Posts by rjharris

34

If you still believe in God, what are your thoughts on the Bible?

by ilikecheese in

jw
friends

do you believe it's inerrant?

do you believe it's based on things that happened, but a lot of it may just be stories and it's not perfect because men wrote it?

do you think it's just a good guide?

rjharris

I want to preface my response with the following: I am an ex-JW of more than 30 years (disassociated).

I believe in the one Creator of the heavens and the earth. I believe this Creator made a provision to save his creation mankind from perishing (going out of existence) by introducing one of his Sons of God (the first one created) into the world of mankind.

I do not believe that this Creator has revealed his true name to mankind. What we have today is what someone thinks his name is. Based on my many years of reading and studying the Bible, Christ never referred to his Creator and Father by a personal name. It is just not there. Jesus always called him "Father." (Occurences of "Jehovah" in the NWT of the Bible were added. Jesus never used the name. Proof of this can be seen by comparing the Greek translation where those instances occur. There is no name.)

I believe more important than a personal name affixed to God is his "reputation." I believe that God will reveal his name to all of mankind in his own time. I believe God wants us to look to what he will "prove to be" - in other words - to look at his reputation. If God says, "Let there be light" and there is light, then one knows he has the reputation (a good name) to do as he says he will do.

I personally do not "believe in the Bible." Please permit me to clarify. I do not believe in a book as a book is not alive; it is paper. I believe in a "person" and that person is the one The Most High God has sent into the world: His Son.

I DO NOT believe that the Bible is the Word of God. There is ONLY ONE Word of God and it is the Christ. No book should have been elevated to that lofty position to be shared with Christ.

It is God who chose and authorized Christ. It is men who chose and authorized the Bible.

No one can deny that persons other than God and Christ speak in the Bible. The serpent, Adam, Eve, the Devil, demons and others are "speaking" in the Bible. Are their words "The Word of God?" So when one say that the Bible is The Word of God, they are including the sayings of others including God and Christs adversary. This is the trap the world is Christianity is in.

Jesus said (not the Bible says), Jesus says at Matthew 4:4 that "Man must live, not on bread alone, but on every utterance coming forth through God’s mouth." Thus, our lives are not dependent upon "what a book says" but what "comes out of God's mouth." That is, what he says.

Everything in the book that men gave the name to; authorized; made holy; and call the Word of God is not EVERYTHING THAT COMES OUT OF GOD'S MOUTH.

If Jesus [the] Christ is The Word of God, that is, God's spokesman, then everything thing he says comes from God's mouth.

Using 2 Timothy 3:16 as proof text that "The Bible" is the Word of God is a weak one. Why? Because it makes the assumption that "The Bible" is scripture. When the Apostle Paul wrote his letter to Timothy there was no Bible containing 66 books. There was no book by that name back then. So how can one posthumously make a book that did not appear on the scene for more than 1000 years after Christs ascension and "it" becomes the Word of God?

God says (not the Bible says) at Luke 9:35:

"This is my Son, the one that has been chosen. Listen to him."

He did not say listen to a book.

It is men who say:

"This is our book, the one that we have chosen (authorized). Listen to it as The Word of God."

I listen very closely to the conversations persons who claim that believe in God and Christ and notice 95% of the time that they ascribe to a book (The Bible) the things that God and Christ themselves say.

For example, they will say something like this: "The Bible says or teaches at John 14:6 that Jesus is the way the truth and the life."

Well that would be an incorrect statement because the Bible does not say that. Jesus says it.

My point here is that the world with regard God and Christ have been duped and misled in a very bad way. The world looks to a book. A book has been given predominance over mankinds Head, Lord and Master - Christ and this book is "being listened to" and that is why there is so much confusion. One cannot reference the utterances of the dead Prophets of old as God did not send them to us and he did not tell us to listen to them. God is clear. He said, "Listen to" his son.

It is a book that men took the liberty to name, include and exclude certain scrolls and then present it to the whole world as holy and the word of God.

