Posts by Bobcat

23

New JW study book / method announced on JW Broadcast

by Funky in

so did anyone catch the january jw broadcast?.

it's the "spiritual content" of what would have been introduced in the october annual meeting, had the october annual meeting taken place.. morris, splane, and jackson introduce a new jw study publication: "live forever eternally - an interactive guide".. details were sparse, but apparently it is a 256 page book (when in actual printed form), primarily designed to be used in its electronic form, stuffed with links to videos.. it is designed to be "just one book" to be studied prior to baptism, where "all 60 questions that baptism candidates have to know" are found in just one place.. the purported reason is to make jw "bible" studies more "productive", i.e., lead to more baptisms.. splane brought out the governing body's "great concern" that 10 million+ "bible" studies are conducted by jws every year, but the number of baptisms has been stuck at 200,000 - 300,000 per year for decades.

so the thinking is, this new book + a "new method of conducting studies" (again, no real detail, but apparently it involves more "discussion" and less "question and answer").. want to know my thoughts?

Bobcat

Hi Smiddy,

Here is a PDF of the Didache. It didn't have all the extra WT stuff in it. That's why I said "the particular doctrines aside."

The Didache was more keyed towards Christian living without the convoluted prophetic WT stuff. It was also rather terse in its instructions compared with WT literature. The main prophetic idea in the Didache was the waiting for the Lord's return. Prophetic details and calculations cannot be found in it.

There are a lot of curiosities in the Didache, when compared to the WT. For example, it gives instruction and warning on who should't be given the Eucharist, but assumes that all baptized believers would partake.

Be that as it may, my idea in the comparison above was the movement by WT in simplifying by having just one publication for new converts. I'm sure it will still be bloated with WT speculation that is being passed off as "truth."

23

New JW study book / method announced on JW Broadcast

by Funky in

so did anyone catch the january jw broadcast?.

it's the "spiritual content" of what would have been introduced in the october annual meeting, had the october annual meeting taken place.. morris, splane, and jackson introduce a new jw study publication: "live forever eternally - an interactive guide".. details were sparse, but apparently it is a 256 page book (when in actual printed form), primarily designed to be used in its electronic form, stuffed with links to videos.. it is designed to be "just one book" to be studied prior to baptism, where "all 60 questions that baptism candidates have to know" are found in just one place.. the purported reason is to make jw "bible" studies more "productive", i.e., lead to more baptisms.. splane brought out the governing body's "great concern" that 10 million+ "bible" studies are conducted by jws every year, but the number of baptisms has been stuck at 200,000 - 300,000 per year for decades.

so the thinking is, this new book + a "new method of conducting studies" (again, no real detail, but apparently it involves more "discussion" and less "question and answer").. want to know my thoughts?

Bobcat

From a practical standpoint (the particular doctrines aside), I can see it. It reminds me of the Didache.

15

I have read and re read acts chap.15 and for the life of me I can't find the part about the 1st century governing body!

by nowwhat? in

i cannot find the verse where it talks about several self appointed men that went behind closed doors to render their decision regarding circumcision.

all i see is that it was the apostles, older men and the congregation that came to a decision.

perfect example of why we need the governing body today.

Bobcat

They have worked the term "governing body" into a footnote in the rNWT at Acts 15:2. From there, to most JWs, it is as good as if the Bible said it. JWFacts has a page on the topic here.

22

Thoughts on Zoom

by waton in

the wt sponsored zoom meetings reduce individual freedom, spirituality.

the wt sponsored zoom meetings enables ego maniacs, narcissists to have their influence beamed right into your living room.

conversations that were private, personal are now broadcast, forced on all participants.

Bobcat

On the plus side of zoom meetings, there are inevitable delays and problems with unmuting commenters. And various elders (who are not so technical) provide a comical show of bobbing foreheads (without seeing the face) and/or unusual angles, and various other zoom gaffs.

So, hopefully, some of that will tend to mute what otherwise seems to be a doubling down on the brainwashing by the WT.

26

Being Reinstated

by azl0058 in

so my brother recently became df.

he has full intentions of being reinstated, but it is going to take at least a year.

if the end times occurs while he is df, will he still be allowed in the kingdom of god?.

Bobcat

1Cor 6:9-10 & Gal 5:19-21 lists types of practices that will bar the practicers of such from 'inheriting the kingdom.' Being disfellowshipped is not a practice but a man-made state, created by the WT, not the DFed one. For the WT, creating the state of being disfellowshipped allows them to include other 'sins' that are not really sins. It also allows them to control who is a JW and who is not.

Interestingly, Jesus gave Peter the 'keys to the kingdom,' and the WT claims there is no apostolic succession. (Mt 16:19) Yet, in practice, they believe there is, and that it leads to themselves.

