Posts by spinner

45

How do the anointed know they are?

by jayhawk1 in

jw
friends

i have a question that no elder has given me a good explanation on.

how do the anointed jehovah's witnesses become that way.

i heard that somehow their spirit is born along with the holy spirit.

spinner

Dearest AGuest,
In order to understand what a seal is, we must go to the ancient
records. They were very common in the Holy Land. Hebrew seals were normally made of semi-precious hard stones. Many from the iron age, date from the 8th -6th century B.C.They were scaraboidal in shape, and flat at the bottom and convex on the top.Some were conical.One of the more famous seals excavated said "servant of the King" on it, and belonged to Asaiah, a servant of Josiah in 11 Kings 22:12. Most had names inscribed showing ownership, with a small carving, like praying hands,etc.What they were was a claim of ownership.

They were put on pottery, letters, documents. It denoted to whom the object belonged to. You can return to the scripture at Ephesians 1:13 which was given to the ones to whom Paul was speaking to, ones
alive.
" But you also hoped in him after you heard the word of truth, the good news about your salvation. By means of him also, after you believed, you were SEALED with the PROMISE of holy spirit,(14) which was a token in advance of our inheritance for the purpose of releasing by a ransom (God's) own possession ,to his glorious praise. The seal was God's promise, as God owned the seal.

Scripture in question, Rev 7:3

"Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until after we have sealed the slaves of our God in their foreheads." This seal is owned by Jehovah, and the Lamb. We know this because in Rev.14:1
the 144,000 have HIS name, and HIS Father's name written on their foreheads . This is the seal of owership, the one early christians
understood.
You say that the seal is holy spirit.

There are many "seals" in the Bible. 1. figure of speech -see Song of Solomon 8:6,"Set me as a seal upon your heart." 2. Literal seal, the seal on the tomb of Jesus. 3.Figuratively- in John, Jesus sets
his seal on revelation from God (3:33).Abraham receives circumsision as a seal, Romans 4:11. And many others.

So a blank statement that a seal is holy spirit does not fit.

Now you say that the sealing on the forehead by the angel of God does
not signify the 144,000 to have been faithful until death. You first site, John 11:26 in which Jesus says "everyone that is living and exercises faith in me will never die at all. Do you believe this?"(to Martha)Are you saying Martha, is still alive, or she turned to disbelief after Jesus raised her brother from the dead? That is utter
nonsence. When Jesus spoke of the resurrection of the dead, He said,
"did you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying,'I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob?' He is the God not of the dead, but of the living." THEY DIED FAITHFUL they are not
still alive.

You say this is "putting off the flesh with the blood, and puting on the flesh with holy spirit, the blood of God...It does not require
one to die as JESUS demonstrated" So now, Jesus didn't Die either?
YOU DO NOT BELIEVE HE REALLY DIED? You need to study your Bible.
It states HE DIED. Look up the condition of the dead at Ecclesiastes 9:4-6. That is the condition of the dead. If Jesus did not really
die, the Bible lied.

45

How do the anointed know they are?

by jayhawk1 in

jw
friends

i have a question that no elder has given me a good explanation on.

how do the anointed jehovah's witnesses become that way.

i heard that somehow their spirit is born along with the holy spirit.

spinner

My dearest AGuest,

Thankyou for questioning my reasoning!! This gives me the opportunity to explain myself. You say that you disagree with me that the seal given to the slaves at Rev 7:3 "is given upon death."
Two Types of Sealing

Ephesians 1:13,4:30-------the seal of the promise of Holy Spirit
given to those while alive
Revelation 7:3------------fulfullment of the promised seal on the
forehead given after dying faithfully
(sign of absolute ownership)
Spinner

9

One year tomorrow

by Tesha in

i have been disfellowshipped for one year tomorrow.

i have been alone through out this time and completely lost.

recently i decided to look up jw sites on the internet and found a moving story of a lady who had been through a similar experience to mine.

spinner

Dear Tesha,

I think something that will help you feel much better about yourself, is Ezekiel 9:3, where it says,there was a man that was clothed with linen at whose hips there was a secretary's inkhorn.
And Jehovah went on to say to him,"Pass through the midst of the city, through the midst of Jerusalem, and you must put a mark on the
foreheads of the men that are sighing and groaning over all the detestable things that are being done in the midst of it. (5) And to others, he said, "Pass through the city after him and strike...But to any man upon whom there is the mark do not go near..."