The only value the book called the Bible has is the words in it that are utterances of God himself and Christ.

In fact, the ONLY book within this book men gave the name Bible to that should be "standalone" is "The Revelation by Jesus Christ Which God Gave Him." Why? Because we are told explicitly who gave it to Jesus Christ. So all in the Revelation chronicle can be trusted. (Apart from men interpreting it as he sees fit.)

If Christ is not recognized as the ONLY Word of God (Rev 19:13), then it is impossible to understand The Book of Revelation. Why? Because persons will attempt to understand it by referring to the Prophets of old such as Daniel. This is a mistake because now "The Bible" is being used to understand Revelation rather than Christ himself.

It is for that reason there are hundreds of so-called understandings of the Book of Revelation (and about God and Christ) that are in gross error. Not one is correct. No, not even the Watch Towers.

No, the Bible is not holy and it is not the Word of God. Only the one God sent and authorized are those things and we are to listen only to what he says.

R. Jerome Harris
e-Prophetic.com

14

Jehovah's Witnesses "shut up the kingdom of heaven" Matt 23:13

by stuckinarut2 in

i'm sure this has been thought of before, but while i was gardening today (great time to let the mind think deeply) , i thought of this:.

the org (gb) teaches that only a few go to heaven, therefore everyone else is prevented from entering.. so, are they the scribes and pharisees that jesus spoke of at matt 23:13?.

"woe to you, scribes and pharisees, hypocrites!, because you shut up the kingdom of the heavens before men; for you yourselves do not go in, neither do you permit others to enter!".

rjharris

Jesus NEVER promised anyone that they will "GO TO HEAVEN." In fact, he says at John 3:13:

"Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but he that descended from heaven, the Son of man."

Man was made from the earth and it is the earth that mankind will inherit forever.

Many are stumbled by this "only a few" go to heaven. This is the result not only the Watch Tower, but all of Christianity because a large segment of it teaches only those who accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior go to heaven. This is a lie (or put more kindly, an error) to.

The truth of the matter as to where mankind will reside can be seen in where man came from: The Earth. And, in the fact that God's Kingdom "COMES DOWN" to the earth, so why would any need to GO UP to heaven?

It is the earth that will be gloriously transformed into the future and God's Kingdom will one day envelope it. Before God's Kingdom arrives, two kingdoms must come and go: First, Christs future 1000 year kingdom over the earth that is mentioned at Rev 20:7. After Christs future kingdom ends, another kingdom must arise. Second, the Throne of Satan or the Beast. It must be established upon the earth for an unspecified period of time. It could be 100s of years. We do not know. But what we do know is that it will come after Christs 1000 year kingdom has run its course. (Rev 2:13 and Rev 20:7-8) Lastly, God's indefinite Kingdom comes down to the earth.

The meaning of the Kingdom of the heavens being shut up is not what has been popularly taught. Shutting up the kingdom of the heavens have nothing to do with going to heaven, but rather teaching the truth about God's kingdom coming down to the earth.

Think about it for a moment: Almost all so-called denominations - including the WTBTS - teach that persons will go to heaven literally. They completely miss the point about what Christ was teaching about God's kingdom coming down to the earth. If God's kingdom expands to envelope the earth (coming down), there is no need to go up to heaven if God's kingdom will also include the earth. Jesus taught us to pray that God's Kingdom come (to the earth), not to pray that we go up to God's kingdom. (Matthew 6:9-10).

Sadly, millions are so indoctrinated in infected with the diseased teaching of going to heaven, they have not understood what the whole controversy and issue was about in the Garden of Eden in the first place. It was about who has rightful ownership and soveriegnty over the earth to establish permanent things upon it. There is only ONE: The Creator of the heavens and the earth. It is His will and purpose that His creation - the earth - be folded into His everlasting kingdom.

