Listener

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Posts by Listener

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  40

  After all, JWs were RIGHT!

  by abiather in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  1) science and technology appeared as a savior to mankind, yet the overall result points to the opposite direction.. http://aeon.co/magazine/science/why-has-human-progress-ground-to-a-halt/.

  2) john kerry warns of catastrophe if climate change is not tackled.

  http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/environment/article4295230.ece (times, saturday 13, 2014).

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  Listener

  How were the JWs right about climate change?
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  46

  Illegal immigrants in the organization?

  by silent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had a thought today that might prove interesting.

  i'm wondering if there are any illegal immigrants who are witnesses?

  surely it would be a great position to be in as an illegal immigrant because you could play up your plight and prey on the sympathies of others within the congregation.

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  Listener

  I've found one article on the JW library discussing the issue. It's in the Awake 2002 1/22, although it identifies it as being illegal or 'dishonest' it does not deal with it from a congregational point of view.

  Count the Cost Before Migrating for Economic Reasons

  In view of the many criminal gangs involved in trafficking migrants and the difficulty of immigrating legally to countries of the developed world, husbands and fathers should carefully consider the following questions before making a decision.

  1. Is our economic situation really so desperate that one or all of the family must move to a country where wages are higher?

  2. How much debt would we incur to finance the trip, and how will the debt be repaid?

  3. Is it worth breaking up the family for economic advantages that may prove unrealistic? Many illegal migrants find it practically impossible to obtain regular employment in developed countries.

  4. Should I believe the stories about high wages and social benefits? The Bible says that “anyone inexperienced puts faith in every word, but the shrewd one considers his steps.”—Proverbs 14:15.

  5. What guarantee do I have that we would not be putting ourselves in the hands of a criminal organization?

  6. If such a criminal group did organize the journey, do I understand that my wife—or my daughter—might well find herself forced to work as a prostitute?

  7. Do I realize that if I enter a country as an illegal immigrant, I may be unable to obtain fixed employment and could be repatriated, losing all the money I have invested in the journey?

  8. Do I want to consider becoming an illegal immigrant or resorting to dishonest measures in order to gain admittance to a wealthier country?—Matthew 22:21; Hebrews 13:18.
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  46

  Illegal immigrants in the organization?

  by silent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had a thought today that might prove interesting.

  i'm wondering if there are any illegal immigrants who are witnesses?

  surely it would be a great position to be in as an illegal immigrant because you could play up your plight and prey on the sympathies of others within the congregation.

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  Listener

  I agree with you Silent and I do wonder what the org's. position is on this.

  There was a fairly recent article regarding family members working overseas and they were straongly against this, they stated a number of reasons, including the problems associated with the family being seperated. Earning money and supporting your family was specifically excluded as being a good reason for needing to do this. However, there was no discussion about the legality of it. Even though the bible makes it clear that a man must provide for his family, they chose to whitewash this.
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  46

  Illegal immigrants in the organization?

  by silent in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i had a thought today that might prove interesting.

  i'm wondering if there are any illegal immigrants who are witnesses?

  surely it would be a great position to be in as an illegal immigrant because you could play up your plight and prey on the sympathies of others within the congregation.

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  Listener

  Silent, you raise a really good issue. This is just information that i've picked up, I can't remember where from or even how accurate it is. What I've heard is that illegal immigrants are accepted as part of the congregation and the elders do not impose any requirements on these people to abide by the law of man. The only imposition is that the men will not be appointed to any positions.

  As to whether these people are breaking the law or not is dependant on the laws in each particular country. For instance, here in Australia someone could be considered an illegal immigrant but if they were to apply for refugee status then they would not be breaking the law, however they would be kept in a detention centre until such time as they were allowed to reside here or had to return home.

  It is possible that as the organization believes that God's laws are above man's, they conclude that they should not hinder a persons ability to worship God and be part of the congregation. We've seen how they treat pedo's and it doesn't appear to be a requirement that an offender hands themselves into the higher authorities.
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  21

  I tried to make an elder feel guilty for shunning his 2 children.

  by Jeannette in

  1. watchtower
  2. medical

  i ran into an elder the other day at walmart.

  he's a fairly good man and has a wife that is very sickly.

  so sickly in fact i don't know how she's holding on.

