Posts by Retrovirus

I hope your sister isn't a baptised jw? MY SIL is, and over the years she has changed a lot. She limits contact with me because I am "worldly" - that means, not a jw, and therefore "bad association".

That's not in the book, but just ask your jw contacts "could you have a close friend outside the religion?"

73

New Believers, Studying.

by cupcakekourtney88 in

jw
friends

hey y'all!

my name is kourtney and i am new to this form and jehovah witnesses.

right now i am studying the book "what does the bible really teach".

Retrovirus

Hi again Kourtney!

I'm at work and haven't got it with me but here are a few things:

1. evolution happened. The story of Noah's ark is a myth. If it were factual, think of the numbers of animals that would have had to evolve in 4000 years!

2. The Bible contains numerous internal contradictions. The first is between Genesis 1 and 2. (the order of creation). Would a loving, fatherly God give us such a confusion and then wipe out those who didn't interpret it "properly"?

3. "Jehovah" is not God's name. There was no "j" sound in hebrew. Also Jesus told us to call God "our father", not by a name.

There's plenty more. . . Retro

73

New Believers, Studying.

by cupcakekourtney88 in

jw
friends

hey y'all!

my name is kourtney and i am new to this form and jehovah witnesses.

right now i am studying the book "what does the bible really teach".

Retrovirus

Welcome, Kourtney!

I studied for several months and still have "What does the bible Really Teach".

I found many problems with the literature provided and am happy to go into detail if you wish. My jws could not answer them either, and chose to discontinue the sessions.

Remember that the Bible encourages peope to "make sure of all things" 1 Thess 5:21. If something is wrong, it's no good trying to stick with it because it is comforting or whatever.

There is a wealth of information on the net; I suggest jwfacts for a good start.

Most people here are no longer believing JWs. I will never become one either.

Retro

18

"Do You Think They Are Extremist Publications?" Well, Yes!

by metatron in

jw
friends

from the may 1 watchtower, complaining about those poor misunderstood witnesses in russia, who are (gasp!

) actually accused of being extremists!

can you imagine!.

Retrovirus

There is a distinction between "labelling them extremist" (fair enough, IMHO) and banning the religion (not only draconian but likely to backfire as it fuels their of persecution)

19

Making a fetish out of bible inerrancy

by Terry in

jw
friends

the catholic church dominated christianity for a thousand and a half years without any successful christian competitor.. challenges came and went, but, the central authority won out.. catholic power stemmed from a simple idea: peter was bestowed by jesus and installed as the first leader or pope.. peter, then, passed his authority down successively; one pope followed another.. the central authority of catholicism was magisterium.. if you don't know what magisterium means you might want to look hard at the definition:.

the divinely appointed authority in the catholic church consisting of the pope and bishops whose purpose is to teach and establish the true faith without error.

the magisterium alone, according to catholicism, has the right to interpret the word of god.. www.carm.org/catholic-terminology.

Retrovirus

Terry,

I really enjoy your posts, thanks! Have another!

But when you write By OVER stating the authority of scripture christianity has shattered like a brick through a plate glass window

Doesn't that leave out the Christians who do not believe the Bible to be inerrant? Or have I misunderstood?

Retro

48

JW ADVANTAGES vs DISADVANTAGES

by DesirousOfChange in

jw
friends

this earlier topic [why do it feel bad about my children leaving jw religion?

] is what causes me to ask this question:.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/208031/1/why-do-i-feel-bad-about-my-children-leaving-the-jw-religion.

Retrovirus

Desirous of Change wrote:

Courage is surely an understatement. Someone who has been in for decades feels like they have nothing else to turn to. It's all they know. If you're a 2nd, 3rd, or 4th generation JDub, surely much/most of your family is also "in". All of your friends are other JDubs. You have built a life revolving around JDub tradition. You have taken a stand on things with all your "worldly" peers at school or work or non-witness family. Maybe you have "recruits" in that respect you for "all that you are" in the Truth.....

Then BAM! Something awakens you.........you start looking at things critically (oh, oh, the WT warns about those who are critical -- it's the first sign)..... you take off the blinders and.........(that's where I am).......