There is no need to go up to heaven. We did not come from there. Look at John 3:13 very closely again. Listen to what Jesus is saying. (Luke 9:35)

R. Jerome Harris
e-Prophetic.com

17

help needed....cult question from watchtower

by goingthruthemotions in

so i was looking at the boards not too long ago and saw a list of questions that were related to whether or not a religion was a cult that looked like it came from the watchtower.

i've been trying to find those questions again so i could find the watchtower and hopefully one day show this to my wife who is still asleep to the troof of the gb.. .

the help would be greatly appreciated.. .

rjharris

Be careful being sucked into "a religious organization" being a cult thing.

At the end of the day a "cult" as defined by most is, "A religious system or belief that does not agree with my own." The word "cult" is subjective and "emotionally" derived and not objective.

The root word for cult is "culture" which means, "A system of knowledge shared by a relatively large group of people." So technically anyones culture is a cult.

Defining any religious organization or system as a cult takes the "easy way out" and provides a convenient excuse to dismiss anyone or anything because one may not like what is done or taught within those organizations.

I find a much better approach is to listen to Christ as God commanded at Luke 9:35.

If one strictly and faithfully does this, they will realize that ALL religion on the planet is an impostor. None of it is from God and that the sending of His Son to the earth was not for the purpose of establishing a religion by any name. His Son was sent to establish a Brotherhood.

Thus, all religion and their associated images and icons (such as The Bible, Koran, etc) should be rejected as being "Holy" and the one God sent be viewed as exclusively "Holy." No book, no religious organization or system can be that.

As a former JW of more than 30 years (disassociated) I see a major problem in the world today, it is religion and it is all ungodly and contending for control over Christs property: Mankind (who he died for).

The Watch Tower is not the problem, it is all religion and the "concept" that somehow belonging to a "group" of persons who share a common name and belief (here is your cult) is what God commanded.

A Chosen One of Christ (Apostle), Paul said these words at Hebrews 13:13-14 to show that there does not exist on earth today "an organized" place (a city or camp) in which disciples of Christ can go INTO. He said that his disciples earnestly await its coming. And that one is to go OUT TO where Christ is, "outside the camp." So Christ is not WITHIN any religious system. If one thinks about it, why would he? He was not sent to JWs, or Mormons, or Catholics, or Seventh Day Adventist, etc. He was sent into the ENTIRE world of mankind; some in places of organization such as cities and many outside of places of organization. He died for them to. He was sent to the dead and the living. ALL OF MANKIND.

So the Master is WITHOUT OF religious organizations and systems and cannot be hemmed up, contained, and controlled within "religion." Mankind, like Satan , is a control freak and seeks to prey upon mankind, capture them within the religious system and devour (envelope) them so completely with lies, the truth will a afar off from them.

"Let us, then, go forth to him outside the camp, bearing the reproach he bore, for we do not have here a city that continues, but we are earnestly seeking the one to come." (Hebrews 13:13-14)

19

Not invited to my nephews wedding

by outforever in

jw
friends

knew that this would be the case - so not surprised.

quite happy to not go - as i would not like to see my mother / or my big sister at all.

this nephew is my small sisters son - my small sister and myself are very close - she does not go to the meetings anymore for quite a while now, her eyes have been opened.

rjharris

Shunning is a form of "moral" and "religious" discrimination and is unloving. Jesus never taught or practiced such a thing. Period. There are impostors in our midst.

John Chapter 8 speaks of an adulterous woman that the Scribes and Pharisees shunned and condemned to death by stoning. Yet, Jesus did not shun or condemn her.

The man condemned to death on the torture stake at Luke 23:43 was not shunned and condemned by Jesus, but promised paradise.

Even those who persecuted him and took his life, Jesus did not shun and condemn, he asked that they be forgiven.

Imagine if Jesus walked among us today having this "shunning" mentality so many have; many would not be attracted to him and his teachings.

Anyone or any organization who practices this and claims to be a disciple of Christ should think again.

Yet, none say that they are disciples of Christ do they? They say take titles such as Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Catholics, Seventh Day Adventist, Methodist, and even Christians, etc ... none of these Christ told his followers to be known as.