8

Jesus speaks in third person

by menrov in

i stumbled on john 17:1,2 which reads in net version:.

17 when jesus had finished saying these things, he looked upward to heaven and said, “father, the time has come.

glorify your son, so that your son may glorify you— 2 just as you have given him authority over all humanity, so that he may give eternal life to everyone you have given him.. if jesus had a close relation with his father, would you not expect to read something like this:.

Bobcat

Hi Menrov,

One possibility, just guessing of course, is that Jesus spoke of himself in the third person due to his prayer having an audience (those present at the last supper). At verse 4 he does pick up speaking in the first person.

In other places Jesus also uses this third person reference to himself. (E.G. Mt 25:31-46) Moses often records himself in the third person in the Torah (assuming, of course, that he is the writer).

Another possibility is that the writer of the gospel account begins his recording of the prayer with Jesus using the third person self-reference as an editorial choice for the sake of people who would be reading the account later. Perhaps this was a normal way of recording historical events. But all the gospel accounts have Jesus speaking of himself in the 3rd person. So it seems to me more probable that this was Jesus own method of referring to himself.

There is an interesting StackExchange discussion of this topic here. (Although, admittedly, the StackExchange discussion goes on to center around the "Son of Man" title from Daniel 7:13, 14. And here is a short PDF on this topic. And here is another web-page on the topic.

In Jn 17:1 Jesus uses the 3rd person noun ("your son"), in verse 2 the 3rd person pronoun ("him"), in verse 3 a 3rd person name/title ("Jesus Christ"), and then picks up the 1st person self-reference in verse 4 ("me"/"I"). Perhaps there was some purpose in stringing those things together in that order.

17

Adultery, Divorce, Remarry

by azl0058 in

my brother (who is a witness) has been married for 8 years.

he and his wife (also a witness) got married young, but he never really tried in the marriage, but she also lost his trust early on.

he says that it was his fault though because he pushed her away.. anyways, he met this new girl (not a witness) and told his wife that he wanted to separate.

Bobcat

I think A-F (above) is right in that once adultery has been committed and a divorce has been completed (not just filed) then, the man and his wife are no longer "scripturally married." On the other hand, if the man and his wife engage in intercourse after the adultery has taken place, then, she (in the WT's eyes) has given up her right to scripturally divorce him (until he commits adultery again).

The result would be (after adultery + legal divorce) that both are free to remarry in the WT's view. With this exception: The wife would not be free to remarry her ex as long as he is DFed. If she did she would also be DFed for intentionally associating (via marriage) with a DFed person.

Since the man admits to committing adultery for the purpose of being free to marry the new girl, he can expect that he won't be reinstated for many years. I think the KS textbook says this in so many words. The elders would have to wait a long time to see evidence of repentance since there was, not just a 'moment of weakness' involved in the adultery, but premeditation.

11

New-Old Light on Alternative Military Service

by Vanderhoven7 in

not sure where i picked this up.

"new-old light on alternative military service.

fact 1: the watchtower sanctioned both military service and alternative military service under charles russell.. .

Bobcat

e-trainedHi V7,

The WT is a sorry, elusive bunch. Someone on exJW/Reddit put their viewpoint succinctly (copied to here).

Many of us went along with these things thinking we were obeying our Bible-trained conscious, not realizing we were really obeying "the commands of men as doctrine." It is a tribute to how adept WT has become in their propaganda techniques. Communists and despots of all ages would be nodding in approval at WT's mind-control abilities.

Thanks for assembling these quotes above.

18

Did You Fully Buy the WT View of Romans 6:7 (Acquitted of Sin by Dying) ?

by Sea Breeze in

romans chapter 6 is about saying goodbye to the old personality, the old man in the king james version.

the old personality must die, he cannot be fixed.

the old personality is characterized by dominance of the flesh.

Bobcat

Hi SB

We had an off-site discussion of Romans 6:7 here.

I appreciate the list of related texts.

12

More Mary Martha and Lazarus

by peacefulpete in

in a previous thread discussing the rich man and lazarus parable in luke, the relationship of this parable to the lazarus resurrection story arose.

as i said in that thread i'm pretty convinced that the writer of john fleshed out this character in the rich man& lazarus parable into a narrative featuring a man named lazarus.

the reasons essentially are:.

Bobcat

Hi PeacefulPete,

Here is a post I made on another site on the topic of a possible relationship between the Rich man & Lazarus parable and the resurrection of Lazarus.

And as a 'plot twist' not mentioned in your post, my link has a link to a thread discussing the idea that John was not the writer of the 4th gospel. See the last paragraph in my linked post for a link to that.

Well, you asked for "thoughts." There is mine. Thanks for the links in your post. I'll check them out.