Listener

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  8

  WHY THE WATCHTOWER TREATS MEN LIKE DONKEYS OF BURDEN

  by raymond frantz in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  https://youtu.be/tppmprdxxzw?si=shh5vkmuzfp6c9_m.

  so the watchtower has come out with sn article, study article 2 in their newly released study watchtower magazine for 2025 and we see from the start how they keep perpetuating the same old outdated narrative that when it comes to marriages the husband is the one at fault, we'll thats i think when i read paragraph from this article where i man has to work on a whole list of things and not once the wife is instructed to do any of these things, but let's just read together paragraph 14:.

  what are these steps?

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  Listener

  I find it repulsive that they are doing this as a study article with toddlers and children present.
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  8

  WHY THE WATCHTOWER TREATS MEN LIKE DONKEYS OF BURDEN

  by raymond frantz in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  https://youtu.be/tppmprdxxzw?si=shh5vkmuzfp6c9_m.

  so the watchtower has come out with sn article, study article 2 in their newly released study watchtower magazine for 2025 and we see from the start how they keep perpetuating the same old outdated narrative that when it comes to marriages the husband is the one at fault, we'll thats i think when i read paragraph from this article where i man has to work on a whole list of things and not once the wife is instructed to do any of these things, but let's just read together paragraph 14:.

  what are these steps?

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  Listener

  There's lots of valid points you've made raymond frantz.

  They usually follow up with another article, either in the same magazine or the following magazine 'directed' at the wives.

  They are so stupid when it comes to serious topics like this. They've realized there is a need to address the issue again because of the abuse going on and appoint a writer or group of writers to present an article on it. Then, I imagine, the writer doesn't even consider bringing up how the couple should deal with issues together because they are only dealing with the one sex at a time.

  They've listed six steps that an abusive husband needs to take. Being 'steps' they should be all inclusive.

  These are their steps, note that these are the same steps if he is looking at pornography with a few comments by me -

  First, he recognizes that he has a serious problem. Nothing is hidden from Jehovah’s sight. (Ps. 44:21; Eccl. 12:14; Heb. 4:13)

  How is the husband supposed to recognize that he has a problem and a 'serious' one at that? At what point does raising your voice become abusive and when does looking at porn become a serious problem? When it happens once, or twice...? Even a alcoholic often doesn't recognize that he/she has a problem until something significant happens.

  Second, he stops abusing his wife and changes his behavior. (Prov. 28:13)

  Well that was easy. We are only at Step 2 and have the problem solved.

  Third, he apologizes to his wife and to Jehovah and seeks their forgiveness. (Acts 3:19) He should also beg Jehovah for both the desire to change and the help to control his thoughts, speech, and actions. (Ps. 51:10-12; 2 Cor. 10:5; Phil. 2:13)

  Shouldn't this have been step 1?

  There's nothing wrong in this other than the fact that too often, apologies are empty words and the behaviour continues.

  Also, apologizing just isn't enough. A good man would do something kind and sincere to show his sorrow for what he has done.

  Fourth, he acts in harmony with his prayers by learning to hate all forms of violence and abusive speech. (Ps. 97:10)

  That is a lovely sentiment but more than a tough one to enact, if not impossible. We are sinful human beings and we will have bad thoughts. As much as we try, I don't think it is even possible to hate all forms of violence and abusive speech. The Roadrunner and Ben and Jerry come to mind for a start. That would really restrict what we watch on tele or the video games that we would play. Do we hate the police because they may physically defend us or protect us from criminals by inflicting harm to them?

  Fifth, he seeks immediate help from loving shepherds in the congregation. (Jas. 5:14-16)

  Is this a step to follow every time he has been abusive by raising his voice or looking at any porn? As for seeking their help immediately, isn't that an overexageration? Aren't there more urgent issues like seeing to the wife, whether she needs assistance, medical help, or other support?

  Sixth, he develops a plan that will help him to avoid all such behavior in the future.