He told his followers to be known simple as his Disciples. Nothing more and nothing less.

So the practice of shunning comes from those who take upon themselves names and titles Christ did not give them, but names and titles the world gave them.

True disciples of Christ would know that shunning is unloving and something their Master never taught or commanded.

So who are you impostors who teach shunning as a teaching of Christ?

22

How Did A Proven "Fake," "Phony" Arrangement ["governing body"] ...Become The "Faithful & Discreet Slave" Arrangement???

by Littleleslie in

question:.

how did a proven "fake," "phony" arrangement [like "governing body" arrangement]...become the "faithful & discreet slave" arrangement???.

so then if it can be proven, the "governing body" term and arrangement is a farce, a fake, a made-up nonscriptural arrangement itself, (made up and concocted by nathan knorr & frederick franz in 1944) then how can this fake arrangement now suddenly become the "faithful & discreet slave" that jesus spoke of?

rjharris

Put yourself in a room of 50 people, for example. Eventually, some among that 50 is going to position themselves in positions of authority over the others; in other words, they will put themselves in charge. This self-imposed authority may come under many disguises such as higher education, skin color, more wealth than others, etc. They may make make lofty claims. Did not King James "authorize" his Bible? Did God tell him to do that or did he tell himself? My point here is that it is all self-imposed authority. And, if one wants to get down and dirty with truth about it all, it is all White self-imposed authority that sits on the top. I refuse to believe that an impartial God made it that way.

The Governing Body is the result of an arrogant man (C.T. Russell and later others after him) who somehow arrogated themselves to station themselves above others as having some special calling. In other words, God has called only White men among His creation of mankind to sit in those positions. This does not make any sense.

It does not make sense that what emanates from the "top" are a reflection (images) of what sits at the top as seen in the publications, art, and film: Adam, Eve, Angels (who are invisible), Jesus, Noah, Moses, The Prophets, The Apostles, etc being portrayed in the likeness of those persons who sit at the top: White men.

The Catholic Church has its Popes. We all know what color they have traditionally been. Does anyone really think that this how God wants it? Is the Watch Tower any different? No!

Something is wrong, terribly wrong!

What is even more disturbing is that millions do not question it?

If men of a particular race within the human familiy position themselves in positions of authority over the others and they portray what they have not seen in their likeness in publications, then that which they portray cannot be true, it must be false; false images and false portrayals.

If the portrayals are false, then the teachings behind those portrayals are false.

Don't tell the world that Adam and Eve looked like White people as this would be false. It would be false to portray them in the likeness of any race among the human family because no one has seen them. Do tell the world that angels are winged pale-skinned White babies or adults knowing full well that angels are not flesh and blood creatures and no one can see an angel in its true form. Don't tell the world that Jesus is a White man because no one has ever seen him in the likeness of ANY race among the human family. Likewise, do not tell the world that 8 men called a Governing Body is God's Faithful Slave. Yes, I concede that there is one African American - Samuel Herd - but that was not always the case, ite GB has been traditionally a White mans club and still is as it is predominately White. One does not see all races within the organization represented at that level. Why not? Why only eight? If there were 10 or 12, why 10 or 12?

As I stated, something is very wrong as this does not fit the personality of the God I know. He is color-blind.

So this thing comes full circle and the question is how did it come to be like this: Because it was men themselves who placed themselves in those positions of authority and sold the lie that God did.

It is no different from a Pope being placed in a position of self-imposed authority over others. Why would God place men in positions of authority over others when Christ is our Head? He is our authority. (1 Cor 11:3)

Answer: He would not.

Too, think of all of the mistakes, error, and bad decisions that have emanated from the GB. Certainly, God does not make mistakes. There would be no need for the constant "new light" or "new understanding" coming out of the WT organization because if the "original light" came from God, it be steady and true.

The GB is one of the many distractions presented and placed in front of men and women to keep them from ajoining themselves to the TRUE BODY: Christ himself.

