Posts by oanai

103

The "Ransom Sacrifice" short version.

by Norm in

jw
friends

in the christian part of the world not many of us have escaped the much hyped and published sacrifice christ supposedly made when the romans executed him.. i myself was going around for years parroting this strange concept without giving it much thought.

thinking and faith some times do not mix very well.. anyway, apparently god made a royal blunder when he created the first humans and they plunged mankind into death and despair first crack out of the box, while god stood by and watched helplessly.

then we are told that god for this reason, in his infinite wisdom took mankind for ransom for thousands of years.

oanai

aChirstian:

I do not believe anything I wrote is misleading in anyway.

I'm sorry you don't see that. Now I can see why the GB of JWs can go back and claim that others read too much into their literature. Maybe they truly didn't see their own mistakes, and considering themselves God-directed, they felt mistakes as imposibilities.

AlanF wrote:

Really, by rounding off numbers too much, you've pulled a bit of a trick on yourself. The number 400 does seem rather magical until you look at the actual figures involved:
Moon:
Diameter : 2159 miles
Avgerage distance from center of moon to center of earth: 238,854 mi.
Minimum perigeee: 221,438 mi.
Maximum apogee: 252,724 mi.
Sun:
Diameter: 864,950 mi.
Average distance from center of sun to center of earth: 92,890,000 mi.
Minimum perihelion: 91,400,000 mi.
Maximum aphelion: 94,500,000 mi.
From these figures it’s clear that the ratio of the sun/earth and moon/earth distances varies from about 362 to 427, with an average of 389 – not 400. It’s clear that your statement, “the moon is precisely the correct size to cover the face of the sun as seen from the earth” is somewhat misleading.

aChristian, I don't mean to be taking sides in a debate, but I really wish you would consider more about what AlanF is saying. (Although I cannot say I blame you as your argument does seem to be falling apart, IMO.)

103

The "Ransom Sacrifice" short version.

by Norm in

jw
friends

in the christian part of the world not many of us have escaped the much hyped and published sacrifice christ supposedly made when the romans executed him.. i myself was going around for years parroting this strange concept without giving it much thought.

thinking and faith some times do not mix very well.. anyway, apparently god made a royal blunder when he created the first humans and they plunged mankind into death and despair first crack out of the box, while god stood by and watched helplessly.

then we are told that god for this reason, in his infinite wisdom took mankind for ransom for thousands of years.

oanai

Hey aChristian (Mike):

Thank you SO MUCH for being honest and at least admitting that some of your more interesting observations are as speculative as those of many of what you would call "evolutionists".

In reference to Mars, you stated much about distances from the sun and the importance of the number 4 biblically (what happened to 7?) but I fail to see how finding life on another planet is a sign from Jesus. Since Mars, or Akarak, as it's ancient name goes was not mentioned in the Bible, I simply don't understand it's relevance to Earth. Since Earth was made to be populated by US, one would either have to speculate that God had a different purpose in mind for Mars (a planet within this solar system), or speculate that life exists where the conditions are "fruitful".

It's interesting to see how creationists will continue on dispite new scientific discoveries. Folks like you will keep the faith going on into the 22nd and 23rd century. Although this sounds like a haughty retort, I truly mean it. Imagine how much harder life would be if people had no hope for the future or a reason to exist (besides living until you die).

With sensible people like you around, maybe everyone WON'T panic and think they are seeing satan's angels on the day that we finally do meet up with another terrestrial civilization, despite what the brooking's report recommended to nasa. (They did recommend hiding the fact from us if we ever did find evidence of past life on other planets, as surely society would collapse.)

Oh, one more thing:

"For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God."
(1 Cor. 1:18)

Are you trying to convince me or reassure yourself?

55

Biblical Inerrancy

by Francois in

jw
friends

is there any denial that at 1 kings 7:23, the value of pi is ascertained as 3.000?.

and where does this leave the idea that the bible is inspired in every word, jot, and tittle by god?

just wondering.. any takers?.

oanai

arneim:

Thanks for all the responses. The research you've done looks great.

An Observation:

You as a creationist have more in common with an evolutionist than you think. I've noticed in your previous posts that you make many postulations (sp?) regarding the Bible. (Not unlike the scientific process a theory goes through before it is accepted by mainstream scientists.)

At least you are both human.

103

The "Ransom Sacrifice" short version.

by Norm in

jw
friends

in the christian part of the world not many of us have escaped the much hyped and published sacrifice christ supposedly made when the romans executed him.. i myself was going around for years parroting this strange concept without giving it much thought.

thinking and faith some times do not mix very well.. anyway, apparently god made a royal blunder when he created the first humans and they plunged mankind into death and despair first crack out of the box, while god stood by and watched helplessly.

then we are told that god for this reason, in his infinite wisdom took mankind for ransom for thousands of years.

oanai

aC:

Hey buddy.