The organization today that bears Jehovah's name,is no different than Jersalem, it must be clean. There are thousands that are sighing and groaning over the detestable things that are being done in the name of Jehovah. It has become a lurking place for demons. I KNOW God's Kingdom is not going to be run by the Governing Body Of Jehovah's Witnesses. It must be turned over to our King, Jesus Christ, and a mighty struggle is now being fought by the org. to maintain their control, any way they can. I believe anyone IN the org. who does not see the errors and who does not eventually flee, will perish.

Do not look down upon yourself. In the WTO, I was made to feel wicked, because I couldn't fit in and agree and be a slave as all the others who never thought for themselves. It is real easy in that situation to do something you'll regret later.As a person who was sighing and groaning over the slavery in the WTO, you had a mighty struggle. Be steadfast, and continue to seek the REAL TRUTH, and you will be able to help save your loved ones .. much love spinner

12

Happily gone forever!

by Steve Josef in

i was raised as a jw.

i do believe that what they call a religion is in fact, child abuse and mere brainwashing.

i have since left, but rements of this cult still haunt me today.

spinner

Dear Steve Josef,
What I am hearing is that you have a conscience, the knowledge of right and wrong and are acting on that conscience. Romans 2:12-15, says," for not the HEARERS OF THE LAW are just before God, but the DOERS OF THE LAW wll be justified. Whenever the nations, who do not have law (us) keep the laws by nature,.......who demonstrate the work of the law written on their hearts, their conscience co-attesting... accusing or defending .. that will be the day that
God judges the secret things of mankind through Jesus.

Basically, this means that you believe Christmas is wrong, and you
act accordingly. You have a clean conscience. Anything you do, check
the original Hebrew and Greek,and make a decision on facts you see.
After doing research,I don't see anything wrong with birthdays,but,
you are the only one who can do the research and decide for yourself.
When you were in the WTO you could never decide for yourself. You have been released from slavery, now you have the freedom to act as a confident, informed individual. Spin

4

Wondering

by AC in

i have kind of lurked here for a while.

i'm 40 years old.

a housewife.

spinner

Dear Cam,
I am glad you found your way here. I wish I had been cautious like you, and had not gotten baptised at all in the org. I think I
hear you saying "I have a need for GOD in my life". That's great!
So where do you go? There is a scripture that says to me, there is
no true religion, Romans 2 12 -16. It tells us that when the people of the nations, who do not have law, keep the laws by nature, that will be the day God judges the secret things of man through Jesus.
So, as long as the blessings, and destruction of armageddon have not
arrived, that tells me no one is "in the right religion".

What are the laws we keep by nature? Exodus 31:12-14 say the most
important law is the Sabbath Law, and anyone who does not keep it will
positively die.How do we keep this, the most important law, by nature?
Easy to understand, but very hard to do.

If you keep the Sabbath laws by nature, no buying, no selling, no burdens, no fires, no work and you must be very happy, you are in
PARADISE.That's EXACTLY how Adam and Eve lived. AND THAT my dear one, is God's fulfilled Sabbath-- GOD"S KINGDOM realized!!! At Matthew 17:20-21 Jesus said, "For, look! the kingdom of God is in your midst. The Greek word translated midst, is more accurately translated "in you."So YOUR ACTIONS bring God's Kingom to the earth.
So many say, "I wish God's Kingdom was here" It is here when you decide to act!
What will happen to you if you live this way? Look at Luke 14:25-
33; notice it says in verse 33,"Thus, you may be sure, none of you that does not say goodbye to all his belongings can be my disciple."

Matthew 24:36-42 mentions some will be taken, and some will be abandoned. Those "taken" are those who are gathered together to HIM++
(Jesus).Read 2 Thessalonians 2:1-12. Also, read Mark 10:29,30. It will not be easy, but you will get life by keeping the Sabbath.Remember, the oldest known MSS says in Rev22:14," Those who
keep God's laws have the right to the tree of life"(see the Diaglott) Also, Rev 12:17 says," and the dragon grew wrathful at the woman****, and went off to wage war with the remaining ones of her seed, WHO OBSERVE THE COMMANDMENTS OF GOD, and have the work of bearing witness to Jesus."
++Some believe that this is talking about the 144,000. But Rev 7:3
says," Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees, until after we have sealed the slaves of our God in their foreheads." This sealing
is done on their foreheads, a mark of unconditonal ownership of God,
carried out by God's messenger. Unconditional ownership is only given
to one who has died faithfully, as any person can sin (Moses, David) and fail.So this sealing is done at death for the 144,000. So this gathering is of the great crowd.