R. Jerome Harris
e-Prophetic.com

58

Why Do Witnesses Promote A Unhealthy Lifestyle, My COBE weighs 340lbs (5ft 7in).

by BucketShopBill in

please don't take this the wrong way if your battling weight problems, that's not what this thread is meant to talk about.

i am asking this question because jehovah's witnesses claim they have "the best way of life", "god's blessing", "the truth" and are trying to change the habits of healthy people by turning them in to their own makings.

i watched people who were great athletes turn all their muscle in to fat because we would get a elder or circuit overseer make remarks they were spending too much time "working out" and "bodily training is beneficial for little".

rjharris

I have seen this as well in my more than 30 years as a JW (disassociated).

More dangerous is the mental damage done. Mental impairment and in many cases mental illness is spawned within the organization. Yet, to be fair to the Watch Tower, this mental impairment and illness is seen in ALL of what men affectionately call "Christianity." I will not go into Islam and the other religious systems as it is rife their too.

Persons once curious, examining, questioning, challenging, reasoning and thinking are soon turned into persons who no longer think for themselves or question the organization or even reason with others. Like the body that lacks good nutrition and exercise cause it to become degraded and unhealth, so is the faculty of thinking - the exercise of the mind - taken away and the mind is impacted to where it does not function as God intended it to: To question, to think, to reason, to conclude. Not to have someone do those things for us. If one allows someone to do these things for them, then the conclusion is not their own.

The Apostle John at 1 John 4:1 shows that ALL expressions (utterances) are to be examined (tested) as to their truthfulness and having come from God. That Scripture does not say that the individual is supposed to surrender such testing to someone else. The individual is to conduct such testing.

"Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world."

I long understood why the WTBTS exempts itself from such testing by its membership: It is because it has been concealing the truth. It has been elusive. Any such examination of it would reveal this. It is for that reason that it threatens disfellowshipment of those who question or challenge it and who develop doubts about a matter or a teaching that comes out of the WTBTS.

If what ANY religious organization is the truth, there should be no fear of such examination. In fact, there should be a welcoming of it.

The WTBTS conveniently threatens what will happen to those caught speaking with DFd ones or persons "it" labels for everyone else as apostate. Or banning the reading of certain literature that it calls apostate. (Anyone reading C.T. Russells writing would conclude that he would sound like the WT definition of aposate. I believe it is for that reason we do not see his publications in the WT library. Think about that: The founder of the WTBTS would sound like an apostate by "the organizations" definition.)

The reason why so many in ALL religion have been throughly misled and no where near the truth about God and His Messiah is because they are all locked into systems of (false) worship that do not come from God; they come from the world of mankind.

The most telling thing that this statement is true is that all one has to do is look how men have taken what they have NEVER seen and CANNOT see and made it earthly or human. (Heaven, Angels, Christ, God). The portrayals are right there to be seen in art, film and literature.

The whole world and its religions are a BIG LIE and they fake love and concern for other. It is false and not sincere.

"If anyone makes the statement: “I love God,” and yet is hating his brother, he is a liar. For he who does not love his brother, whom he has seen, cannot be loving God, whom he has not seen."

R. Jerome Harrise-Prophetic.com

27

Smiling at a Disfellowshipped JW instead of Completely Ignoring him

by ProfCNJ in

i was driving our car going to our assigned territory for our sunday field minsitry (was with jw 2 sisters) when i saw a disfellowshipped jw riding his motorcycle heading towards us.

the guy was df'd around 2 months ago only (won't delve much on his case).

approximately about 10 meters, we saw him smile.

rjharris

I am a former JW of more than 30 years (disassociated). If I see a DFd JW, I would kindly speak with him and help him/her see that they should count it has a blessing not to be in captivity to ANY religious organization.

Christ meant for his disciples to be free and "unburdened." To express love and kindness to all persons - as he did - without restriction or browbeating.

As one who has disassociated himself from the WTBTS, it is I who view all JWs (as wells as persons membered with any religious organization) as innocent children tossed about by an overbearing parent. Children act and behave as their parent taught them. JWs in the congregations below are loyal to their parent: The Organization.

