leaving_quietly

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Posts by leaving_quietly

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  25

  Jehovah generously provides?

  by Rattigan350 in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the june 15 2013 w pg 13, para 6&7 has an experience of a pioneer that needed $66 to pay her rent the next day.

  she prayed and went to work at her job as a waitress.

  when she finished her shift she had received a total of $66 in tips.

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  leaving_quietly

  I have an issue saying that Jehovah is the one doing the providing. Please feel free to correct me, but in her case, it was the patrons of the restaurant who provided. Many years ago when I was in Bethel, I had no money to buy gas to get back to Walkill. Didn't know what I was going to do. A kind older sister gave me a green handshake that very night. Two whole dollars! It wasn't much, but back then, it was just enough gas to get me back. Did I ever think for one moment that Jehovah provided? Not one bit. The kind sister provided. Jehovah didn't.
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  11

  Elders need to see things from Jehovah's perspective in a child molestation case

  by suavojr in

  1. watchtower
  2. child-abuse

  while preaching this past saturday 3-16-13 the following conversation took place in my car with an elder from my cong, my wife, a retired sister and myself.. me: addressing my wife i asked her: do you know how is brother (moron) that crashed his car into a fire station while drunk?

  wife: don't know.

  last thing i heard was that he was in a critical condition.at this point the elder chimes in.. elder: poor guy!

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  leaving_quietly

  Since WTS loves to use the OT for this "two witness rule", I submit that there is an exception to the "two witness" rule in the scriptures. It is ridiculous to exercise in a cases of child molestation, precisely since there are NEVER two witnesses.

  Deut. 17:6-9: "At the mouth of two witnesses or of three witnesses the one dying should be put to death. He will not be put to death at the mouth of one witness. 7?The hand of the witnesses first of all should come upon him to put him to death, and the hand of all the people afterward; and you must clear out what is bad from your midst.
  8?“In case a matter for judicial decision should be too extraordinary for you, one in which blood has been shed, in which a legal claim has been raised, or a violent deed has been committed, matters of dispute, inside your gates, you must also rise and go up to the place that Jehovah your God will choose, 9?and you must go to the priests, the Levites, and to the judge who will be acting in those days, and you must make inquiry, and they must hand down to you the word of the judicial decision.

  Verses 8 and 9 give the exception to the rule.... case is too extraordinary... "a violent deed has been committed"... Two witnesses are not needed in these cases No doubt, those acting as judges would make a full investigation into the matter. NOTE: Jehovah was not necessarily involved in the decision making.

  Matthew Henry's Concise Commentary states:

  "Courts of judgement were to be set up in every city. Though their judgement had not the Divine authority of an oracle, it was the judgment of wise, prudent, experienced men, and had the advantage of a Divine promise."
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  3

  Did C.T. Russell believe Jesus was God?

  by leaving_quietly in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  the finished mystery is available for free on google books.. http://books.google.com/books/about/the_finished_mystery.html?id=ddqsoqv2rbic.

  i was reading the preface last night and shook my head over the ridiculousness of this.

  how this ever became a religion is beyond me.

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  leaving_quietly

  The Finished Mystery is available for free on Google Books.

  http://books.google.com/books/about/The_Finished_Mystery.html?id=dDQSOQV2RBIC

  I was reading the Preface last night and shook my head over the ridiculousness of this. How this ever became a religion is beyond me. However, one thing popped out. On pages 3 and 4 of the Preface, it quotes whas Russell said in The Watch Tower, July 1, 1898 p. 203. The part that stuck out was this (highlighting mine):

  "(3) The fire from heaven--an epoch of Divine judgements and chastisements upon a maddened but unconverted world, wild in anarchy, as other Scriptures show us. The results of their wars, revolutions and anarchy, in the failure of their schemes, will have a humbling effect, and will prepare mankind for God's revelation of Himself in

  "(4) The still small voice. Yes; He who spoke to the winds and the waves of the Sea of Galilee will, in due time, 'speak peace to the peoples.' He will speak with authority, commanding the observance of His long neglected Law of Love. 'And whosoever will not hear that Prophet shall be cut off from among His People.' (Acts 3:32.)"

  So, God's revelation of Himself = He who spoke to the winds and the waves of the Sea of Galilee... sure sounds to me like Russell believed Jesus was God.
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  32

  NLP, Subliminal Messages and the WT Writing Department

  by 00DAD in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  a few years ago i became interested in the subject of neuro-linguistic programming (nlp).

  while the core concepts of nlp have been largely discredited as new-age pseudo-science, there is no doubt that there is at least some validity to the idea.

  words and images remain the key way we communicate.

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  leaving_quietly

  A longtime elder and, at that time WT Study Conductor I know once said to me (not exact words, but you get the drift): 'Pay very close attention to the way the Society words things in the Watchtower. Things are worded they way they are for a reason.'

  This, was, of course, when I was still very much mentally in and all gung-ho. So was he, and he still is. Reflecting back, I believe there's more truth to those words than even he realizes.
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  69

  Do You Believe In ANYTHING That The Witnesses Taught At This Point In Your Life?

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  for example, they pride themselves in what they don't believe such as immortal souls, the trinity, hellfire, etc.. some exjws still believe it is the "truth" and support the basics.. .

