Posts by TheRedPill

23

Hi -New Here

by RandomTask in

i want to share since i'm new here!

i was more or less born into the jw religion and raised as one.

my mom was a pretty strict believer, but she didn't get baptized until i was 9, "surprisingly" my parents got divorced three years later.

Like yourself, my husband and I left the organization together. Luckily, my side of the family left as well, but his side are still "true believers" no matter what the organization does. We have been out for two years now and still receive the Watchtower and Awake from his mom. What's funny is, the more we read the publications, the more we feel that we made the right choice! The inconsistencies and the hypocrisy are what drove us out. My husband had some serious theological questions regarding basic teachings and could not get any answers out of the local elders or the printed material. All the elder could say was "why is it such a big deal?"

We have come to the conclusion that although being part of the Borg was not for us, IT IS for some people. His family are classic examples. They are perfectly happy were they are at and we feel that it would only be destructive to take it away from them. I don't think that people are doomed to everlasting destruction for being a JW any more than they are doomed for not being one. We also felt that not "officially" withdrawing was the best way to go for similar reasons. It would cause serious divisions in his family if we did. So we try to remain semi-anonymous as well. (except for my picture posted on Mulan's thread--haha!)

Anyway, I always say take your time before you make any decisions regarding who you talk to about this. Once you've told someone you can't take it back. I think that those that are saying to live a life that proves the WT wrong about "apostates" (term used VERY loosely) are correct. Just make sure that WHEN your family begin to have questions about the organization that you are there to fully support them. Hang in there!!!

9

Are Muslims backed by the Christian God?

by TheRedPill in

i was reading in the book of a genesis today and came across an interesting set of scriptures, genesis 21:17-21. it talks about how after abraham sent hagar and ishmael from her house, hagar wandered about in the wilderness and finally, after running out of water, sat down with her baby ishmael and prepared to die.

gods angel then appeared to hagar and told her to rise up, and that ishmael would be the father to a great nation.

he then led her to water and hagar and ishmael and she lived a prosperous life in the wilderness of paran.

TheRedPill

spider,

I have been dealing with the same types of things since leaving. Naoh's flood, The Red Sea, Jonah, other "miracles" that happened in the OT, even the miracles that that Jesus performed are all seeming rather illogical to me. They are all taught to be so literal, yet I am starting to lean more toward the idea of them simply being legends passed down from parents to children. These legends become embellished, and instead of true, accurate, literal accounts, they simply become the "Aesop's Fables" of ancient times. The stories are inaccurate, however the moral of the story is still there.

I just thought it was interesting how all my life I skipped over, or it was never pointed out to me, that God promised the Muslims the same eventuality as the Christians. Again I am led to ask if you have to be Christian to obtain salvation.

6

Questions for Amazing and real estate agents?

by Leander in

jw
friends

i think i've reached the end of my candle with full time corporate jobs.

sitting in one spot for 8-10 hours is getting harder and harder for me.

i've been kind of kicking the idea around of becoming a real estate agent.

TheRedPill

I am a mortgage broker and work on a commission basis as well. My big piece of advice is make sure that you have a way to bring in some money while you build your business. It is pretty tough going at first, but can pay big dividends after a few years.

If you are in Washington State post a reply and I can e-mail you the name of a friend of mine who is an agent. He works for a company that charges a small desk fee, not a percentage of your fees collected. He says it is a much better deal than some of the larger companies where you end up paying over $20K to use their name.

Good Luck!

25

Ear pierced

by blahman in

jw
friends

i'm a jw and i know jw's are not supposed to have tattoos but im wondering if its ok to get my ear pierced.if anyone has any information regarding this please reply.thank you.

TheRedPill

"the tattoo scripture" -- Lev 19:28. This scripture is obviously to be taken literally. "Thou shalt not get tattoo's"

Lev. 19:27 -- "You must not cut your sidelock short around, and you must not destroy the extremity of your beard." (NWT) Obviously God was just kidding with this scripture...everyone knows that you can't be a spiritual person in good standing with God if you have a beard.

Lev 19:19 -- "...and you must not put upon yourself a garment of two sorts of thread mixed together" (NWT) Damn...there goes almost all of my District Convention suits...

9

Are Muslims backed by the Christian God?

by TheRedPill in

i was reading in the book of a genesis today and came across an interesting set of scriptures, genesis 21:17-21. it talks about how after abraham sent hagar and ishmael from her house, hagar wandered about in the wilderness and finally, after running out of water, sat down with her baby ishmael and prepared to die.

gods angel then appeared to hagar and told her to rise up, and that ishmael would be the father to a great nation.

he then led her to water and hagar and ishmael and she lived a prosperous life in the wilderness of paran.

TheRedPill

I was reading in the book of a Genesis today and came across an interesting set of scriptures, Genesis 21:17-21. It talks about how after Abraham sent Hagar and Ishmael from her house, Hagar wandered about in the wilderness and finally, after running out of water, sat down with her baby Ishmael and prepared to die. Gods angel then appeared to Hagar and told her to rise up, and that Ishmael would be the father to a great nation. He then led her to water and Hagar and Ishmael and she lived a prosperous life in the wilderness of Paran.