p****referring to parousia, Greek for "alongside, substance, female."
not presence, male-- Jesus. Matthew 24:24, says correctly translated,
"For false Christs and false prophetess Greek-pseudoprophetes (pl) will arise and will give great signs..." verse 45 says the faithful and discreet slave (neuter, not male, fem) who is "in charge of HIS HEALING" not of the domestics. see Acts 7:37,says ..Moses said to the
sons of Israel, A Prophetess God wll raise up for you--female, NOT MALE(see Diaglott).

Jesus said, KEEP AWAKE! With this accurately trans. Greek, you can be more AWAKE, so as to be one who is GATHERED TO HIM. Going to a
"church" that does not teach the truth, just to fulfill your need for
God, might cause you to not have enough OIL in your lamp, and be lost
forever. Pray for God's insight. Spinner

JayHawk 1 I am with you! Do research, research, research. "Be Sure of ALL Things"

13

fallen angels

by largo in

i was really bored when i found this forum.

i didn't think it that a community of witnesses chatted and carried disscussions on the internet.

how refreshing i though!

spinner

Largo, You say, "If that really happened, why don't you...." Believe me, I've done it all. Do you have any idea how powerful the Society is? They can and will buy off anybody to destroy someone who can prove they DO NOT HAVE THE TRUTH. When I was going to meetings,
I would never have believed a story like the one I told here. I also
never believed a person could get df'ed for doing nothing. I don't blame you for your disbelief.You want to check me out? Look at the big brown Bible, on page 23,(revised 1984) Gen 7:11--It says in the foot note the " second month " corresponding to the latter half of October and first half of November. This calendar they are referring you to was called the Ancient Hebrew Calender, which the Society now has, but refuses to use. They use the one the Babylonians gave the Israelites upon their release from captivity. This month is called Tammuz. This is the month the ancient Jews weeped for the god Tammuz. The Bible says NOT TO FOLLOW PAGAN GODS, and You and all the Society use this pagan calendar to ascertain the day of the most important day in the lives of Jehovah's Witnesses, the Memorial of Jesus. YOU ARE FOLLOWING TAMMUZ!!! as the day YOU KEEP is completely wrong!!!You are in Babylon the Great. As long as the WTS uses this calendar they are in Babylon. I found this calendar 7 years ago, and the WTS doesn't want anyone to have it, because I found it, and THEY DIDN'T. Why don't you write and ask why they don't use it? I will give you a copy upon your request, as they will not give you one. It's the only truly perpetual calendar in the history of man on the earth, and the most accurate. This calendar I gave to them last year, before the memorial.

Have you heard the expression," The Society has never lost a court case?" When you have an org. as large as the WTS, full of imperfect
humans, it is natural for mistakes to be made. So why have they
never lost a case? In my case, they got a court order, I learned this
from a CEO of my telephone company, to tap my phone. They knew every
attorney I contacted, and went to them and "told them why they should
not rep. me. Sometimes the recording divice was so loud I couldn't use the phone. If they are always in the right, why go to such lengths? And they had to have LIED to get the court order. I have
NEVER gone against the law in my life, and I have never hurt anyone in
my life. I am a 53 year old grama with MS--

By the way, when I was a witness, I NEVER talked to df'ed ones. Why
do you? My guess is that you have doubts, or you just aren't a good
brother. spinner

19

Would you believe me if I told you?

by spinner in

i grew up with parents who hated jw's.

my grandmother was a secret.

witness,no one ever knew.