What is your view of the homosexual sex that African Gorillas sometimes share amongst each other? (male and female)

BTW, If you want references, I can't give them to you, as I saw it on the Discovery Channel.

117

Identity of 'Spiritual Israel'

by Jr in

in order to qualify as spiritual israel there has to be certain fundamental characteristics or basic truths.

these basic truths are revealed in the law covenant given by moses.

and can be traced down from the nation of israel, down through the 1st century congregation, and further down until our day and time.

oanai

Thanks for the input Emiliano. (Thanks for the comprehensive answer also.)

quote:
if someone here is makeing you feel that by what they've said I wouldn't let it bother me...

Nah, nobody's making me feel that way. I was just asking, as always.

117

Identity of 'Spiritual Israel'

by Jr in

in order to qualify as spiritual israel there has to be certain fundamental characteristics or basic truths.

these basic truths are revealed in the law covenant given by moses.

and can be traced down from the nation of israel, down through the 1st century congregation, and further down until our day and time.

oanai

Emiliano:

With all of your love and devotion to God, how does it make you feel to know that others on this board would tell you that no matter how much love and devotion you have to God, you will be destroyed by the same God that you so profess to love because of your lack of association with the ones who feel themselves to be in his favor?

Would it be your guilt by association, or their guilt by assumption?

Edited by - oanai on 29 March 2001 10:51:47

28

Babylon the great

by perfectpie in

jw
friends

does anyone have an explanation of "babylon the great" as described in the book of revelation different than as explained by jehovah's witnesses.

thanks in advance pie

oanai

logical:

kes152 said:

Much like Christendom, the Jehovah's witnesses including the WT organization never claimed to be in the new covenant mediated by Jesus Christ.

Then you replied:

This is true. But, the WTS are deliberately...

First of all, not counting the "Christendom" folks who DO partake of the bread and the wine at every memorial because they DO consider themselves in a covenant with Christ, I will say that it is histerically funny to see the likes of you and others with prophetic notions have to go to GREAT DETAIL to tell someone what they "really believe" and then debunk what you just told them they believe. It's almost like a strawman argument.

I have heard a witness say to me before: "You don't know what you believe!" I ask them: "Oh, and you DO know what I believe?" And the response is: "Yes I do, and it is wrong." ROTFLMAO.

Then they proceed to "explain" to me what I "really believe". They then argue against what they've told me I believe.

Logical, I think you and "mds" are doing the same thing to other witnesses/ex-witnesses, etc. I also think that kes152 is doing the same thing to you. I also think you are sidestepping issues just like "christiandom" does whenever a witness knocks on the door. You sidestep what you cannot immediately refute on your OWN terms.

Utterly hilarious (sp!) it is to see totally different mindsets being so much alike.

Now back to my main point. If what kes152 has said was TRUE, as you stated, why have you neglected to answer the remainder of his argument?

Is this "too trivial" for "mds" to be bothered with?
If so, then I would say that it is very convienient.

29

i have a question

by willy_think in

jw
friends

my farther is a jw, my mother is rc i am neither.

i have done a study of world beliefs from, atheist to zoraster.

this includes many wtbts writings, old & new.

oanai

JanH, you said:

The worst you can do, is to talk about "freemasonary" symbols. As far as I know, no such things exist.

From what I've discovered, you are mostly correct regarding "freemasonry" symbols. True masons (those who use more than just the Bible) claim to have their own symbols that OTHER cultures adopted a VERY long time ago.

Freemasons use all sorts of symbols from all cultures and religions; being very syncretistic. The "cross and crown" which many now claim are freemasonary symbols can be found on many 19th century religious books and magazines.

That's probably because many of those books and magazines were published by freemasons. (Remember, we are talking about a 'secret society' here who do not believe in spouting their beliefs in open forums for others to absorb.)

I have on good authority that this is not a symbol a freemason will normally be terribly familiar with.

No, not normally. However true masons who are at the third degree or higher would recognize the symbols, as they are a very intricate part of their belief system.

41

THE TEST WAS POSITIVE

by LDH in

jw
friends

i am preggers.. just left the doctor's office and my hubby's office.

i dropped the little plastic thing-a-ma-jig off, and he said, "what's this?

are you pregnant?!?!?!?".

oanai

LDH:

Good for you!

CONGRATS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

26

Freddie I'm still waiting

by buscar in

jw
friends

freddie i asked you explain some of the cr#p you regurgitated earlier.. i'm still waiting for your answers.

aren't you able to defend your god the watchtower corporation against some simple questions?.

i'm sure if you went to the elders and told them some interested person you met on the internet wanted answers they would help you to make a good witness for the organisation.. why not ask them fred after all they are there to help you.

oanai

ROTF, LMAO,

:)