.............well you know the rest.

How long does this period of denial last?

How long before you get over the concern that everything bad happening in your life is divine justice?

DOC I agree, entirely, courage is too small a word. Yet Martin Luther once said "Here I stand; I can do no other".

The WT warns about those who are critical - yet the Bible asks for critical thought - "examine all things; hold fast to those which are fine". Great change for good has been brought about by those who refused to have their thinking controlled by governments and religions, but followed their conscience.

As a non-jw I cannot say how long denial lasts. I stayed in denial about some family stuff for decades before I was forced to deal with it . The delay didn't help one bit.

There are books and sites that will help with the concern that everything bad happening in your life is divine justice. They are frequently referred to on this site. You'll realise by now that God either loves all of us or none - not a particular religion.

I wish you all good things, and encouragement, strength and support on your journey. . Happy to talk any time you'd like to.

Retro

48

JW ADVANTAGES vs DISADVANTAGES

by DesirousOfChange in

jw
friends

this earlier topic [why do it feel bad about my children leaving jw religion?

] is what causes me to ask this question:.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/208031/1/why-do-i-feel-bad-about-my-children-leaving-the-jw-religion.

Retrovirus

This is an interesting subject; I'll try for a more focussed post this time . . .

But, all things considered, are there more advantages than disadvantages?

There are aspects that would feel like advantages. The satisfaction of belonging to an elite group, the security of clear rules and regulations (at any one time), the comfort of routine and community. Misery's posts in particular give a warm picture of the jw community.

The big disadvantage I see would be the doubts. I cannot imagine that any jw with a reasonable education wouldn't have them. Answers like "wait upon Jehovah" and "more meetings and service" couldn't wipe them out. It would be like seeing things out of the corner of your eye but being forbidden to turn your head and look.

Young people most of all would be hampered by never being allowed to test their own judgement and initiative. And if for any reason you finally could no longer live by someone elses' rules, well, those are covered every day in the forum. The choice between living a lie and losing family, friends and community to live in a world you have been taught to fear.

I am in awe of the courage of those who take this step.

48

JW ADVANTAGES vs DISADVANTAGES

by DesirousOfChange in

jw
friends

this earlier topic [why do it feel bad about my children leaving jw religion?

] is what causes me to ask this question:.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/jw/friends/208031/1/why-do-i-feel-bad-about-my-children-leaving-the-jw-religion.

Retrovirus

DOC, just a thought from a non-jw:

I'm a single parent with two grown children. When they were young, I would have loved to have the feeling of security of a community with consistent standards, regular meetings etc. I felt as if I had to make up my rules as I went, and that I had little or no authority as a parent.

Having read a lot here and on other sites, I now think that "feeling of security", a sort of security blanket perhaps? cannot be confused with actual security. The ability to think clearly and say what I think is very much part of who I am.

I keep in touch with the jw ladies who "studied" with me; they are very pleasant and honest people. I wish we could be friends but they keep their distance as I have failed to progress. There must be something there for them.

Retro

21

Finally out!

by fade_away in

jw
friends

i've been loggin in to this site for about 3 or 4 months on an almost daily basis.

i decided to finally make an account cause i just have to vent and connect with those who have been in my shoes.

"worldly" people don't understand completely when i talk to them about the hardship of being born into a religion/cult, growing up with people making decisions for me, and having them choose my future, goals, and dreams; all the while sacrificing normal childhood joys and replacing them with study, service hours, and 5 minute talks.

Retrovirus

Welcome, fade_away!

Congratulations to you both on seeing the org for what it is, and being able to make the move now, while you still have your lives before you. You are right not to allow emotional pressure from others, even your parents, to keep you from living your own life.

I'm a "worldly" who "studied" but couldn't believe. I saw how my SIL (born out but baptised in late 20s; still in) changed from being feisty, secure and independant to becoming a wt parrot with anxiety attacks. Also lost her as a friend because I didn't make "progress"; all friendships are conditional on being in good standing.

Keep learning and welcome to the real world!

Retro