with the 4th anniversary of my parents death looming and the anniversary of their last wedding anniversary party where my family was together and happy for the last time just being past ....i was feeling kind of depressed and wanted to reach out to what family i have left.
i sat there and debated in my mind if i should do it...should i try and reach out to my sister..see if i could reach her across the barrier of the jw religion.
should i try to remind her that we are sisters...we were sisters before we became jws and we will always be sisters.
Thank you for the very kind compliment Xena. You can always contact me if you need to, my mail is always open. I know of estrangements first hand so I can somewhat empathize with you.
It is your sister I pity the most, what a loss she has incurred and doesn't even know it. Especially since she'll miss out on that adorable daughter of yours. I foresee her kicking herself someday.
Regards,
Julie
with the 4th anniversary of my parents death looming and the anniversary of their last wedding anniversary party where my family was together and happy for the last time just being past ....i was feeling kind of depressed and wanted to reach out to what family i have left.
i sat there and debated in my mind if i should do it...should i try and reach out to my sister..see if i could reach her across the barrier of the jw religion.
should i try to remind her that we are sisters...we were sisters before we became jws and we will always be sisters.
HI Xena,
Sorry to hear of your heartache. Be proud of yourself for not bowing to pressure to do what you know in your heart is wrong and not falling for emotional blackmail. Remember too where one door is closed another opens.
Seems to me you have friends here who care about you as much as their own siblings. You may have lost a sister but it appears you have merely traded that family in for one huge clan. For all of our differences I think deep down we all have regard for each other and some here really love others here. I believe you to be much loved here and you'd never had discovered all these treasured relationships if you'd chosen a different path.
I know this is all small consolation for the loss of your realtionship with your sister but I just wanted to point at your gains to help soothe your pain from your loss.
Sympathy and hugs,
Julie
how many of you have really gone through suicidal feelings, when you felt that no-one at all was out there to try to assist you?
did it help you to be told by so called friends, 'just pull your socks up!
' did you feel that such admonition was really daft and stupidly uncaring?
Hi Celtic,
You are right, those talking about suicide are more asking for help than death. There is a point of despair that is sometimes reached and can be viewed as permanent. Of course it isn't but that can be hard to see at the time.
Personally suicide has never been an option I seriously considered. My dad, a very intelligent and sensible man, used to tell me that suicide was bad decision making, "a permanent solution to a temporary problem." I agree with this but understand how the desperate mindset can lose sight of the "temporary problem" part of it.
As humans our biggest mistake can be to limit our hopes and dreams and to let our determination be discouraged.
Just my two cents worth...
Julie
my cousin, sharon, who died in september.......was disfellowshipped three years ago.
her brother is still a witness, and wrote a thank you card to an elder in the congregation here.
this elder and his wife came to visit sharon a few days before she died, and before she started to lose her ability to make sense when she talked.
everyone wants to find meaning and purpose in their life.
people who have been taught to believe in the bible seek stuff in the bible to give them meaning in their life.
some people make up stuff supposedly based on the bible to give them meaning in their life.. the watchtower society goes one step further: they make up stuff supposedly based on the bible to give their corporation meaning and importance in life.. far too many true believers have a difficult time accepting what should be obvious to any rational human: the bible meant exactly what it said.
Ah my dear Farkel,
No one can do a bible study quite like you. I have to wonder, when those who consider the bible to be inerrant and God's word, how can they read this stuff and believe it to be inspired? Even remotely close to enlightened?? Truly remarkable.
I now realize I need to have another look at Ezekiel and I foresee the use of many post-its during that perusal.
Thanks for the great post, nice job exposing the WT "evidence" for what it really is...nonsense.
Warm regards,
Julie
recently in another thread, dannybear mentioned jim jones and the mass suicides at jonestown.
about two years ago when the issue of cults in france was a hot topic in ex-jw discussions, i became curious about jim jones and his followers.
i had seen the news reports and horrific footage, but i wanted to understand how a man could convince 638 of his adult followers to kill themselves and 276 children.. for me, jim jones's story is also close to home.
Wow Ginny,
Thanks for posting all that. It is like a car wreck, so horrible but one cannot look away. The similarities are so blatant. Truly evil, these cults. The only thing worse than taking pleasure in the misery of others is manipulating them into misery under a guise of helping them.
Warm regards,
Julie
do you fear death?if so,do you fear it because of the pain that is likely to go along with it?or because of what will become of your soul(your self)after death?.
curiosly,i find that i no longer fear death.not that i want to die-i don't.but i wonder if this how i should feel.. i don't like pain,but i have a fairly high threshold of pain,i think.i'm sure there is much greater pain than what i have experienced,but though i avoid it when at all possible(including spankings...sorry chat babes),i'm not afraid that i can't deal with it if i have to.. likewise death,i just have no great fear of it anymore.i don't think that it's due to my beliefs about what will happen after i die...i don't have any.sure,i was raised a j.w.,instilled from birth with the idea that if i didn't survive armageddon,that i'd be resurrected thereafter.but i don't buy that anymore...neccesarily.nor do i believe in the heaven or hell concept...neccesarily.i do believe that if i'm the best kind of person i can be,then it will have to be good enough for whatever,if anything,lies beyond the life i'm living now.. in talking to others,though,i find very few(if any)people who don't have a pretty high degree of fear about death.it has me wondering,and i'd appreciate your comments.. cowboy.
we ride and never worry about the fall.
