You could come with me, since I see you are in California, but then we also have to go my friend's Passover Seder right afterwards and I would be worried that it might be your Last Supper :-)
-Eduardo
Oroborus21
JoinedPosts by Oroborus21
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9
A guestion for the men out there
by WildHorses inwhat do think would be a fair price on a used riding lawn mower?
it's a 2000 poulan pro with a 17hp motor 42 inch cutting width and a brigs and scraton motor.
(not sure if this is exacty right but it's how i heard it over the phone) .
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Oroborus21
hey that's a presumptuous question, might be a lot of ladies knowledgeable on the subject. why not google it up and see what is currently being offered for such a mower...then you will know what the market is..
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35
Anyone else awake????
by lola28 in.
it's almost one am and i can't sleep, anyone else here?.
lola
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Oroborus21
yeah, but thinking about bed, a book, or something else though. why aren't you sleepy?
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102
What's the funniest/strangest name you ever gave a pet?
by JH in.
i was given a cat whose name was "piti".
i found it strange, but i kept it.
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Oroborus21
true, true, I guess I feel like T.S. Eliott that every cat has a secret name which only they know.....
with the vet's it is like trying to deal with a government agency or your cable company who insists on knowing your Social Security number...
-eduardo
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102
What's the funniest/strangest name you ever gave a pet?
by JH in.
i was given a cat whose name was "piti".
i found it strange, but i kept it.
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Oroborus21
my cat doesn't have a name, or at least he hasn't told it to me. a lot of people think that is weird and when we go to the vet they insist on trying to give him a name, usually "mr cat". It is like they won't treat him if he doesn't have a name. weirdos.
-eduardo
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35
Anyone else awake????
by lola28 in.
it's almost one am and i can't sleep, anyone else here?.
lola
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Oroborus21
yeah but like yourself I am in California, plus the whole daylight savings time thng. but I haven't been sleeping much these past few weeks anyway...
-eduardo
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8
JW Court Testimony
by zagor in.
...just finished watching it for the first time, not sure what to think of it.. the most interesting was the end and elder's flip-flopping of what is current truth what is an old truth and what is apostate material .... or is it all the same.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2o4lbgx81u.
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Oroborus21
Greetings,
thanks for posting this. I don't know if this has been around on the Net before but it was the first time that I saw it.
It seems evident that this was divorce proceeding, with some children involved i think and the elder was called by the man (JW) as an "expert witness."
a couple of comments about the elder's testimony:
- His testimony that disfellowshipping is considered during the baptismal preparation/questions with bible studies gives the impression that the subject is covered in depth. While there is or might be some very superficial covering of the topic, usually in the light of how the DF'ng both set's JWS apart from other orgs and also how it helps to "keep the congregaton clean" - the fact is that the social, mental, emotional and psychological ramifications are never fully discussed with new or potential converts. This remains a big area in need of further discussion and reform with how it is covered in the indoctrinating process.
- Further along those lines, the elder testified that DF'ng (shunning) was as far as he knew a common practice among many other religions. It is a practice among many religous faiths and churches but it is also a very rare practice among some of these and among most others excommunication or DF'ng is either not a practice or only the very exceptional cases. Further, a difference could have been highlighted the woman's attorney which would have illustrated that a JW could and probably would be DF'd for speaking against the church but in most others the members would not be.
- They spent a lot of time on the Christmas issue when that is such a minor thing compared to Blood Doctrine
testimony that should have been brought out by the attorney for the woman: (granted not sure this testimony wasn't brought out by other witnesses or the parties but still while they had the elder on the stand they should have brought this out.)
- he missed the opportunity to explore the specific and likely situations that might arise. He could have asked question such as "How would you advise or what would be your advice to Mr. so-and-so (the man) if his wife wanted to baptize their child in another religion or take them to religions services, or celebrate holidays, or MOST IMPORTANTLY authorize a blood transfusion for the child
- No testimony on the blood issue?
- The attorney could have easily had one of the Kingdom Ministries handy where the availability of the child-custody package was announced as being available from Bethel. He also could have had the package and shown it to the witness. Since he had none of these it made him lose some credibility and that whole testimony was pointless
- Simlarly, it illustrated that attorneys (especially those who are going to be attacking JW witnesses need to have and cite the exact publication. With the exact citation, or better yet the publication in hand, it would be hard for a witness to deny or circumlocute away the questioning. The attorney referred to the "Organizatonal manual" which might have meant the old Organized book, the new publication or maybe even the Flock book, or something else. Again, by not citing the publication correctly, the year published etc. it did nothing for his client. On the other hand providing that citation (or the child custody package together with the announcements of it in the Our Kingdom Ministry), if the witness denied the existence of such, it would take away from his "expertise" and if he recognized them or acknowledged them, then presumably there was a further point to be made or explored.
comments on the attorneys:
- personally I thought both attorneys were terrible at handling this witness. they both could have made even better use of the witness.
