Posts by OHappyDay

13

Watchtower pressure backfires!

by yesidid in

jw
friends

a witness friend told my husband this:

at the sm recently

the po was giving the congregation a pep talk.

OHappyDay

The Society talks out of both sides of its mouth. On the one hand, there are these kind articles in the Watchtower and books like Draw Close to Jehovah that highlight God's loving mercy and understanding, that indicate that whatever one can do happily is sufficient. On the other hand, there are the guilt-inducing articles and talks that constantly affirm that one's best is still not good enough!

"Put not your trust in nobles, nor in the son of man, to whom no salvation belongs." That means the "nobles" and men who run the Watchtower Society as well.

Anyone seeking salvation from that source is due for disappointment.

17

Jw's----No visible decrease.

by integ in

jw
friends

unfortunately i am seeing no visual decrease in the meeting attendance at kingdom halls, assemblies, etc.

i am hearing stories of packed district assemblies, and am seeing bigger attendance at the kingdom hall, not less as i might expect due to all the scandals and exposing of false prophecies etc.

it's very depressing.

OHappyDay

People have to believe in something. Even the churches of Christendom are experiencing fantastic growth where I live. So if mere numbers "prove" that Jehovah is blessing us, He must really approve highly of the Baptists, Methodists, Apostolics, Holiness, Independents, and Catholics!

17

Are these the "crucial" years for the Watchtower ? Is time running out ?

by run dont walk in

or can they keep it going another 100 years.. maybe i'm being a little too hopeful, but i think the next 10 years are do or die for the watchtower.. is was different back in the 20's 30's 40's 50's and 60's, they could get away with changing doctrine and "new light" and new ideas.. but today, people are different and more independent, and question things a lot more.. the "annoited class" is almost gone, regardless of the bs figures they give, .

1914 is all but dead, .

literature is not available like it used to be, .

OHappyDay

It isn't really all that hard. Just continue the oft-touted reforms began when the Society sought to go back to primitive Christianity. We often criticize other movements that had this objective, but stopped somewhere along the way to completion. Now, we've done the same thing.

Going back to primitive Christianity means getting rid of our "traditions of men" that invalidate God's Word: Putting an organization in the place of Christ; making rigid Pharisee-like rules and regulations; disfellowshiping people for disagreeing with mere human speculation; setting quotas (hours, numbers) for the preaching work; making non-biblical requirements for appointments of servants; making Christianity a matter of classes ("other sheep class," "anointed class") rather than a brotherhood of believers, etc.

We haven't gone back to original (primitive) Christianity. We have established a religion with its own pecular teachings and doctrines, embellished by the traditions of men. That being the case, we are no different from all the other religions out there.

20

Is leaving the org. easier today than years ago?

by JH in

jw
friends

who is out there to help jw's when they decide to leave the organization?

if it wasn't for forums like this one or internet in general, what aid would those who leave the organization get?.

if we go back a few years before the internet was available to everyone, how did these people who quit, heal from their jw experience?

OHappyDay

I haven't left because I have family in, and right now they are more important to me than my personal persuasions.

But I have distanced myself emotionally and intellectually from all former beliefs that the Society is always right, or any instrument in Christian salvation. To me, the Society is like the Jewish Law was to the apostle Paul: Useful for a time, but no longer necessary, certainly not necessary for salvation. Unlike many, I refuse to replace Christ with the Organization.

I think the absolute squashing of freedom of conscience will be the Society's undoing. The strict regimentation is chafing to many, as well as unscriptural.

An organization that honors the truth would not distrust its own people. Nor would it fear the truth.

6

"Learning from the Great Teacher"

by Stan Conroy in

my jw father felt the need to leave this new publication at my house.

lucky me!

i was leafing through it, and noticed a quote on page 155 about birthday celebrations.

OHappyDay

Catholic scholars have been right about many things that Catholic tradition has been wrong about. Not only in the matter of birthdays, but even in the matter of the Trinity, the Catholic Encyclopedia has been forthright concerning its being a doctrine of the developing, not the original, Church.

But using academic sources does show that not all the opinions of Jehovah's Witnesses are merely dogmatic, sectarian opinions, devoid of the weight of scholarship.

Unlike us, however, the scholars are free to debate and to disagree. We have to humbly accept the newest light of the moment...or else!

20

I Did Jesus come in 1914?

by ClassAvenger in

i think i have read this somewhere, but do the jehovah witnesses believe that jesus came and spoke with some members of the watchtower organization?

is this a lie, or do they truly believe it?

if it is true, do they state it in any book or magazine?

