Posts by Drearyweather

14

Jehovah`s Witnesses / Parasites On Christendom ,they need to thank them for the membership they have today.

by smiddy3 in

jehovah`s witnesses claim that all their beliefs are based on the bible.the bible clearly states early on in deut.4:2 not to add to the word....and rev.22:18 re-iterates much the same thing in not to make additions to the word of god.. i think we could agree on that the organization has raised the bar on that one with their "weasel" words on so many issues that have already been thrashed out on this forum.. so a few other things that come to my mind are : with regards to j.w`s being parasites on christendom.. 1. they claim christendom apostatized itself from true christianity by the 3rd century , yet they accept apostate christendoms determination of what books are to be included in the bible as gods word as if they were governed by holy spirit to do so.?.

2.jehovah`s witnesses have only ever followed in christendoms missionaries footsteps where they have gone preaching and poaching off of the work these missionaries that have laid the groundwork before them .. 3.jehovah`s witnesses have never opened up virgin territory and gone where no other christian missionary has ever gone before .

{ not to my knowledge anyway i stand to be corrected if i am wrong on this point}.

Drearyweather

My thoughts:

1. They claim Christendom Apostatized itself from true Christianity by the 3rd Century , yet they accept Apostate Christendoms determination of what books are to be included in the Bible as Gods word as if they were governed by Holy Spirit to do so.?

The canon of the Hebrew scriptures was fixed even before Jesus' was born. and the New Testament books were finalized by 180 CE (the Muratorian Fragment),. So the JW's believe that the canon was determined much before the Councils of the third century Roman Catholic Church.

2.Jehovah`s Witnesses have only ever followed in Christendoms Missionaries footsteps where they have gone preaching and poaching off of the work these missionaries that have laid the groundwork before them .

The problem is the starting point. Christendom had 1500 years to them before JW's started. Any religion or sect or cult that started in the 1800's had the same problem. There was vrtually no place where Christendom had not reached.

On another note, most of the Christendom history of the dark ages is filled with bloodshed, violence, inquisition, and crusades. So I would not say that JW's or any other cult followed their footsteps. And the fact that many people join these cults is that that previous religion did not do a good job in retaining them. And that's the business model of a religion. Even Jesus converted Jews to Christianity. that's how religions grow.

4. The average rank & file JW likes to think that Jehovah`s Witnesses are the only ones that use the name Jehovah.Little do they realise that not only the Bible they use was established by the Catholic Church but also the name of God Jehovah was also. By a Spanish Catholic Monk in the 13th Century by adding vowels to the four letters of Hebrew {Tetragrammaton} translated by him as JHVH and coming up with the name Jehovah.

It seems that the name Jehovah had come up even before the Catholic usage in the 13th Century. Following is the comment made in the part "Jehovah" in the Catholic Encyclopedia:

the word is found even in the "Pugio fidei" of Raymund Martin, a work written about 1270 (ed. Paris, 1651, pt. III, dist. ii, cap. iii, p. 448, and Note, p. 745). Probably the introduction of the name Jehovah antedates even R. Martin.

https://www.catholic.org/encyclopedia/view.php?id=6291

5.The Catholic Church and Christendoms Protestant religions have been using that name ever since the 13th Century in writings ,engraved on Churches and with biblical scholars throughout the world down to this day.

And that is what irks me. If you can use the name on buildings and other writings, why did you remove it from the Bible?? Only 1 or 2 instances in some of the authorized Bibles?? The name of God was to be used in worship. There is no point in having the names high up on buildings and in scholarly and academic writings, but removing it from the Bible, which was the primary tool for worship for the common masses. If Jehovah was not the right pronunciation of the name, then why use Jesus, Joshua, Jeremiah, etc? Since they are also not the way Hebrews pronounced them.

42

JWs line up to have Gov. Body members autograph bibles.

by blownaway in

i was watching some of the videos on line and marc and cora had one where they said that after zone talks the gov body members would autograph bibles.

anyone have any video of this?.

Drearyweather

3 days into this, and still no evidence (photo or video) of JW's lining up to to get autographs of GB members on their Bibles or books.

2

What does a disgellowshi person at kh have in common with a Japanese prison

by poopie in

jw
friends

no talking allowed..