I would like to know what others think about the promise that God made that Ishmael would be father to a great nation. Muhammad believed that he was a descendant of Ishmael, and so, those of the Muslim faith follow the teachings of Ishmaels line. Why do you think God promised that Ishmaels descendants (Muslims) would become a great nation, as well as promise Isaac that his descendants (Jews/Christianity) would also become a great nation. Growing up as a JW I was always told how Gods promise to Abraham about Isaac was a prophetic sign that Christianity was the true religion. Does anyone have any thoughts on:

1.) Why the promise to Ishmael is not treated with the same weight as the promise to Isaac

2.) Why the God of the future Christians would promise that the line of people that Muslims came from would be a great nation.

3.) How it seems that the feud between Isaac and Ishmael continues today through the Christian/Muslim wars.

15

Advice needed- please help!

by detective in

jw
friends

yesterday i received a surprise phone call from my jw friend.

we met up and uhhh, it was quite the mind-blowing event.

i can't believe it.

TheRedPill

The hardest part for me about leaving was losing the "hair standing up on the back of my neck" feeling that I was going to die at Armageddon. Leaving an organization that convinces you that all outsiders will die is very difficult. CoC really helped me because it took many of the dotrines that I had questions about and broke them down for me. I saw another side to the issues. It was nice to realize that I didn't HAVE TO ACCEPT the interpretation presented by Franz, but that it was just another possible way of looking at things. As a witness, that is an entirely new experience.

The other thing that helped me lose my feeling of dread was understanding WHY I was leaving the organization. I still believed in Christianity, morality and God. I just didn't believe in some of the doctrines that JW's taught. Many of those doctrines MUST be accepted to maintain a good standing in the congregation. That was the reason I had to leave, I couldn't accept them. I feel that even if I am wrong, I can honestly stand before God and say that I left for the right reasons. I left in my search for Him and the real "truth."

I would say certainly show him CoC. It helps to show that JW's while, in general, are good people...they don't necessarily have the one and only true religion. My experience is that that is rather comforting while leaving.

Best wishes to both of you. It's a difficult journey. Take it slow. Also, I agree with Joelbear...Do it quietly. There is no reason for him to force the ones that he cares about to shun him.

Take care--TheRedPill

38

Cases involving minors

by TheMatrix in

jw
friends

many on this forum criticize elders as being incompetent.

i've know a few myself, but you must agree that there are also very good elders also.. well, here is a case and i would like to know what you would do if you were an elder.. a fourteen (14) year old male has sex with a twelve (12) year old female.

the female confesses to her parents and the parents report to the elders.

TheRedPill

matrix,

once again you pull a great argument technique for the foundationally challenged. Ask a very general question so that you can say WRONG ANSWER and then give a very specific "right answer." Again the issue is the morality of reporting the child abuse to the authorities, an issue which you have yet to address...

BTW, great photo for such a learned Witness. Love the gun.

14

I NEED EVERYONE'S OPINION

by StinkyPantz in

jw
friends

i was recently disfellowshipped, i guess about 9 months ago, but i always figured that i would get reinstated.

fortunately, i decided that since i wasn't an active witness i could go ahead and read all that naughty apostate literature that we weren't allowed to read before.

well, i'm glad that i did, because now my eyes are open.

TheRedPill

I agree with Ballistic. One of the major arguments that the WT presents of why the rank and file should not have anything to do with "apostates" (word used very liberally) is that "they pull you out and then leave you with nothing." Although we all know the faults of the organization there are some people that literally NEED it. They do not want to think for themselves, they want someone to tell them what to do and that everything is going to be all right. Some have found a tremendous amount of strength within the JW that has gotten them through some horrible times in their life.

I don't feel, personally, that someones eternal salvation is in jeopardy because they are a JW any more than if they belong to any other religion. Because of I feel that way, I find it difficult to justify tearing away what is a huge part of somebodies life and happiness, just because I think it would be better for them/me.

When people are ready to see the truth, be right there to present it to them. Until then, be sure that you are there for you little brother and the rest of your family. Demonstrate that you are still a good person and that you truly want what is best for them, whether they remain witnesses or not.

26

What To Say To The Next JWs At Your Door?

by TR in

householder: hey, you are the people from that religion that hides pedophiles, aren't you?.

'hovah: whaaa?

hh: yeah, i saw "dateline" the other night on how 'hovahs protect sexual deviants.. 'hovah: well, you can't believe....... hh: no, no, i did some research after watching the show, now the wts is synonymous with corruption, deceit, slander, death, suffering, and the like.. 'hovah: well i uh, don't know about, uh, any problems, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh, uh!.

TheRedPill

Matrix,

You really should apply for JR Brown's position!!

The issue is not whether state laws require elders to support child molesters, the issue is the immorality of NOT reporting child molestors. Using the individual state law to sidestep the true issue is an excellent example of what is known as a "red herring." Very common tactic used by those that have no real support for their argument. Throw somebody off the true issue by dragging another issue into the picture.

Please provide another post dealing with your response to the true issues, eg. "mouths of two witnesses" and the morality of reporting pedophiles to authorities and those in the congregation.

ps--what is a Witness doing referencing a "R" rated movie as their name? Do I need to bring out the WT CD-ROM?

8

Let's have a Hawaiian Luau!!!

by TheRedPill in

i ran across an interesting disclaimer in the june 8, 2002 awake.

there is an article in there titled "let's have a hawaiian luau.

" the first paragraph says that "millions of visitors come to hawaii to...take part in our world famous luau, or hawaiian feast.*".

TheRedPill

Just looking to get my daily dose of "spiritual food" Mulan, Luau style!!