Greetings all,
My only fear in relation to death is that I may die before my children are grown. If I can be here long enough to see them safely into adulthood the rest will be bonus. As to fearing death itself, I once nearly did die and have not feared it ever since. Don't necessarily *fear* pain, can tolerate it quietly for the most part, I find it extremely irritating. Especially if it is of the incapacitating nature.
My worst fear would be for something terrible to happen to my children and there are a few adults who I dread losing but know I will eventually.
Regards to all,
Julie
i was getting the kids ready for bed last night and i heard the doorbell ring.
it was about 7:30 and i had no idea who it could be.
i opened the door and 2 elders from our hall were standing there.
:I highly encourage you to take advantage of the NET this way- you and your family will be able to find some peace of mind instead of worrying about whether wt can find a "Scriptual" reason to DF you
Yes, JT is SO right on this. Getting curious after suddenly starting to be pressured to join, after a very long period of studying with no pressure at all, I went on to the net and found out how very right my suspicions of this organization were.
Read and learn, it is a wise investment of your time.
Regards,
Julie
rebuttal to amnesian's post preface .
intro: i am making a preface to kick-off my rebuttal so that when some of you read this, you can have a quick review of where i am coming from, and my views, and the tone i am trying to set.
then if you wish to expend the time, my full rebuttal will be posted in parts over the next few days (except news years day).
Nice job AmazingEx of disregarding pretty much all my points about Amazing and his behavior here since Amnesian's post. You rsilence on those matters speak volumes. As to your objectivity, maybe you could pick out a screen name all by yourself next time, you know, Independent of Amazing (who you of course view objectively).
For someone who cannot seem to comprehend the discussion you show a rare humor in trying to imply it is me the whole thing is beyond. Good one. Hope you get those blinders off someday.
Regards,
Julie
rebuttal to amnesian's post preface .
intro: i am making a preface to kick-off my rebuttal so that when some of you read this, you can have a quick review of where i am coming from, and my views, and the tone i am trying to set.
then if you wish to expend the time, my full rebuttal will be posted in parts over the next few days (except news years day).
Greetings to all,
Amazing Ex, I say you presume too much in that you assume that Amazing's "points" (what points?) hit a soft spot and some of us are on the defense. As you and Ladonna need to know, not all of us were JWs hence we don't have those old soft spots to deal with. Have you read the threads dear or are you simply reacting to what you've been told about them? You may note I merely came in intially to say that Amnesian made some rebuttals to Amazing's comments (her "blind-siding" post was merely a rebuttal), Amazing alleged dishonesty on Amnesian's part (and pay close attention here dear, this is where *I* come in), and then disappeared. When he re-appeared he seemd to have everything *but* his rebuttal. I merely urged honesty and forthrightness in reply. We have yet to see such. Tell me, do you approve of someone coming in saying "Liar!" and then not backing such up? How would you feel? If this person making these allegations promised they would back this up soon would you not expect him to keep his word and do so? This is what I have been asking him to do but it seems he cannot.
Patio, IF Amazing had just not replied at all to Amnesian's post that would be *almost* acceptable (though it would look a bit cowardly) but the reason a reply is pretty much required is *because* of the comments he *did* make about it. Kind of like pleading the 5th. Once you start talking you cannot go back and plead the 5th anymore. Besides, I think Amnesian's post opened new frontiers in discussion here, far from beating something to death. All that's being beaten to death here is Amazing's fanfare-style prep for rebuttal, which apparently, after all this, we won't be getting anyhow.
Amazing Ex, you said:
Amnesian- In your 12 page post I see inteligence, wit, passion, anger and, yes, ego. Should I conclude that you are egocentric? Or should I realize that your passion and/or anger emphasize a 'normal' ego?
See let me illustrate the difference here. Yes, we all know full well that Amnesian's post was 12 pages long (Amazing has been dragging that cross about the board for days). Amazing has submitted several pages since then. Her post has kicked off an incredible discussion regarding several important, been-kicked-under-the-rug-far-too-long issues, up to it's 6th page now I think (?). Amazing's posts amount to an offer of reconcilaition on *HIS* terms and much bluster about how he's *going* to address it all and a great deal of talk all about HIM. He seems to be rather puzzled as to why his posts all about him, his philosophies and his growth have not drawn the sort of response the thought provoking post by Amnesian has. Yes, Amazing has his redeeeming qualities, we all do. However I guess all the posters here do not think that Amazing and his redeeming qualities are riveting enough to go on for 6 or 7 pages.
Do you see the differences in the content of the posts? Can you?
Lastly, no I do not think an ex-wife or a daughter can have an unbiased view of a man. I know my dad was just short of a God in my eyes and I would be rather unable to see his faults (if he had any ). Sorry but you and she will never qualify as unbiased character references about Amazing. It is human nature and that is unchanging.
Regards,
Julie