- I was really surprised that the judge allowed the attorney to remain near the witness and question him like that, normally, they want you to return to the lectern, (actually you are supposed to have a copy for the witness and your own at the lectern. he said that it was his only copy which is why I suppose the judge allowed him some leeway to remain standing there, but a few times, I foudn his presence antagonisic and if I were the opposing I would have asked the judge to have him return)
- I also found his slouching at the lectern to be pretty unprofessional, but maybe these guys are all well-known (judges and attorneys) and since there was no jury to impress it didn't matter much, but I would be concerned about it if I were the woman and that was my attorney
other:
Thanks again for the info. after seeing, this I want to first ask the Forum whether there are any attorneys or even non-attorneys who have already prepared a "counter-guide" to the Society's child-custody package for opposing counsel? Blondie? Randy/Dogpatch? West? anyone?
If not, I am interested in developing a counter-guide for use in divorce and child-custody cases for attorneys. Would the other attorney forum participants be interested in such a project? Interested in co-authoring with me or in reviewing? Kim? (those who have told me in private that they are attorneys?) If so please pm me.
thanks again,
Eduardo
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48
A fact that debunks the dubs statement of this being ''the last memorial''
by kittyeatzjdubs ini was reading coc last night and i started pondering over minimus' post of how the dubs are saying this is the last memorial and the end is finally here.
then i remembered the teaching that the first setoff to the big a. any thoughts on this?.
luv, jojo
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Oroborus21
Min,
now you are being disingenuous. Your original post: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/6/110528/1.ashx
suggests that there is something unique "this year." Yet by your own admission, you state that you hear such statements every year or quite often. If that is the case then it would hardly be worth mention on the forum that you yet again heard such statements.
That would be like if I created a thread whose topic was, "hey I heard JW's say 'Armageddon was just around the corner'"
-Eduardo
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30
What is now the most accurate Bible to buy??
by WingCommander innow that i've read ray franz's part about how his uncle and others with little actual greek or hebrew training translated the bible into the nwt, i've been interested in finding the best bible out there is correctly translated by people who know what the hell they are talking about.
niv?
i've also been looking at other religions lately, ones that are "somewhat" close to the jw's teachings to an extent, and have been interested in seventh day adventists.
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Oroborus21
Jaredg, not sure if you were just kidding or not, but there are NO original scrolls extant. There is not a single original manuscript or even 1st generation copy of any of the Hebrew or Christian Greek scriptures available to us that were written by the original authors/writers/redactors.
-Eduardo
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30
What is now the most accurate Bible to buy??
by WingCommander innow that i've read ray franz's part about how his uncle and others with little actual greek or hebrew training translated the bible into the nwt, i've been interested in finding the best bible out there is correctly translated by people who know what the hell they are talking about.
niv?
i've also been looking at other religions lately, ones that are "somewhat" close to the jw's teachings to an extent, and have been interested in seventh day adventists.
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Oroborus21
You should get a few different ones for your library. To this add some of the CD-ROM collections that are out there. I found one for like 10 bucks that includes a number of bible translations and commentaries. Then there are many that are online, bookmark those.
Take all of those and compare the different versions whenever you want to figure out something in particular. If possible read some commentaries too.
If you really want to delve into it consult some concordances and Greek and Hebrew lexicons.
Pretty much everything is commented upon on the Internet so you can always Google it up too.
After all of that you will have as good of an understanding as is reasonable short of really getting scholarly.
By the way, it wouldn't hurt to learn about how the Bible Canon came about, read some of Bart Erhman's and others' books, learn about the Documentary Hypothesis, and learn some of the history of the translations and how they were done. Knowing something about the Manuscripts used by the translators is helpful too.
Pray about your understanding too.
For pure reading pleasure that is subjective. Some like reading Chaucery Old English style stuff and others want a modern take, even one of the politically correct sterilized of all patriarchal, gender-blind, versions of the bible. To each his own.
-Eduardo