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  Listener

  He probably already feels guilty or at least very sad. You could suggest to him that as his wife is very ill there is good reason for her children to be around her and that he shouldn't feel bad because it would come under necessary family business. Remind him that as a proper family unit they could all be supporting each other.
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  65

  The Watchtower 3/15/2015 Parables! New Understanding! plus More!

  by wifibandit in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://imgur.com/a/e6dos.

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  Listener

  They once again give credit to Jehovah for making the cahnges in understandings of the parables. I wonder who they credit with the original understandings of the parables?

  Does it not make us happy to see that Jehovah makes his teachings clear to us?
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  65

  The Watchtower 3/15/2015 Parables! New Understanding! plus More!

  by wifibandit in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://imgur.com/a/e6dos.

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  Listener

  That's right Data Dog. They acknowledge that the anointed have been given the job of preaching (as per the Talents Parable). However because they determine through the parable of the Sheep & Goats that the Great Crowd must help the anointed, they therefore have the God given right to ask the GC to help them with the witnessing work and if they don't they will be judged as a Goat.
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  65

  The Watchtower 3/15/2015 Parables! New Understanding! plus More!

  by wifibandit in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  http://imgur.com/a/e6dos.

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  Listener

  Still working my way through it, it is an astonishing magazine. Here are some thoughts so far -

  Meaning of Discreet as in F&DS

  W 2007 9/1

  Hence, when Jesus described the faithful slave as discreet, he indicated that those represented by that slave would display discernment, foresight, and good judgment because they base their faith, actions, and teachings on God’s Word of truth.

  [Footnote]

  “Discreet” translates the Greek word phro′ni·mos. The work Word Studies in the New Testament, by M. R. Vincent, comments that this word most frequently refers to practical wisdom and prudence.

  In the current Watchtower they explain why there are changes, they state

  As we might expect, over the years Jehovah has helped “the faithful and discreet slave” to become steadily more discreet. Discretion has led to greater caution when it comes to calling a Bible account a prophetic drama unless there is a clear Scriptural basis for doing so.

  They state this even though nothing in the parable indicates that the FDS would become more faithful and more discreet over the years. The same magazine goes on about how they are keeping things clear and simple in explaining parables and not putting a meaning to every little aspect of the parable. Instead, they obviously are still sticking to the idea of making things up whenever they please. The FDS even goes on to state that the master would return and if they were still faithful & discreet he would reward them, it was not contingent on them becoming more faithful and discreet.

  By claiming the the FDS has become more discreet, the current members of the GB are elevating themselves above their predecessors, they are also putting into question whether their predecessors were even wise and prudent at all. Without doubt, they are saying that in the past not much caution was being displayed.

  The Good Samaritanand their ‘clear’ understanding of this parable -

  Today, our literature uses that illustration to remind all Christians that we must be impartial in rendering aid to those in need, especially in a spiritual sense. Does it not make us happy to see that Jehovah makes his teachings clear to us?

  So this account now means that Jesus is saying that we should be helping our neighbour, mostly in a spiritual sense even though he stated nothing of the sort in the parable. Again, they are just making things up.
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  20

  JW Flash Mob

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  a flash mob is defined as a large public gathering at which people perform an unusual or seemingly random act and then disperse.. jws are now in on the act and were doing this in bath on unsuspecting convention delegates during their tours after the convention.

  they did this on at least three seperate occassions.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hmrqr-k4hq.

  here's another one, not so public though.

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  Listener

  A flash mob is defined as a large public gathering at which people perform an unusual or seemingly random act and then disperse.

  JWs are now in on the act and were doing this in Bath on unsuspecting Convention Delegates during their tours after the convention. They did this on at least three seperate occassions.

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3HmrqR-K4HQ

  Here's another one, not so public though

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a0DJmyR9fNw
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  73

  Active JW's and JW Lurkers- Especially JW Defenders and Believers: A Few Questions For You

  by OnTheWayOut in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  while there are not too many currently defending the watchtower in this discussion forum, it happens from time to time.

  and quite often, there may be new people and lurkers reading these discussions.

  i just wanted you to ponder these questions.

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  Listener

  CommitteeChairman, if you were disfellowshipped for not following strict orders regarding the handlying of child abuse I am sure there would be dozens of us using you as an example. R&F JWs generally believe that parents are encouraged to report the crime or that the Elders do it. We would be saying," no that's not the case, in fact I know of an Elder who was disfellowshipped for doing that very thing".