Drearyweather

disgellowshi

You used this word the second time. Is that the Japanese language term for disfellowshipped?

36

2018 Regional Convention program available on JW.borg

by sir82 in

jw
friends

https://www.jw.org/en/publications/books/convention-program-2018/.

friday.

be courageous and very strong”—joshua 1:7

Drearyweather

Is it the first time that the program was not leaked here before it came on JW.org?

8

Friends: Jehovah's Witnesses shunning drove Keego Harbor mom to murder-suicide

by adjusted knowledge in

jw
friends

https://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2018/02/19/keego-harbor-jehovahs-witness-mom-triple-murder-suicide/351559002/.

Drearyweather

The tragedy sent longtime family friend Joyce Taylor reeling as she and others say they believe the murder-suicide was the result of shunning by the Jehovah's Witnesses. According to Taylor and several other former Jehovah's Witnesses

In the above line, the ex-JW friend believes that shunning drove her to do suicide and murder.

But then, few lines below the article also says:

Taylor, who last saw her friend a week before she was found dead, said she doesn't know exactly what drove her friend over the edge. She believes that her friend was battling some kind of personal problem, but felt so alone in the world because of being ostracized by her former religious community that she did what she did.

Would need to wait on the actual investigations of the case rather than simply believing the words of ex-members who may attribute all bad happenings to the shunning policy.

12

Everything I once knew as a JW, is now wrong.

by fulltimestudent in

jw
friends

just had 2 nice witnesses at the door.

without boring you with all the to-ing and fro-ing.

i invented a friend who became a witness back in the early 1950s, this friend tried to get me to become a witness, because his teachers father (a leader in that congregation) told him that the big a was coming in 5 years (which was true).

Drearyweather

fulltimestudent,

Your title says,

Everything I once knew as a JW, is now wrong.

and at the end of your post you say:

lots of what I used to teach (and believe) is no longer true.

34

Impact of GDPR on WT HQ and EU branches?

by respectful_observer in

curious if any of our eu-based members (especially those still in) have heard anything from official wt channels on how the organisation plans to be in compliance with gdpr ("general data protection regulations") by may 2018?

it's my understanding that religious organisations must comply, and that religious data is treated a "protected" and therefore subject to some enhance requirements.. specifically, how will they comply with the following requirements:.

you must disclose to the individual: what data you collect on them, why, and what you do with the data (including what other parties receive the data and what they do with it).

Drearyweather

Prior to a person's consenting to share information, the organization must be clear about what they will do with their private data. I don't think any JW is informed on the day of his baptism that such a thing takes place.

During baptism, a JW is well aware the the elders have collected his personal data on the Publisher Record Card. He even gets to see it if he wants too. In fact it is the publisher who gives the data to them. What elders and the CO's do with the card is explained in the OD book which the publisher has access to. Now, it would be a valid point if the publisher can prove that his data is being used for purposes other than what it was intended for.

After that, whether it be Auxiliary Pioneering, Regular Pio, or Bethel Service, the individual himself fills up all the forms and submits it to the elders or to the society. In most of these forms the WT has mentioned a line whereby the applicant promises to cooperate with all the legal corporations of the WT and thus gives a consent that he allows the WT to use his personal data.

If the law demands, the WT will revise its policies in this, but I am not sure if WT has been doing or collecting data illegally.

For e.g. In India, in some places where anti-conversion law exists, before getting baptized, publishers prepare a legal affidavit stating that they are leaving their former religion and becoming JW;s at their own will and submit the document to the local authorities and the congregation.

So I presume WT would do the same in the EU, to save themselves from legal worries.

However, I feel it would be naive to say that a JW doesn't know that the Org maintains personal data about him.

34

Impact of GDPR on WT HQ and EU branches?

by respectful_observer in

curious if any of our eu-based members (especially those still in) have heard anything from official wt channels on how the organisation plans to be in compliance with gdpr ("general data protection regulations") by may 2018?

it's my understanding that religious organisations must comply, and that religious data is treated a "protected" and therefore subject to some enhance requirements.. specifically, how will they comply with the following requirements:.

you must disclose to the individual: what data you collect on them, why, and what you do with the data (including what other parties receive the data and what they do with it).

