I wonder, though, just for the sake of argument, if God could have allowed for several possible futures that would have still fulfilled his purpose. For all we know, perhaps N.H. Barbour was supposed to have filled the role that Russell did, but because Barbour used his free will to thwart God's purpose, Russell was allowed to replace him. What do you think, Farkel?
Justin
JoinedPosts by Justin
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20
Predestination and Dubs
by Farkel indubs are one of a few unique religions that sprung up from the second adventist movement in the 1800's.
they are unique in that they believe in "greater fulfillments" of prophecies recorded in the bible.
they believe that bible characters and bible groups foreshadowed their equivalent "classes" of people in modern days.
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10
How "New" is the name Jehovah?
by Carmel inthe witnesses' claim to fame is centered around their conviction that the name jehovah sets them apart as the only religion that "glorifies my name..." i wonder how they reconcile this with the bible's clear indication that the christ would return with a "new name" and give it to his followers?
62:1 and rev.
2:17 and 3:12. if they qualifiy as god's chosen people while insisting on using the old moniker, i would think they have some explaining to do... any dubbies out there want to enlighten me?.
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Justin
Carmel,
The promises in Revelation regarding a "new name" have reference to a reward for faithfulness. They are rewards to be bestowed in the Kingdom, and are not applicable here and now. I suppose the reward for a faithful Christian would be a new identity, and even the new "name" of Jesus is probably not a literal name but his identity which would be revealed to his closest associates in the Kingdom.
So the texts have nothing to do with a "name" by which a religious group is known in the present world.
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Is the Watchtower Predicting the End for 2034 AD?
by Dogpatch inis the watchtower predicting the end for 2034 ad?
someone sent me scans of this dec 2003 wt and so i put together a little page on it.
http://www.freeminds.org/history/endin2034.htm
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Justin
Garybus,
The Seventh Day Adventists are a separate branch on the Adventist tree, and should not be confused with Second Adventists. The 1874 date is another example of a "prophetic date" which is receding into the past. It was set by Nelson Barbour, a Second Adventist. It is still held to by modern Bible Students who follow Russell's teachings, but by no means can it now be used to mark a single generation. So 1914 is fast joining the ranks of dates like 1844 and 1874.
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How "New" is the name Jehovah?
by Carmel inthe witnesses' claim to fame is centered around their conviction that the name jehovah sets them apart as the only religion that "glorifies my name..." i wonder how they reconcile this with the bible's clear indication that the christ would return with a "new name" and give it to his followers?
62:1 and rev.
2:17 and 3:12. if they qualifiy as god's chosen people while insisting on using the old moniker, i would think they have some explaining to do... any dubbies out there want to enlighten me?.
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Justin
None of the passages you cite refer to a new name for God. Isaiah 62:1 (should be Isa. 62:2) refers to a new name for Jerusalem. Rev. 2:17 refers to a new name for each overcoming (anointed) Christian, or possibly a new name for Jesus. Rev. 3:17 refers to Jesus' new name. There is no mention of a new name for God the Father.
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Is the Watchtower Predicting the End for 2034 AD?
by Dogpatch inis the watchtower predicting the end for 2034 ad?
someone sent me scans of this dec 2003 wt and so i put together a little page on it.
http://www.freeminds.org/history/endin2034.htm
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Justin
I don't think it's a prediction of a specific date as much as an indication that the "time of the end" could be longer than an individual lifespan. In other words, it is abandoning the belief that people who saw the beginning of the end would also see the end itself. Thus, 1914 is retained as the starting point for a "time of the end" that really lasts indefinitely.
I have long suspected that JWs would eventually treat 1914 as the Seventh Day Adventists treat 1844. William Miller had expected a visible Second Coming to occur in 1844 (he originally thought 1843). When that didn't happen, the SDA's later claimed that this date was a starting point rather than a terminus, but as 1844 has receded into the past it cannot be used to prove that people living today will see the end in their own lifetimes. So 1914 is becoming the JW equivalent of 1844.
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Watchtower quotes needed
by irishayes ini seem to remember reading on this board a few different quotes regarding errors in the bible and also an instruction to members to not read the kjv of the bible because it would tend to support the belief that jesus is god.
would someone please point me in the right direction to find these?
i looked on "quotes" website, but couldn't find them.. also would like the quote that tells members that they can't understand the bible without the watchtower organization telling them what the bible says.. thanks!
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Justin
I don't recall them ever saying NOT to read the KJV. The way the matter is handled with newly interested persons is to give some examples of old-fashioned, archaic language in the KVJ which they won't understand, then show them that they can understand the same verses in the NWT (of course, any modern translation will help them in this regard). Then they are encouraged to use the NWT because it is in modern English, and it soon becomes their standard translation. In this way, the issue of the biases in the NWT is completely avoided, and by the time they realize that the NWT is different from other modern translations (not just the KVJ), they have already come to trust the WTS.
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The Star Spangled Banner....
by Evesapple in.
this morning my daughter was practicing the song for her 8th grade graduation.......i sung it at a few cubs games but don't really know the words....i'm sure it was due to my jw non-participation in singing such pagan songs...... does anyone else know this song all the way through???
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Justin
When I was a little kid (not raised JW), I used to think that "the dawn's early light" was "the dawnserly light," and "the rocket's red glare" was "the robin's red breast." That's how I sang it!
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Do Dubs do Jury Service in your area?
by ozziepost inover on the weekend poll thread, something interesting (to me!!!
) has come up, the matter of dubs serving on juries.
check out the comments of blondie, mulan and myself on this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/71933/1.ashx.
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Justin
It seems some things really are "matters of conscience" and others are just called that for PR. How do you tell the difference? Mabe because if you do one thing as a "matter of conscience" they'll leave you alone, but if you do something else they'll say you have "disassociated" yourself?
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what do you miss most about being in the truth!?!?!
by dh inc'mon now, there has to be something... the green carpet or the hard seats?
barn dances?
large social gatherings?
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Justin
I miss having all the answers and not having to deal with ambiguity.
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Casting Peace on the Earth
by Leolaia inmark smith , in his commentary on the baal epic, has made an interesting observation on messianic motifs in the ot and nt, particularly as relating to the bringing of a new era of peace (slwm).
such passages announce an impending epoch of peace, and describing it in agricultural terms as "planting peace" or "casting peace" as one casts seeds.
ezekiel 34:25-40 describes the removal of hostilities from the earth and the advent of paradisical conditions.
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Justin
Is Smith leaving out the vowels now when he transliterates Hebrew words? It's very difficult for those used to "sounding out" words to read just the consonants. This may be necessary in the case of Ugaritic (the language of the Syrian city which has been excavated and compared with Israelite language and culture) because the vowels sounds are unknown, but at least with Hebrew we have the sounds which have been supplied by the scribes.