  As a final step, he is told that he should develop a plan to help himself avoid abuse. What on earth did he talk to the Shepherds for? This step shows a complete lack of understanding of how a marriage works. As raymond frantz points out, there are no discussions with his wife and no way of understanding of how the dynamics work in their relationship in order to solve issues.

  Another problem is that a Brother can choose to go to the Elders with or without his wife but a wife must have her husband there if she goes to the Elders. It's unlikely to result in any real marriage counselling and even more so because they are not qualified counsellors.
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  60

  1/25 WT: Oral and Anal sex are a go - if she's ok with it

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  he will not pressure her to engage in sexual acts that make her feel uncomfortable, that are demeaning, or that bother her conscience..... the bible does not provide details as to what sexual practices between a husband and a wife should be considered clean or unclean.

  a christian couple must make decisions that reflect their resolve to honor jehovah, to please each other, and to maintain a clean conscience.

  generally speaking, a couple would not discuss with others this intimate aspect of their marriage..

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  Listener

  I agree Neatbluedog.

  To some degree, they follow the Bible then go off a complete tangent and come up with their own rules. Then they stuff up and cover them up with even further rules that are unbiblical.

  They went too far into the bedrooms of JWs, making rules that should have been kept under the sheets. Then when they flipflop and decide they went too far and should not said anything about it, they tell JWs that there should be no discussion with anyone else other than their partner.

  They should have been honest and said these matters were not for the GB or Elders to dictate on and therefore, it would not be discreet for them to discuss with the flock.
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  60

  1/25 WT: Oral and Anal sex are a go - if she's ok with it

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  he will not pressure her to engage in sexual acts that make her feel uncomfortable, that are demeaning, or that bother her conscience..... the bible does not provide details as to what sexual practices between a husband and a wife should be considered clean or unclean.

  a christian couple must make decisions that reflect their resolve to honor jehovah, to please each other, and to maintain a clean conscience.

  generally speaking, a couple would not discuss with others this intimate aspect of their marriage..

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  Listener

  Watchtower - Generally speaking, a couple would not discuss with others this intimate aspect of their marriage.

  Why not? It's only natural for marriage mates to talk to someone about issues that they feel unsure about or want advice about.

  You can't talk about sex before marriage and they don't want you talking about sex after marriage. This can lead to serious problems.
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  60

  1/25 WT: Oral and Anal sex are a go - if she's ok with it

  by neat blue dog in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  he will not pressure her to engage in sexual acts that make her feel uncomfortable, that are demeaning, or that bother her conscience..... the bible does not provide details as to what sexual practices between a husband and a wife should be considered clean or unclean.

  a christian couple must make decisions that reflect their resolve to honor jehovah, to please each other, and to maintain a clean conscience.

  generally speaking, a couple would not discuss with others this intimate aspect of their marriage..

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  Listener

  What is happening to this religion?

  They used to teach that the man was the head of the house and what he decides goes.

  With this comment, they are saying if his decisions make her feel uncomfortable, are demeaning or that bother her conscience he should not pressure her to agree to them.

  Well done Watchtower.
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  16

  Explanation for changes to Disfellowshipping rules at Annual Meeting

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  wally, a youtuber from jw thoughts highlighted something that was said by kenneth cook jnr in the annual meeting.

  he thinks it may be removed before they publish the agm.

  i doubt we would see it in writing either.. part of kenneth's talk was about the changes regarding disfellowshipping and the clip from jw thoughts youtube shows him saying -.

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  Listener

  Here's Wally's Youtube where the above was taken from

  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy-Ok5TgIJU
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  16

  Explanation for changes to Disfellowshipping rules at Annual Meeting

  by Listener in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  wally, a youtuber from jw thoughts highlighted something that was said by kenneth cook jnr in the annual meeting.

  he thinks it may be removed before they publish the agm.

  i doubt we would see it in writing either.. part of kenneth's talk was about the changes regarding disfellowshipping and the clip from jw thoughts youtube shows him saying -.

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  Listener

  Wally, a Youtuber from JW Thoughts highlighted something that was said by Kenneth Cook Jnr in the Annual Meeting. He thinks it may be removed before they publish the AGM. I doubt we would see it in writing either.