Loyalty to God and Christ are not really second place because they believe if one is loyal to "The organization" one is loyal to God and Christ. Yet, what has been forgotten and not practiced is the example Christ set towards persons of all sorts: He forgave them and would forgive them an unlimited number of times. Why? Because he knew that they "Did not know what they were doing."

Jesus showed the greatest expression of love towards those who who hated him, persecuted him, and put him to death: He ask the Father to forgive them. He did not punish them.

The practice of disfellowshipment is not from Christ. I can care less about what "The Bible" says. I care about what "Christ" said and did. And, he NEVER condemned, punished or rejected anyone.

It is men who seek to exercise power and control over "tossed about" mankind who seeks to condemn and expel - as if THEY themselves died for mankind. Christianity and all religion is a thief and has taken control of the Masters property and household. The Masters property is mankind. The religious systems do as they please with the Masters property - even taking ownership of it. Disposing of it as it sees fit. This is not loving.

Each life is precious in God's eye and the Master views each that he died for as precious, whether they accept him or not. This can be seen in him not condemning an adulterous woman who was condemned by the Scribes and Pharisees; this can be seen in him promising a condemned man who was not his follower, paradise; this can be seen in his resurrecting persons who were not his follower; and it can be seen in what hs did on behalf of his persecutors and executioners.

So who or what is this "thing" called by men, Christianity? It is an impostor. A counterfiet. A hater and controller of men. It is a cheat. It is a predator that runs in many wolf packs (denominations) that seeks to ensare mankind and once they ensnare them, devour (completely control) them.

Open your eyes people and look at what is in front of you. Get out of ALL of religion as that is not what The Most High sent His son into the world to establish. He sent his son into the world to as a "sacrifcial lamb" to die in behalf of ALL of mankind so that we not perish. (Notice that I did not say die because we all will die. Dying and persishing are two totally different things).

Look to the "Living One." No, he can no longer be seen and he does not exist in buildings of wood, stone and metal. He is a living spirit and the ONLY way we can sit ourselves before him in order to be taught by him directly is by exercising faith in him. Faith is a requirement for that which cannot be seen.

Faith should not be placed in humans or human agencies. Why? Because you can see them.

Faith should not be placed in a book - for example, The Bible. Why? Because you can see it.

God cannot be worshiped through things that can be seen. Why? Because he is a Spirit and Jesus says at John 4:23-24:

"Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshipers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for, indeed, the Father is looking for suchlike ones to worship him. God is a Spirit, and those worshiping him must worship with spirit and truth."

Sadly. most are attempting to worship God through visible things and their worship is in vain. To worship God in this manner is what religious organization seeks.

Yet, the Master - who is invisible - said of himself at John 14:6:

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me."

So I say to all JW and those DFd: The practice of DFing is man-made and no person should buy into such labelings organizations arrogate to call others. Christ never called anyone disfellowshipped and never practiced such a thing. Reject such labels.

To accept such labels upon oneself shows a fear of men and what THEY can do to you. Those who use such expressions, shame on you! Who has made you to put off the love of Christ? Who is your Master? If Christ did not do such a thing, why are you?

Disfellowshiping is a cruel mind game and there is nothing loving about it. It is a tool used at the disposal of imperfect men to beat Christs slaves (all of mankind) to conformity to rigid human rules and regulations that Christ never established.

R. Jerome Harris
e-Prophetic.com

10

A JW encounter in Hong Kong

by Listener in

last week i was in hong kong on a holiday and ran into some jws.

i was in a large shopping mall and noticed a number of jws holding out a pamphlet to passerbys.

before i knew it there was one walking towards me and stopped right in front of me stopping me from moving forward.. the jw was virtually shoving the pamphlet towards me and said i would like to offer you this pamphlet that directs you to a web site that will answer all your questions that you have about life.

rjharris

May I suggest that the next time any have a conversation with a JW, do not say that "They do not follow the Bible."

