Posts by DesirousOfChange

49

told my parents to never ever tell me they love me again....

by oompa in

jw
friends

...i told them in a very serious sitdown in their living room....said..."because if you cant show it then it does not count...that is not real love no matter who tells you it is....because it is how it makes me feel that determines if it is love....not if you just say it...and me and my sons do not feel that love at all now"....and i stayed calm and talked slowly and barely shed a tear as i held them back...and i had asked them to not say a word but just listen...dad said they would as long as it was not about religion as i knew he would.

this was two of the worst days of my life in a row..i told them the pain me and my boys feel from their shunning is worse than if they had died...that then i could grieve naturally and move on because that is normal....grief helps you cope...my grief is different because they choose to act like i am dead and normal grief does not seem to work on that.

i shared an epiphany with them i had about mens rules vs gods great idea of dna (but no i am not sure about a god anymore)it went kinda like this:.

DesirousOfChange

Love should be a verb not a concept.

LOVE is supposed to be the identifying feature of true Christianity -- of Christ's true disciples.

Ask any 'worldly person" what they know about JWs.

JWs are known around the world for their SHUNNING. NOT their display of love.

Just recently they started expanding their relief efforts to help others beyond just JWs during disasters.

They discovered that it's good PR. They needed to do some serious PR work,. . .

. . . BECAUSE THEY ARE NOT KNOWN FOR THEIR DISPLAY OF LOVE.

DOC

19

JW's - Hard to admit that much of life was a waste

by xelder in

from my observations, i think many (especially older) jw's hold through the stupid doctrinal changes because they can't admit the alternative.. i had wished the jw kingdom hope was true, i needed it to be true.

i'm 5th generation and my parents, grandparents, great grand.....ect needed it to be true.

i have watched many "faithful" relatives hang on and die disappointed.

DesirousOfChange

One passed up a better job to not miss meetings.

(What a dumb@$$)

They are told that by still remaining faithful and never giving up on their (lost) hope, that even if they do not survive into the New World they will be resurrected and wake up into it, just like it happened tomorrow and as if they were only asleep for the night.

DOC

5

African-American on Governing Body

by Band on the Run in

living in the world for some time, the photographs of the gb with all the very old, geeky, white men seem strange.

america no longer looks like that-even mad men has the gal copywriter.

what is the story behind the black man?

DesirousOfChange

How did he work his way to the GB?

Sam was chosen by God's Holy Spirit to be on the Governing Body.

You need to understand that Holy Spirit was racially prejudiced until late in the 20th Century.

Still that way against women.

DOC

2

Are elders simply procedural scapegoats?

by Silent_Scream in

the watchtower constantly talks about elders doing everything "in love" and being reasonable and balanced, and not being masters over their brothers' faith (hypocritically).. but when elders receive specific direction from co and training from schools and letters, they go over mostly procedures, procedures, rules, how to obey the gb and if the friends dont like it, too bad because its from jah's organization.

and procedures.

so they are trained to go by the book, and if love can be shown, cool.

DesirousOfChange

FREE LABOR just like the pubs who sell the literature

18

Prediction: Expect a change in Study Edition distribution

by baltar447 in

jw
friends

after all the hoopla over the "mentally diseased" stuff, i'm making a prediction.

i expect that the borg will stop distributing the koolaid wt online, at least to where anyone can download it.

i expect that they will require the jws to create logins and passwords to access the study edition, somehow tying that that back to what congregataion you're in and maybe even an elder approving that you attend.

DesirousOfChange

Having the study edition available to the public online shows it is not a secret edition.

Plus they have learned that there are NO secrets.

DOC

78

Do you sense that the Watchtower will implode?

by AK - Jeff in

since leaving the organization 8 years ago, there have been more significant changes in the actual, physical activities of the organization than occurred in all the 40 plus years i was 'in'.

bethel closings.

bethel layoffs.

DesirousOfChange

Past leaders were charismatic, tough-minded, or great organizers. Nobody like that is in charge now.

And it was those past leaders who chose who would be added to their powerful inner circle of "leaders". Since they did not want to threaten or undermine their own position of power, they chose men less qualified, less charismatic, less in every (or most) qualities of leadership. Now that the older, original guys have finished their earthly course, WT is left with the 2nd string now at the plate -- who presently seem to be prone to making bad calls, striking out, and fumbling the ball, and totally botching any kind of Public Relations.

I think JWs were once percieved as peculiar but were respected. Their hate-inspired policies are causing them to lose the respect that they once had from outsiders

DOC

15

BORN-INS: If you could go back and Change this.

by hirotaka in

jw
friends

a question primarily derected to born-ins....doesn't matter if you're still in or out.. if you could go back in time, let's say to the time you were a teenager, before being baptised.. do you regret not telling your jw parents that you just couldn't do the jw thing anymore and that you wanted out?

i think about this often that it may have worked out much better not to get baptized, married to a jw, and have to tow that line for decades, feaful to loose family and friends.. in the end that's what happened to me anyway, five years ago and now i have the life i should have had my whole life.. what are your thoughts and feelings on this?.

cheers.