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  leaving_quietly

  I believe expelling someone from the congregation is scriptural. (1 Cor. 5:13) However, I do not believe it in the same way WTS does. The purpose of this is to remove any who would cause scandal to enter the congregation, thereby making it an object of accusation by unbelievers. This was especially important in the first century when the Christianity was new. In the context of 1 Cor 5, Paul was dealing with reports of fornication so shocking that it was worse even than among the nations (1 Cor 5:1). So, I believe the teaching, but WTS takes it to the extreme. I rather like this fellow's more balanced approach to it:

  http://bible.org/seriespage/how-handle-scandal-1-corinthians-51-13
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  22

  Stop Supporting Satan!!!

  by The Searcher in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  sunday's study article makes a very damning statement!!!

  paragraph 15 ; .........resting our hope on our savings, investments, or ability to earn money in this system amounts to resting our hope on .......... satan.

  (watchtower january 15th 2013).

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  leaving_quietly

  Here's the paragraph in full:

  "For months, Alex could think of little else. He found it difficult to focus on spiritual matters, and he lost sleep. But the stocks never rebounded. Alex lost his savings and had to sell his house. “I caused my family great pain,” he admits. But he learned an important lesson. “I now know that anyone who puts his trust in Satan’s system will be profoundly disappointed.” (Prov. 11:28) Indeed, resting our hope on our savings, investments, or ability to earn money in this system amounts to resting our hope on “the god of this system,” Satan. (2 Cor. 4:4; 1 Tim. 6:17) Alex has since simplified his life “for the sake of the good news.” He will tell you that doing so has made him and his family happier and has drawn them closer to Jehovah.—Read Mark 10:29, 30."

  Of course, it's okay for WTS to have investments, but not okay for the rest of us. Double standard at its finest.
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  19

  When will you NOT go anymore ?

  by Phizzy in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i ask this of all who know ttatt and yet still attend, i am interested, when will you judge it is the right time not to go to meetings anymore ?.

  a big part of me wants to say ".

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  leaving_quietly

  I've been trying to figure out how to get out quietly, but cannot. I may have to one day just walk away completely. Cold turkey. It will have to be combined with leaving a failed marriage. That's the only way out for me, I'm afraid.
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  11

  Can anyone help?

  by Pink sapphire in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  hi, i'm doing some research, which many here have participated in and could do with some help.. on another forum some months ago someone commented that in a july 1992 watchtower it said that the emotional effects of disfellowshipping may last far beyond reinstatement.

  i thought this a really interesting statement and would like to include it in my assignment, acknowledging the harm done by disfellowshipping and its not just a protective and disciplinary process.

  i don't know if i believe they would actually go that far.. my problem is that i have no access to wt literature (i dont really want fo visit my old congregation library) and the online library on www.jw.org only goes back to 2000. does anyone here have access to bound volumes and a bit of time that they could check this out for me?.

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  leaving_quietly

  w91 10/1 p. 18 par. 18 is what I think you're looking for:

  Sin still has an aftermath. For example, a disfellowshipped wrongdoer may repent and be reinstated in the congregation, but it may take years to overcome the tarnished reputation and emotional trauma resulting from sin. Meanwhile, how comforting it is to have Jehovah’s forgiveness and the support of his everlasting arms!

  It's the only statement similar to this in the years surrounding 1992.
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  32

  VICTORIA, AUSTRALIA | The Age newspaper | March 15, 2013 | Jehovah's Witnesses a 'cruel cult'

  by jwleaks in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  the age newspaper | fairfax media | friday, march 15, 2013. jehovah's witnesses a 'cruel cult'.

  http://www.theage.com.au/national/jehovahs-witnesses-a-cruel-cult-20130315-2g5x3.html.

  christian sect the jehovah's witnesses - with 64,000 active 'disciples' in australia - are a cruel religion with no soul, according to melbourne cultbuster raphael aron.. his warning comes as the federal government considers tightening the definition of a charity to prevent some cults and quasi-religions keeping their tax free status.

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  leaving_quietly

  I agree with you, Cedars. What he meant by "entrenched" could certainly be viewed the way you described, and is reasonable. However, at that point in the bible study, the person could see that, make the connection, and then back out without any repercussions whatsoever. Of course, by this time in the study, the student has likely been to many meetings and has been indoctrinated beyond the point of no return, so I see your point.

  The second point about JWs believing birthdays are not in the bible is still valid. JWs don't believe that at all.
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  68

  Raphael Aron in The Age newspaper: Jehovah's Witnesses 'a cruel cult'

  by WinstonSmith in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  this popped up on the age website today, might have to buy the paper tomorrow..... http://www.theage.com.au/national/jehovahs-witnesses-a-cruel-cult-20130315-2g5x3.html.

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  leaving_quietly

  double post...

  I agree with Apognophos. There are inaccuracies in here. I spotted the ones about birthdays and commented on those in the other post.

  http://jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/scandals/249213/1/VICTORIA-AUSTRALIA-The-Age-newspaper-March-15-2013-Jehovahs-Witnesses-a-cruel-cult

  Unfortunately, an article with inaccuracies will be dismissed without a second thought by JWs.