spinner

outnfree, thankyou so much for your reply,
1. Your first question was "what were the reasons given for the request for the guardianship, and the ganting of it?"
I had placed my husband in a hospital for an overnight stay, and
he was to go to a specialists in Wash. St. the next week for a completely curable illness. I got a phonecall the next morning when I was to pick up my husband, and a social worker said,"I have your husband and am putting him in a mental hospital."NO REASON. They immediately went to the court and petitioned for guardianship saying there was a medical emergency, that Tom resided in a mental hospital and had no one to care for him. They said there were attachments to the petition -- doctors statements, who documentd my husband's incapacity. No doctors statements have ever been found 2 1/2 years
later. They did not serve their guardianshop petition on any family
member, and the doc. says no family qualifies to be notified. Why did
they call me, if I was not family? Also, they PUT HIM into the mental hospital,and they knew he was married and lived with me(now 18 yrs).
No charges were filed against me, and Tom did not even know he
was in a guardianship, as he was never allowed to speak in court.They
immediately removed all our money from our banks, and sold our stocks, and forced Tom to sign numerous documents he was not allowed to read. I went to over 50 attorneys and I heard all the same thing, If I represented you I would loose my business, and have to move. One attorney said, These people use mafia-like third world tactics.
No one seemed to know who "THESE PEOPLE"were.Also some were told I was a "woman of ill repute".

2.Your second question was, "How was it I was accused of attempted murder?" The police and the social workers were in my yard constantly, and tried to frighten me and starve me so I would leave. I only got $600 to live on for the entire 1st year, and they thought I would leave and go to my family and they would take our completely paid-for farm (It is hightly suspected my husband was forced to sign an abandment property doc.) When I refused to leave, they put
in a court doc. I tried to poison my husband with B-6. Interesting
that my research was on B6 that I had given the Society. They also said one of my family members said I tried to kill someone else. No formal charges were ever levied upon me after 2 1/2 years ( as they are unprovable) Also, the charges of B6 poisoning are medically impossible. They removed the charges just this past week, as I believe they are starting to fear trouble from someone I asked for
help from.I asked an attorney for help one year after the guardianship was granted, and he snooped for me, and I have a doc. he
gave me that says there was NO FILE anywhere. It was all fraud.
I went to get my husband, who had been placed into a nursing home, and I was arrested. I told everyone it was a false arrest as no restraining order could be found, and no guardianship papers
either. I was still arrested. I waited three hours and they put together a restraining order I was told later it was just barely
enforcable. I asked another attorney to read my documents, after they put together a file, and he said "Your husband was taken, and the guardianship is on you."( No attorney would see after the first
appointment.)

3.You also say you are astounded at our long trip cross country and that I didn't have the letter from the Society with me.I had complete trust in the Brothers in New York. There was no reason to think I would have to "shove the letter under their noses" as you put it. 'Also, my husband and I are retired,and the trip seemed like a fun thing to do for both of us as I had been sick for several years,
and we both had cabin fever. I also had never been to New York. Hope this helps answer your questions. Spin

19

Would you believe me if I told you?

by spinner in

i grew up with parents who hated jw's.

my grandmother was a secret.

witness,no one ever knew.

spinner

This is Spinner again---I know this is all very hard to believe, so I am giving you a small part of the research I gave the Society :

IMMUNODEPRESSION: Study on carbohydrates shows 100 grams of
orange juice significantly decreased the capacity of neutrophils to
engulf bacteria. After 5 hours, the control values were still below
normal. Hospital librarys contain the research data you can request:
Study on carbohydrates: Sanchez A et al. Role of sugars in human neutropilic phagocytosis. Am. J. Clin. 26:180, 1973 also: Cheraskin
E. Sucrose, neutrophilic phagocytosis and resistance to disease. Dental Survey 52(12):46-48,1976

SMOKING CAUSE AND CURE: Hyperestrogenism can be experienced by both men and women, and symptoms are anxiety, irritability and nervous tension, etc., Ingested animal fats are synthesized by anaerobic bacterial flora producing female hormones in the cancer causing form, estrone, estradiol and 17 methoxyestradiol. Smoking, exercise, and
vitamin B6 all lower endogenous estrogen levels and decrease risk for
cancer. Research of GE Abraham, Premenstrual tension syndromes;A Nut-
tional approach. Anabolism 5(2):5-6,1986. Also, Cramer DW et al. JAMA April 11, 1986. also, Follingstad AH. Commentary: Estriol, the forgotten estrogen? JAMA239(1):29-30, 1978; Cole P., MacMahon B. Estrogen fractions during early reproductive life in the aetiology of best cancer. Lancet 1:604-6,1969 and more upon request.