DesirousOfChange

If you could go back in time, let's say to the time you were a teenager, before being baptised. Do you regret not telling your JW parents that you just couldn't do the JW thing anymore and that you wanted out?

See, that is a tough question, and a lot of furror might come from this answer. I think my brother and I were more successful in life in avoiding problems than were our closest friends and family members (cousins). We were both baptized (too) early. And I no longer think that is the right approach for born-in children because of the harsh shunning policy. In our time, did it keep us stricter in line with JW morality? Maybe.But lots of JDubs had serious problems too.

Other non-religious family members who ridiculed the JW side of the family, most have had kids in jail, murdered, committ suicide, drug convictions, multiple divorces, illigimate kids..... Of SEVEN JW kids, none of us had any of the above except one divorce -- by the DFd sibling. Of the other (non-JW) family members, only two (of 8) went on to college and good careers as a result. Some of the others did OK without it thanks to the union trades or their own businesses. I am as successful financially as most of them. (My brother was killed in an accident in his late teens.)

I regret not going to college. Unusual since our dad was a college graduate. (Raised non-JW.) I still did OK in life in most respects, but could have had greater opportunity with a degree. Yet, I did not get involved in many things that could have derailed my success and happiness in life, as compared to my peers.

I think the advantage I had is that my parents were moderates as far as JDubs are concerned. Nothing extreme. No coleporters. No pioneers. No concern about us not going to Bethel. Able to overlook or understand us growing up as normal teenagers with normal teenager problems and curiosity -- booze, partys, even dating -- but supposedly not past 1st base.

Biggest regrets: College. Years of deception that there was Hocus Pocus divine direction and "infallibility".

The folks are still captives of the concept. Better to let them live out their lives that way.

DOC

24

The GB Knew What They Were Doing

by compound complex in

jw
friends

i believe that the governing body knew very well what would be the consequences of publishing the above article on apostates.

they carefully word every article, not only for the faithful, but for the unfaithful, and for those who have never believed our faith.

the above article and the comments here show me their great wisdom, because they have achieved exactly what they wanted.

DesirousOfChange

I don't think they contemplated this.

Last thing the WTS wants is more legal problems.

Actually, that's the SECOND TO LAST thing they want.

LAST THING they want is judgements or settlements to pay in lawsuits.

DOC

55

Do your elders care at all?

by Mr. Falcon in

i currently have an elder body who, for the most part, seems utterly complacent and disinterested in actually "shepherding" anything.

i can't tell if they are lazy or just oblivious to their responsiblities of being "teachers".

it seems like they are the last to know anything and always procrastinate on everything.

DesirousOfChange

Do your elders care at all?

NO. Pinky, your father goes back to the "old days" when I think most really did care.

Today. It's just a title for most.

There are families in our Hall without a shepherding call for 8 years. One of the men in one such family is disabled. Wife caring for him, kids, work, house, etc.

There's a divorced brother who was reproved for fornication 6 years ago. Still on restrictions. Never contacted again by committee members. He committed fornication again, (GEEZ, twice $%#ed in 6 years), reported to elders, they didn't remember that he had been reproved 6 years ago. BUT, because it was his 2nd offense, they PUBLICLY reproved him this time, even though NO ONE had any knowledge of the transgression.

Elders are too busy......

.....too busy making a living; too busy building new homes; too busy traveling (hubby on golf, fishing, or hunting trips; wives on cruises or to Vegas); OK, some travel to international conventions all over the world; too busy schmoozing with CO/DO to get Assm/Conv part;

Easier to just disfellowship problem publishers than make shepherding calls. YAWN!

DOC

7

Shoot from the hip witnessing and the calm before the storm?

by donny in

one of my co-workers here (a non-baptized, non-attending meeting son of a jw) told me yesterday that his jw cousin told him that the end is right at the doorstep because of the calm and complacency seen not only in the "world" but also in the congregation.

he told him that this "lack of zeal" was not due to a lack of love for jehovah, but was gods way of fulfilling prophecy.

the jw cousin then went on to cite the example of the folks of noah's time when everyone was partying and having a good time and suddenly the flood came and that was all she wrote.

DesirousOfChange

his JW cousin told him that the end is right at the doorstep because of the calm and complacency seen not only in the "world" but also in the congregation.

He himself is a testimony to the fact that it is NOT near.

(Matthew 24:44) . . .On this account YOU too prove yourselves ready, because at an hour that YOU do not think to be it, the Son of man is coming.

He said it: It's right at the doorstep. That means IT IS NOT! Jesus said so. I believe Jesus no your JW cousin.

DOC