OHappyDay

Jesus may have come in 1914. But since we believe it was invisible, we have only circumstantial evidence (wars, famines, lawlessness, etc.) that is susceptible to interpretation.

The problem I have with the preaching work it that it is too regimented. There is no biblical justification for preaching quotas. Perhaps people would enjoy it and feel more like volunteers if it had not become a matter of rote and ritual. Now the Society even tells us specifically "what to say about the magazines." Everything is taken out of our hands.

Perhaps the leadership does not trust the rank-and-file to serve out of the goodness of our hearts. Right now, it is push, push, push. All the "anointed" don't want to be dead before Armageddon strikes, so they resort to the whip to speed up the work.

I really don't think God is blessing this. The Organization has replaced Christ in our everyday speech.

25

The generation that by no means would pass away until all things occurred

by professor in

jw
friends

wow!

i longed for the day when the last of the anointed remnant was on his/her death bed and all of the witnesses awaited to be swept away into the new system.. who knew that they could just, with one stroke of "new light" change everything and do away with this hope/doctrine.

how many times did i preach it from door to door and misrepresent god and the bible!

OHappyDay

The thing is, the Bible says the spirit knows, and the person knows, but it says nothing at all about a group of men knowing, or having the authority to decide who is or who is not, "anointed."

Nor does the Bible give any group of men the authority to un-anoint anyone, or declare that someone is not of the anointed. Recent WT articles have tried mightily to convince some who feel they are of the anointed to renounce their anointing.

This is blasphemous, since the Society has no authority whatsoever to stand in the place of the holy spirit.

5

Excerpt from Al Kidd on organ transplants and blood transfusion

by setfreefinally in

this is an excerpt from the article "abstaining from blood" from the following cite, provided for your comments/amusement.

he tries to answer the question why, even though jws were wrong on the organ transplant issue is not a reason to throw out the baby with the bath water.

http://www.geocities.com/rogueactivex/blood-kidd.htm.

OHappyDay

I really wonder why it is that the holy spirit has to give this organization its truth piecemeal and in zigzag fashion, coming back and contradicting itself from time to time. That is not the pattern set in the Bible. What kind of spiritual paradise is it when people who disagree with any aspect of the Society's teaching are threatened with spiritual death, especially when the Society disagrees with itself over time.

For example, much was made in Sunday's WT Study about our "correct" understanding of the Superior Authorities. If I had given that interpretation of it when I came into the truth, I would have been disfellowshiped! Back then, the Superior Authorities were Jehovah and Christ, and woe to anyone who said otherwise. Now the holy spirit has revealed the truth to us finally. Surprisingly enough, Christendom had that "truth" long before we did.

Of course, our "correct" understanding came from Jehovah, while Christendom's came from Satan, no doubt......

3

I Couldn't Take Heaven Away...

by OHappyDay in

i have a real problem when i meet people who are sure they are going to heaven.

the problem being that i have no authority to talk them out of it.

according to the new testament, only "the spirit" can determine who goes to heaven, not me nor any organization of men.. we say that only 144,000 go to heaven, but the bible does not say that.

OHappyDay

I have a real problem when I meet people who are sure they are going to heaven. The problem being that I have no authority to talk them out of it. According to the New Testament, only "the spirit" can determine who goes to heaven, not me nor any organization of men.

We say that only 144,000 go to heaven, but the Bible does not say that. Not even in the two verses in Revelation that mention the 144,000. Those verses nowhere say, 'these are the only ones going to heaven.' That is an interpretation Witnesses make. But I couldn't take heaven away from anyone, merely based on an assumption.

Nor are we in any position to say who the 144,000 are. Only God knows that. He is under no more obligation to accept our "anointed" than He is to accept anyone else's "anointed." If Christendom's millions are not anointed, what proof do we have that ours are?

This whole teaching of only 144,000 going to heaven is one of our weakest links. It cannot be proven by the Scriptures.

33

Comments You Will Not Hear at the 7-13-03 WT Study

by blondie in

comments you will not hear at the 7-13-03 wt study

reviewer comments will be in black or parentheses.

wt quotes will be in red or quotations

OHappyDay

Words that no JW should be allowed to use:

1. SOON

2. NEAR AT HAND; SO CLOSE AT HAND

3. EVIDENTLY

4. APPARENTLY

We just don't know the meaning of those words, otherwise we would not use them.

Also, without them, we would have no doctrine at all.....