this is a continuation of the discussion which sprang from an unrelated topic.. so according to genesis, who told the first lie?
god told eve that if she ate from the tree of knowledge she would die that very same day.
in response to that statement the devil told her she would not die.. eve ate from the tree and did not die.
This Thread has reminded me of the time a JW dad was trying to instil in his son the need to always tell the truth, so dad asked his son "Who told the first Lie ?", and his little son promptly replied "Rosie", referring to his little friend who had lied an hour or so before.
Dad gave up with the Lesson for the time being, he was laughing too much !
there was a knock at my door and i thought it was my take-away being delivered.. long story short, it was 2 elders calling to see me.
i guess to re-activate me.
once they said who they were i recognised them.
I think the only way they could reactivate me is to enforce a Frontal Lobotomy !
there was a knock at my door and i thought it was my take-away being delivered.. long story short, it was 2 elders calling to see me.
i guess to re-activate me.
once they said who they were i recognised them.
Great to hear from you Paul ! and good to hear you are looking after yourself with a healthy Diet ! LOL.
I wonder if your visit was a one off, or if perhaps as C.O's go round they are pushing Elders to do a tidying up ?
Two Elders at your door does not mean the ONLY reason they are there is to re-activate you !
If they could get someone they call on to say something they could condemn them for, they would do it like a shot, nice and tidy, Box Ticked.
I wish you all the best for the future, drop back in here from time to time, are you still playing ? either for yourself or maybe a Band ?
so: the mystery has been clarified as to more "new light" / clarifications of decades old doctrine and procedure.
august watchtower has finally been leaked.
disfellowshipping?
It is purely motivated by $$$ this move, they hope to obfuscate what their Shunning and Disfellowshipping Policies and Practice REALLY are by re-labelling them for when they are challenged in Courts.
They used to get away with this in the Past, but now with quality Witnesses testifying under Oath about these egregious practices, the Courts will be able to easily see that those things deny basic Human Rights to J.W's and ex-J.W's. And no doubt contravene Rights under many national Laws.
With any move the Org. makes, always follow the $$$.
big news.
just in from a friend who is fading.. disfellowshipping will no longer be a term used by jws.
study article 35, paragraph 4 footnote says this:.
The "Devil" does not appear in the Eden Story, this Story was plagiarised from a Canaanite/Sumerian one, the Devil is not in their religious thinking.
"the satan" only came in to Israelite religious thought while the Exiles were in Babylon, and came from Zoroastrian ideas prevalent in Babylon, along with other new Spirits, such as Angels and Demons, and other new religious ideas.
Hence Judaism was born, a very different religion form that of the pre-Exile Israelites.
On the Thread subject, the J.W org have an almighty cheek in putting on the cover a Pic. of the "Prodigal Son", how does ANY of the J.W Practice of Shunning and DFing fit the lessons of that Parable ?
Massive Liars and Hypocrites all, the J.W Org.
it was translated so make sure everything looks ok.. 2024-08-august-edition of watchtower magazine.. .
https://smallpdf.com/result#r=c90d948913ed99d72872c0a1c609f388&t=share-document .
leopold.
Thank you Grandpa !
it has been occasionally mentioned on this forum how the flood stories (j,p) interrupt the flow of the narrative of j (conventional name for primary narrative source for the primeval history) and create plot holes.
note how the removal of the flood stories leaves an unbroken narrative:.
28 when lamech had lived 182 years, he had a son.
Thanks PP, it has long been obvious that Genesis is an Editorial mess, they had no concept of actually reading it as later Scholars would obviously, but you would have thought someone would have read it through and smoothed it out somewhat.
What you have pointed us to in the above Links is proof that at some time efforts were made to make the thing not so full of errors and contradictions in the Story. But, it is STILL a mess !
The not much later Greek Myths , though I have not read them with any other intention than enjoying the Stories, and that was many decades ago, but from memory, they do not seem to be as woefully contradictory and full of redactions and interpolations as Genesis and other Bible Works are.
What is satisfying is when we can identify Interpolations with zero doubt, but we have then quite often the problem of deciding when these changes were made, and then the added problem is what exactly the editors are trying to say ? what was in their minds ?
Regardless, I find this all fascinating stuff !
https://cne.news/article/4320-small-church-in-rome-goes-to-the-big-court-in-strasbourg-to-find-justice?push=null .
the evangelical church in rome will move to strasbourg to seek justice from the european court on human rights (ecthr) to eliminate the huge tax burden.
in the meantime, protestants all over the world are amazed by what is happening in italy..
Thanks for Posting Blondie !
This last paragraph is interesting, but simply stating the obvious, in the European Court the Case could go either way..
" It is still quite unpredictable what the effect of bringing the case to Strasbourg will be; a few things are certain. First, it can take years before the final decision is made. Second, it is very difficult to predict the outcome. The court is very reluctant regarding cases about religion. Since the relationship between church and state is different in all 47 member states, the court tends to uphold decisions by national courts."
https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/in-depth/520393/jehovah-s-witnesses-lose-court-fight-to-obtain-abuse-inquiry-report-before-victims .
new zealand in depth.
24 jun 2024. jehovah's witnesses lose court fight to obtain abuse inquiry report before victims.
Good , the Org wants to buy time to prepare some sort of "defense" against the findings, I doubt very much they have a decent Legal defense, but they want time to prepare an obfuscating and full of half-truths Public Statement.
jehovah's witnesses have tried - and failed - to get an advance copy of the abuse in care inquiry's final report into their church.. the christian congregation of jehovah's witnesses australasia (ccjwa) filed an urgent claim in the high court in auckland on 21 june to obtain a copy of the final case study relating to the religious denomination in the inquiry's report, but the claim was dismissed.. it also unsuccessfully sought all relevant underlying documents supporting the case study.. in a separate case, the jehovah's witnesses also filed for leave to appeal to the supreme court after the court of appeal dismissed an earlier bid to avoid the scrutiny of the inquiry altogether.. rnz understands the ccjwa received and commented on a draft copy of the case study in may, but has yet to see a final draft.. if its high court claim had been successful, it could have led to the church receiving a copy before the government or abuse survivors had read the report.. jehovah's witnesses is the only religious group to take legal action against the commission.. it has taken similar action against public inquiries overseas, including in australia and the united kingdom.. in a statement, a jehovah's witnesses spokesperson said it had no choice but to go to court.. "we are in full agreement with the inquiry's objective to protect children but have serious concerns about the accuracy of the report regarding jehovah's witnesses.. "child protection is of utmost concern to jehovah's witnesses and we believe the people of new zealand, its decision-makers and most importantly survivors, deserve to be presented with accurate information.
we have no choice but to resort to court to address these issues.".
the inquiry is due to hand its final report to the governor-general on wednesday, wrapping up six years of work.. after that, it will be passed to internal affairs brooke van velden, who must table the report in parliament before it is made public.. that was expected to happen in the week beginning 22 july.. survivors of church abuse new zealand spokesperson and former jehovah's witnesses elder shayne mechen said former jehovah's witnesses members and survivors had been angered by the new court action.. "they are feeling angry and frustrated because it shows they [the church] don't care.".
Thanks karter,
Evidently even a K.C. finds it hard to defend the indefensible, but it shows the desperation of the Org. the fact they are employing one, they so want to whitewash the shit covered wall that is now their Public facing one, but that may well be impossible.
This sort of case may well have a "Barbara Streisand Effect", I do hope so.