  Part of Kenneth's talk was about the changes regarding disfellowshipping and the clip from JW Thoughts Youtube shows him saying -

  Well throughout the scriptures we see Jehovah's warm appeal to wrongdoers, urging them to repent At Zech 1:3 we read that Jehovah told his prophet "say to them this is what Jehovah of Armies says 'return to me declares Jehovah of armies and I will return to you'"
  But does our increased understanding of Jehovah's mercy here mean that his righteous and just standards have somehow been changed? So to answer a question from earlier, James 1:17 tells us that Jehovah does not vary or change and quoting Jehovah himself, Malachi 3:6 says "I am Jehovah, I do not change."
  So then, Jehovah does not change and his standards as to what is right or wrong has not changed. That is why recent adjustments to our view of God's mercy is just that - adjustments to our view for understanding. Have you been able to adjust? And because Jesus doesn't change, he still has the same desire to drive out what is bad.
  Since sin is still on the earth, the Elders will continue to remove unrepentant ones from the congregation...

  Wally then comments on the highlighted remark stating -

  So now we have a Governing Body member admitting that Jehovah has his standards and those are set, that his mindset, those are just set in stone and the adjustments that the GB make are, to their viewpoint, just that, adjustments to their viewpoint.
  He is explicitly saying that Jehovah isn't talking to the GB to make rules, Jehovah isn't leading the organization. When adjustments are made he is not saying that Jehovah is making the adjustment because Jehovah's standards are already set. He is saying that it is the GB just deciding and in my memory, I know they've talked about being fallible or getting things wrong but I don't remember them outright looking Jehovah's Witnesses in the eyeballs saying "when we make adjustments, it's just us making stuff up. God already has his standards, we don't really know what they are but (some) we just do the best we can.
  It was a very strange thing for him to say. I'm not entirely sure he knew exactly the implication of what he was getting at but I found it absolutely amazing because normally we would hear something like, 'oh no, we're fallible but you've just got to trust us because God is using us' Well now you're making it sound like God wasn't using you because if God had his standard already set and your adjustments are just you changing your mind than where is the correlation that God or Jesus is actually using the organization.
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  25

  "Brother Jodie jenelle began his bethel service in in 1990....."

  by nowwhat? in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  but what they don't say he left started and ran a real estate company and a global real estate consulting firm and apparently after making a fortune come back to bethel a few years ago.

  how in the hell could a non lifer now be anointed and appointed to be a gb member.

  sure can't be for his spiritual qualifications!.

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  Listener

  Drearyweather - By my association with the LDC and some projects, he has been one of the big brains behind a lot of property decisions in the past decade.

  Wow, Drearyweather, I had no idea that you were so important in the JW World to be privileged with secretive information.

  Could you advise what property decisions and personal involvement he had in them? Also, who are the other big brains behind those same properties?
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  25

  "Brother Jodie jenelle began his bethel service in in 1990....."

  by nowwhat? in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  but what they don't say he left started and ran a real estate company and a global real estate consulting firm and apparently after making a fortune come back to bethel a few years ago.

  how in the hell could a non lifer now be anointed and appointed to be a gb member.

  sure can't be for his spiritual qualifications!.

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  Listener

  I wonder if he left Bethel due to his wife becoming pregnant? Maybe they brought up one or two kids and started his businesses during that time. Since his kids would now be young adults, it would have enabled him to return.

  If he does have grown children, like Tony Morris, they could be Bethelites as well.
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  35

  Serious sinner?

  by Gorb in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  with the statement in the study watchtower this sunday, that stop serving jehovah is a serious sin, the following:.

  - can i conclude now, that we, (i, wife and 2 children), since 2008 pomo and no longer active in any religious activity, are serious sinners for jehovahs witnesses?.

  writing this in a watchtower, a statement like that, could have big implications.. it makes me so sad.

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  Listener

  Watchtower have made the worship of God into the worship of an earthly organisation. One they admit is imperfect.