Drearyweather

What if the individual demand the "Right to be Forgotten" and all written evidence of them ever being a member wiped from congregation and WT files?

Interesting.

The first two points under article 17 says that the data should be erased unless,

1. the personal data are no longer necessary in relation to the purposes for which they were collected or otherwise processed;

2. the data subject withdraws consent on which the processing is based according to point (a) of Article 6(1), or point (a) of Article 9(2), and where there is no other legal ground for the processing;

the Data protection policy on jw.org says under point 7:

Personal data will not be transferred between branches unless necessary to accomplish the religious or charitable purposes of the organization of Jehovah’s Witnesses, to which all Jehovah’s Witnesses have consented by virtue of their free and willing decision to become and identify themselves as Jehovah’s Witnesses.

A person consents to become a JW by getting baptized and gives right to the WT to collect and maintain data about him. So, technically, how does a JW withdraw his consent? By writing a letter of DA or by getting DF'ed?

So if a person just stops going to the meetings without getting DA'ed or DF'ed, can he still ask the WT to erase data on him?

127

PORTUGAL: Filed a petition to the parliament to erase the legal entity of the Jehovah's Witness

by EdenOne in

based on legal arguments that revolve around violations of several articles of the portuguese constitution, and of the law of religious freedom, a petition to the portuguese parliament has been set in motion to extinguish the legal entity that represents the jehovah's witness in portugal and remove this community from the national register of recognized religions protected by law.

the petition does not seek to ban the jehovah's witness as a whole in the country.

the petition denounces the institutional policy of shunning former members as a violation of basic human rights and psychological torture, and asks the portuguese legislators and judicial authorities to take action to stop this abuse, and suspend legal recognition to the branch office entity until the policies of shunning are changed.

Drearyweather

Hi EdenOne, Some questions came to my mind after reading your conversation with Simon:

I can count myself lucky - the family on my side hasn't cut me off.So no, it's not about ME

In an earlier post you mentioned that it is easy to prove that shunning policy of JW's are violating human rights because you have testimonials of you and your family as proof of it. But now you say that your family doesn't shun you and hence the petition is not about you?

Try explaining that to this teenage girl of 16 years old whose parents threw her out of the house because she committed "fornication" with a "worldly" boyfriend.

The problem with this example is there are many non-JW's would react the same and there are many cases where people throw their children out and cut-off contact with them. JW's are a minority group, hence the cases of JW's shunning their family members are way much much lesser than other religions or non-religious people who shun and even harm and torture their family members for wrongdoing.

In India, there are some states where people still believe in honor killing, where parents will even kill their adult children if they marry outside their caste. A 16 year old, fornicating? The entire family will be cast out and will be hounded for the rest of their lives.

It's about many thousands of people who have been screwed up by shunning and everything that it entails.

Thousands of lives screwed. But not one court case to back up the petition? Or Am I wrong?

So, I decided to do SOMETHING.

I don't want to question your intentions. Let's assume that the WT in Portugal gets de-registered as a legal entity. But, history has shown that GB has never changed any core policies like shunning when any country has banned them. There are countries where JW's are under ban, but policies are the same.

You said that you want the WT to be legally de-registered but individuals should have the right to continue as JW's. So, what if individual JW's continue to shun their family members even if their entity is deregistered? So would you have the law punish them? JW's would stop shunning only if their GB tells them to do so, not if any any country or any law tells them.

17

Does praying really matter? Where is the evidence?

by RULES & REGULATIONS in

matthew 7:7 jesus says: ask, and it will be given you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.

for every one who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened.

or what man of you, if his son asks him for bread, will give him a stone?

Drearyweather

Does Praying Really Matter?

Yes. It makes a person feel better, and that's what is important. A believer praying to God is like an ex-JW yelling or shouting at a JW Witnessing Cart. No Impact whatsoever in both, but it makes you feel better.

Where is the evidence?

It really depends on what you want to see as an evidence. A divorcee/single mom with two kids does two jobs a day to support herself and to keep her kids in school. She prays to God to give her strength to face the problems of her life. What evidence do you want to see if her prayers are being answered?