Why, because this is where they want you and you and this is what they want you to think.

Rather, none of us are supposed to be FOLLOWING THE BIBLE, but should be FOLLOWING CHRIST.

This is where so many fall into a trap. They engage in this "following the Bible" and "the Bible says this" and "the Bible teaches that." The Bible teaches NOTHING. One does not follow the Bible.

It is Christ that teaches and he is our only Teacher. We should NEVER ascribe to a book what Christ is what we should be doing with him in mind: Following and believing in him.

"But YOU, do not YOU be called Rabbi, for one is YOUR teacher, whereas all YOU are brothers." (Matthew 23:8)

"YOU address me, ‘Teacher,’ and, ‘Lord,’ and YOU speak rightly, for I am such." (Matthew 13:13)

Open your eyes and observe what the world of Christianity - to include the WTBTS - is doing to you: It is getting you to revere and defend a book rather than the "person" of Christ - who is alive and able to teach us still as he promised to be with his disciples until the end. Yet, it is a book most of you turn to and give reverence and prominence to.

A quick scan of the official WTBTS website is telling. It features a book - The Bible - more than anything else. Notice in the menu of the website, you do not see "Christs Teachings" but you see "Bible Teachings."

Many of you will not make much of this, but I do. The Bible is not a teacher, Jesus Christ is our Teacher. Think!!!

The Bible has cleverly replaced Jesus as Teacher.

Did The Most High God command us to listen to an organization or a book? Did he send an organization or a book? No! His command to us is clear at Luke 9:35:

"This is my Son, the one that has been chosen. Listen to him."

Sadly, His Son is not being listened to. An entire book has replaced him.

R. Jerome Harris
e-Prophetic.com

37

Rain before Noah's flood

by monkeyshine in

does anyone know the current thought on what happened before the flood?

i remember being taught that it never rained before the flood but now they are telling me that was never taught.

i thought i remembered a quote somewhere saying something to the effect of "can you imagine how the outsiders must have felt feeling those first drops of rain?

rjharris

There are several points to keep in mind:

The flood of Noah's day was not a global flood. Why? Because God had not yet confused the languages of mankind causing them to disperse. So the whole earth was not yet populated. It was the "world" (environment) of Noah's day that was subject to a flood.
There is no way Noah could have tranversed all over the earth to gather animals. It was the animals in the locale in which the flood occurred.

Many ask, "Well, where did all of the water we see to day in the oceans and elsewhere come from?"

The answer to this question is extremely easy. What does was the state of the earth BEFORE God began to prepare it so that life could be here and BEFORE the floof of Noah's Day? Answer: Genesis 1:2:

"Now the earth proved to be formless and waste and there was darkness upon the surface of [the] watery deep; and God’s active force was moving to and fro over the surface of the waters."

The entire earth was a watery deep from the very beginning. God had made dry land appear out of that watery deep. (Genesis 1:9) It was that "dry land" where ever Noah and the other people resided that was flooded out.

So the flood of Noah's day had nothing to do with a global flood. For those who claim that it is responsible, you would be hard pressed to explain Genesis 1:2 as the water was always there long before life appeared on the earth.

25

The Internet Proves JWs Are a Joke Now

by jw07 in

i'm a born in, born in the 1980s and old enough to remember studying beefy (albeit full of crap) material like the the evolution book and revelation book (which we studied over and over and over and over).

books and brochures were wordy and chock full of legalistic language explaining away teachings and policies, some explanations slightly above the iq of the average person.. watchtower studies were longer (30 paragraphs sometimes), talks were longer and thus meetings were longer, pioneering was harder (70 hours if i remember correctly), assemblies and conventions were longer, and there were intricate food provisions to feed thousands of people (for a cost of course).. the average jw could recite watchtower propaganda for hours to indoctrinate others or defend their faith.