Research suggests the removal of caffeine, sugar and reduce salt, and
reduce or eliminate dairy, and calcium. Also, animal protein ingestion produces 50% more hormones in the bloodstream, most likely because of the fat.If you think you need meat, boiling the trimmed, lean-type meat might have tolerable amounts of fat.The use of olive oil(studies show inactivates bacteria) instead of butter or margarine goes along with this. Digestive enzymes should be taken with every meal , or use Adolf's meat tenderizer (protein enzymes) on cooled meat. And Abraham suggests B6 500 mg. sustained release form daily will decrease symptoms. RBC magnesium was found to be significantly lower than normals, 400mg.daily ( eat whole grains, high in mag ) suggested by Abraham GE, Lubran MD. Serum and red cell Mag. levels in patients with premenstrual tension. Am, J. Clin Nutr. 34:1264-66,1981 (studies also show water with chlorine kills enzymes-so avoid drinking. You might have to boil water if spring water not available
or bottled).Exercise moderately, frequently!! Good Health to You!!

To withhold this info (not only promotes illness )but someone is choosing who can be in good standing by not telling them research is available to easily quit smoking. They are playing GOD. Spinner

13

fallen angels

by largo in

i was really bored when i found this forum.

i didn't think it that a community of witnesses chatted and carried disscussions on the internet.

how refreshing i though!

spinner

Largo! so glad to hear from one person who truly needs to read my,
"Would you believe me if I told you?" Do you drink orange juice?
ONE WHO LOVES JEHOVAH, and the REAL TRUTH. Spinner

19

Would you believe me if I told you?

by spinner in

i grew up with parents who hated jw's.

my grandmother was a secret.

witness,no one ever knew.

spinner

I grew up with parents who hated JW's. My grandmother was a secret
witness,no one ever knew. She taught me to love Jehovah. I never regretted that. But when I became an adult, I got MS, and died in
1992,Dec., and was revived. During that time, I was bed-ridden for 9 months, almost completely unable to walk, I had lost 90% of my vision, and was just bones. So, as I improved, I used the time to
seriously study medicine, and Hebrew and Greek. I had lots of time!
My husband cared for me 24 hours a day, and I was lots of work. I owe
him my life.
Well, I, like a good JW, gave my research to the Society. I found out oranges, and orange juice encourage bacterial infection. Also, I found out why the human body craves smoking. and the natural cure. I gave the info to a JW naturepath in Texas, who said it was very important research and to put everything down in writing and send it to the chief of staff in the infirmary in Wallkill, NY. I
sent the letter, with all the medical references, and when I received a letter, several months later from the "Brothers" in NY asking for more info. my husband bought a 31 ft 5th wheel trailer and we went to New York as I had said in my original letter to the Wallkill Doctor, that further research could only be given in person.
My husband was being very generous, as he was never a JW, and we had to travel from our home in Montana, all in all, a large expense for him.
Would you believe, we got to the headquarters, and they said no
letter could be found from me and no letter could be found from the society inviting me to give more info? They kept us in a room all day until 5 PM, (we only left for lunch) and then they said that if
we did not leave immediately, they would call the police and have us
arrested for trespassing!! My husband and I were totally shocked.
We thought there was some mistake, and waited for a week and called every day to see if the error had been corrected.
After that treatment, I knew no one wanted my research, and so I
stopped going to meetings. After 1 1/2 years, I got a call and the
local brothers said if I didn't come down to the kh immediately, they
were going to take committee action against me. I was told later I
was disfellowshipped and called an apostate from the platform. To make a very long story short, I found out the brothers at my local KH have access to my private phone calls, and are involved in the fraud
ulent taking of my husband in a guardianship. We are being divorced
against our will, and everything we have is being taken.
These people are causing the death of my husband from medical neglect. My house has been broken into, I have been repeatedly threatened. I am listed in the courthouse as attempting to murder
two people. I nearly starved to death the first year my husband was
taken, as all our money was removed from our bank, and all our stocks were cashed. My husband's retirement money goes directly to the so-
called guardian. I can't work.

What happened to my intention of helping the brothers?

I believe the doctor is a false brother. He must want to steal my research for himself and thinks he can do so when I am completely
homeless, and discredited as an abuser of my husband, and an attempted murderer.

But I have research he doesn't have. I have been giving it to
everyone I can think of. I also wrote the GB and told them the story this doctor must not want them to know. After almost 2 weeks, I've
heard nothing. By the way, I called three weeks ago, and the Bethel family still has orange juice at breakfast!!

Thankyou for listening. I believe only God himself can help us
Spinner