Posts by peacefulpete

5

The Last will not be as bad you think

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/4sxc3gncea8?si=lrs70jrmduogxlwn.

hi guys today im considering the second part from david schafer's recent talk, where he goes through a few prophetic signs of the end and the most up to date understanding of the watchtower, i did cover on my last video the most up to date understanding on the "hailstone message" please go back and watch it and today im considering this very dangerous understanding the watchtower has developed recently that things can not get any worse.

of course, that's what happens when you isolate yourself as leadership from the daily struggle of your membership and you live carefree life in leafy upstate new york eirh everything paid for.

peacefulpete

Doomsayers prey upon the short sighted.

1

Pentecost with a Twist

by peacefulpete in

this is not going to be an in-depth research thread but a simple commentary.

most of us are aware the ot yahweh is at times referred to as a 'bull' or having horns of the auroch (wild bull).

the mighty heavenly cherubim (bulls) are said to pull his chariot.

peacefulpete

My last paragraph got deleted somehow, but in summation, Shavuot/Pentecost, rooted in ancient fertility/harvest festivals, had become adapted to celebrate the adoption of the Ten Commandments. That Festival involved a colorful joyful procession/parade with song and expressions of peace and well being. Gold and silver baskets filled with vegetal gifts. No reindeer, but a bull with golden horns and a crown.

Happy Holidays.

1

Pentecost with a Twist

by peacefulpete in

this is not going to be an in-depth research thread but a simple commentary.

most of us are aware the ot yahweh is at times referred to as a 'bull' or having horns of the auroch (wild bull).

the mighty heavenly cherubim (bulls) are said to pull his chariot.

peacefulpete

This is not going to be an in-depth research thread but a simple commentary. Most of us are aware the OT Yahweh is at times referred to as a 'bull' or having horns of the auroch (wild bull). The mighty heavenly Cherubim (bulls) are said to pull his chariot. His golden bulls held the great 'sea' basin in the Temple grounds. Iconography from the period illustrates Yahweh this way as well. The Calf/bull symbolism was a very common one in the ancient near east and beyond, and famously used by worshippers of gods from Egypt, Babylon, Cannan, and India. Naturally this wider, near universal usage of the powerful and important animal bothered some scribes and sects of Yahwism. Obviously not others.

Fast forward to the first century; the Festival of Weeks/Shavuot/Pentecost/Day of First Fruits was still celebrated in Jerusalem, as their ancient traditions had directed, 50 days after the Passover. The initial purpose of the festival was agrarian, it was a harvest festival thanking their God for the rain and fertility of the soil. But later the festival was also attached to the receiving of the 10 commandments on Mt. Sinai. That is significant given the way the festival was celebrated.

The NT doesn't detail how this was done, (neither to endorse nor condemn.) It does make clear that early Christians celebrated it. Famously of course the story in Acts where disciples of Jesus were gathered from far away to Jerusalem for the Pentecost celebration.

I hope you enjoy the following from the Mishna Bikkurim 3:

Those who lived near [Jerusalem] would bring fresh figs and grapes, while those who lived far away would bring dried figs and raisins. An ox would go in front of them, his horns bedecked with gold and with an olive-crown on its head. The flute would play before them until they would draw close to Jerusalem. When they drew close to Jerusalem they would send messengers in advance, and they would adorn their bikkurim (small bundles of wheat or other produce). The governors and chiefs and treasurers [of the Temple] would go out to greet them, and according to the rank of the entrants they would go forth. All the skilled artisans of Jerusalem would stand up before them and greet them saying, “Our brothers, men of such and such a place, we welcome you in peace. The flute would play before them, until they reached the Temple Mount. When they reached the Temple Mount even King Agrippas would take the basket and place it on his shoulder and walk as far as the Temple Court. When he got to the Temple Court, the Levites would sing the song: “I will extol You, O Lord, for You have raised me up, and You have not let my enemies rejoice over me”....The rich would bring their bikkurim in baskets overlaid with silver or gold, while the poor used wicker-baskets of peeled willow-branches, and the baskets and the bikkurim were given to the priest. Mishnah Bikkurim 3:8

It continues on, but the point is noticing the procession being led by a joyful flutist and bull/ox with golden horns and a crown. The crowds welcomed pilgrims with expressions of peace. The ancient symbol of the bull/ox had by the first century apparently taken a new, more anodyne significance. The event was a celebration of prosperity, peace and joy.

Rabbis have made commentaries upon this scene; I have read two. The one reinterpreted the bull as symbol of 'labor', his golden horns, 'riches' and the crown of olive trigs 'wisdom'. The other understood the procession to be a reenactment of the story from Exodus of the receiving of the Ten Commandments (and the golden calf element) but with the twist that the drama is merely played out 'as a drama' in a context of joyful worship. Make what you will of these commentaries.