jws were interested in having meaty discussions at the door and challenging even pastors on doctrinal points.. i know this has been said many times, but the organization has gone through a massive dumbing down.. i can't figure out if it's due to the oblivious nature of the current governing body, a premeditated attempt by them at dumbing down the organization, or just the effects of life becoming easier around the globe due to reliance on technology.. i can only speak on my era, and i know that from the early 90s until around 2004 the organization was allot more doctrine savy.. over the past decade or so i'd say the collective iq of the followers has moved from 105 to 85.. indoctrination and blind belief has allot to do with being prone to be emotionally manipulated, but thinking ability has a say in that too.. social media is a decent gauge of how and what the average person within a certain demographic is thinking, and doing a simple hashtag search on twitter, instagram, or facebook reveals allot about how the current generation of young jws (15-28 or thereabout) are thinking.. many have become self obsessed, internet obsessed, hubris filled and passive, i can see an even bigger decline in growth over the next 5 years.. take a look:.

rjharris

The "dummy" downing of the WT membership occured since its founding as an organization and continues today.

We all have been duped into believing that what we had was "meaty" information. The information presented was - and still is - designed to focus the individual away from ever attaining an accurate knowledge of God and Christ while making it appear that it is what we had been receiving all along. This is how "deception" and "misleading" works.

All of the WT program is a "dummying" down. This was not apparent to many of us when we fist began to study the publications. Even through there was what were called Bible studies, they were not really that at all; they were studies of the Watchtower publications. Study of these publications is what indoctrinates one into the Watch way of thinking and believing. In almost all of the publications the questions were formulated for us and the answers appeared in the paragraphs. "Look Ma, no thinking required." Why create your own Q&As when it is all done for you? This results in a "dummed" down individual who become dependent upon the Q&As given them by "Mother." This is their food.

I am 100 percent convinced that no human or human agency has the truth or accurate knowledge of God and Christ. Such is the extent of the world today. It is totally misled.

Christ does not exist in any religious organization. He never did. He was not sent to create religious organization. He was not sent to create a religious system "men" gave the name of "Christianity" to.

Christs exists "without of" religious organization. His death was not because he belonged to a religious system, but rather that he would not be molded into one. Thus, he died "outside the camp or city, a place of congregation and organization. (Hebrews 13:13-14)

It is outside the camp where Christ is. We are not to "go into" a religious system but rather "go out" to where he is: outside the camp. There does not exist on the earth today a place of organization (city) for Christs disciples to "go into." We "earnestly" await its coming. Thus, we "go out" to where Christ is: In a proverbial wilderness, apart from the world.

All religious organization - to include the WTBTS - has dumbed down its membership. Most act irrationally and blindly follow the edicts of their particular religious organization. Most display a type of mental impairment that makes them unreasoning and driven by the "drug" of emotion rather than rational, reason and common sense.

Christianity - this included the WTBTS - has arrogated itself to portray Adam, Eve, Angels, Jesus, Noah, Moses (and the other Prophets), The Apostles and others in the likeness of the man of European descent. The rest of the world blindly follows suit.

Religion - in particular what is called by men Christianity - has throughly misled the world with regard God and Christ. What is taught today is not what Christ taught; what is taught today are "doctrines of men" masquerading as teachings of Christ.

Jesus fortold the coming of an anomaly that would come on the basis of his name "truthfully" teaching that he is the Christ, but would mislead many. That anomaly has more than 41000 contending denominations who all truthfully teach that Jesus is the Christ.

"Look out that nobody misleads YOU; for many will come on the basis of my name, saying, ‘I am the Christ,’ and will mislead many."

The world has been in a deep slumber and has not been "looking out" as Christ warned and have allowed themselves to be misled.

No, it is not just the Watch Tower, it all of it. Everything in this world opposes Christ. Even that which claims to be his friend.

It is up to the individual to approach God through Christ; not through religious organization or a book.

This requires prayer on our part (individually) to our Father and God as Jesus taught and directed. No religious organization or book can draw us close to God; only Christ can as he is the ONLY way.

"I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me." (John 14:6)