to them as "The Governing Body." On occassion when someone starts throwing around the term left and right, I reply "Oh, you mean the Governing Body?" They get a really uncomfortable look on their face and change the subject because suddenly it makes it sound like they're worshipping men.)

58

Home schooled witness kids

by stillin in

sorry if i'm stepping on any toes here, but i haven't seen anything positive about home-schooling...at all.

the notion is that parents are taking advantage of the formative years to inculcate more worthwhile values while protecting their kids from worldly influences.

they end up with lazy, socially inept, illiterate duds who haven't a clue.

respectful_observer

The only kids that I ever knew who were home schooled came from UBER-spiritual J-dub families. They all decided to start home schooling them during middle school (around 12 years old). In every single case, each kid went from giving their experience about home schooling and spending a lot of time in field service at meetings and assemblies to getting into drugs, getting disfellowshipped, and in two cases, getting knocked up by gang members/drug dealers. One or two eventually made their way back, but the rest of them disappeared into a disfunctional, below-the-poverty-line existence.

There isn't a single J-dub I know who was home schooled that never got DF'd or who can successfully support themselves or a family as an adult.

respectful_observer

Posts by respectful_observer