20

I need to vent sorry!

by KerryKing in

i couldn't get back to sleep last night, something my father said a few weeks ago popped into my head.. we were talking about obtaining citizenship, he doesn't need it, but was contemplating what benefits it could get him now he's a pensioner.. background : i've been disfellowhipped for 15 years, i was born in, he is an elder, very much pimi, he was also born in.. i said to him how citizenship would be difficult for him as it would require him to swear allegiance to the state?.

oh he said, thats just a crowd of people together in a big room for the swearing in event, it would be easy to just mumble or say nothing, nobody would know.. this has quietly been eating away in my mind, why did it bother me?.

last night it hit me, when i was in my first year of school, age 5, i came out of school one day with a balloon with two little pencils attached, a gift from a classmate who's birthday it was, every child got one.

peacefulpete

Actually, the US government is more accommodating than the WT.

Chapter 3 - Oath of Allegiance Modifications and Waivers | USCIS

408

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

peacefulpete

I tried to empathetically demonstrate how billions of Christians have embraced traditions that for them celebrate something important to them and at the same time promote fellow feeling and peace. I respect that. Not being a Christian, I embrace the spirit of the holiday, love of children, peace and human kindness. Rehashing the same pedantic arguments offered by captious puritans has given me another reminder of what an unpleasant divisive world view JWism was and why I'm so glad to have left it behind.

12

The Lunatics Have Taken Over the Asylum

by nicolaou in

jw
friends

https://youtu.be/on-y9pv-cja?si=lr1dar4yshvymk7a.

just a song i really like.

it don't mean nothin' .

peacefulpete

Can't not include Floyd.

Bing Videos

408

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

peacefulpete

deleted

408

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

peacefulpete

P.Pete....I should say so. All people are of this 'world'.

Duran....Apparently, you do not understand Jesus' view of that..

Duran....I do understand how elitist sects have historically self-identified as exclusively chosen from, not only the world of humans, but from among the world of Christians. My perspective has obviously changed since leaving such a sect. I was hoping to help you do the same and rejoin the human race.

I'll remind you that earlier in this discussion you dismissed as irrelevant the fact that the Last Supper description incorporated pagan Greek festival traditions because Christians had given the Passover and it's symbols a new meaning. Surely this mirrors how many Christians view the adaptation of Christmas traditions. If the Gospel writers had no issue with adapting and appropriating Greek festival elements, why do you?

Your answer was provided when you graciously allowed me to pick a day to celebrate the birth of Jesus, as long as it wasn't the same day as other Christians (world) had chosen. The root of your objection to celebrating the 25th is your contempt for other Christian faiths.

20

Defend Your Borders or Listen to the Watchtower?

by raymond frantz in

https://youtu.be/dnoww-4jfao?si=ehzmc5-gxqukgn7q.

with ww3 on the horizon the watchtower is bringing out their best hits on the issue of neutrality and the latest instalment on jw.org with stephen lett has the theme " why ancient israelites were allowed to go to war but as a christian you can't " or to paraphrase for a 2024 audience " why the modern state of israel is allowed all the nuclear weapons to defend their borders but you as a western european or north american you aren't supposed to compliant against open border policies and uncontrolled illegal migration" isn't that the exact same rhetoric or is it my imagination?

so one of stephen lett's go to arguments is that christians do not take up arms because we don't live in ancient times where israelites had a mandate to occupy the holy land where as we gentile christians we don't.

peacefulpete

The dozen of less people who crave this kind of bunk have so many other places to go. Why are you insistent upon derailing this forum's purpose?

You 8-10 guys can now give me a negative vote.

408

Is Jesus the Creator?

by Sea Breeze in

that's what the word says.

.

colossians 1:16. for by him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through him and for him..

peacefulpete

My point is, Dec 25 is not Jesus' birthday.

Since the stories of Jesus' birth were diverse and late additions to the narrative, the best anyone could argue is that there were multiple traditions. If we were to be objective about it, the lack of a date is consistent with the literary nature of the whole story. All considered, the date of Dec 25 is as appropriate as any, perhaps more so as the celebration of light and Jesus being described in solar/light motifs.

No where in the Bible was it asked for his followers to memorialize his birth. The date and choice to memorialize it was complete done by people of 'the world'.

I should say so. All people are of this 'world'.

It is not Scriptural and all that is associated with celebrating Christmas is dishonoring to the one it is claim that it is being done for.

There are many 'scriptures' that encourage singing, generosity, eating well and expressing love. These are often forgotten in a cultish obsession over purity.