Thirdson

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Posts by Thirdson

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  29

  Tell Me More About 1975

  by Diner in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi, i'm interested in learning more about 1975 only from a jehovah witnesses.

  i understand it was thought to be the "end of the world" by us jws but it didn't happen.

  nonjws need not comment.

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  Thirdson

  I was still in high school in 1975 and was one of three JW's (2 baptized, one my friend, would get baptized later).

  I didn't say much about being a JW and was glad I went to a hall with little territory in my school district. However, I remember the jibes about 1975 when kids found out we were JW's. Of course I used to say that it was all speculation and "we" never said it "would be" just "could be". However, the community at large well knew that JW's were going around telling people that 1975 would be the end of the world. There were a few famous people who became JW's and made comments about 1975. (Peter Knowls the footballer {soccer} being one of them).

  If you weren't a JW then, weren't born then or had little contact with JW's then you might not know much about the 1975 speculation. But a look at the published figures from the WTS will show you the 1975 spike. There was rapid Witness growth from the mid 60's to 1975 followed by a big dip in the late 70's before a smaller growth rate emerges in the 80's. The Proclaimers book hides the dip by widely spacing the scale (P 242) or by starting the graph at 1976...clever hey?

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  12

  Last Night's Elders Meeting.

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  last night i concluded a very lively social evening by talking with an elder who was enjoying a few late gin 'n'tonics in my local pub.. suitably booted and suited, my dubinthepub pal told me that he had just been to an elders meeting, conducted by the co.. he said that a lot of stuff was only handed down by word of mouth these days.

  but, new light that he had just received, was as follows: (bear in mind that we were both pretty steamed by midnight!).

  1. elders must call on all dfd ones once a year to encourage them to turn back and where necessary to have their questions answered.

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  Thirdson

  Hi E'man,

  3. Governing body members no longer had to be FDS.

  If this is true it has big implications. If the GB is not made up of FDS members then where is the FDS? Maybe then the GB never had members of the FDS. The WTS could say that the FDS is not the 144,000 and hasn't been identified yet. Either way it spells big changes and more problems for the faithful. Afterall, the annointed are NOT supposed to die off before the big A as the line of communication would be cut.

  No FDS, no appointment in 1918/19, questionable reason to have to keep 1914.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  20

  I Can`t Get To Grips With This FDS Thing.

  by Englishman in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i`m trying to understand the process by which jw`s link the "faithful and discreet slave" parable to a belief that this refers to a number of people who will go to heaven ie: 144,000.. also, i am trying to understand how, by extension, some of this number comprise a "governing body" that is at the top of "jehovahs earthly organisation".. i really dont understand how these conclusions are reached and would appreciate some input.

  please note that when i posted this question on h20 some months ago i received only 1 reply from friday, who saw fit to ridicule me for my lack of knowledge on this subject.

  i still don`t know the answer!

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  Thirdson

  Hi E'man,

  You are not surprised that faithful JW's haven't replied? This is one of the least defendable doctrines. I posted some questions to the real JW's on Beliefnet. No one attempted to defend the doctrine or answer my questions. It is one of those beliefs that only gets defended at the Watchtower study when members read the statements from the paragraphs. Outside the Kingdom Hall the doctrine can't be explained. JW's would dismissively say, "its too deep for worldly people." Which is the coverall for anything that can't be defended but has to be accepted.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  28

  I am materialistic

  by expatbrit in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  last week i had a phone conversation with my family back in england.

  my parents had figured out that something wasn't usual about my attitude to the "truth", so they started grilling me: have i been to meetings?

  going in field service?

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  Thirdson

  Hi Expat,

  You received the typical JW response. When I told my parents that I intended to bring my non-JW girlfriend (now wife) to the UK on a visit I got the grilling about my beliefs. I received a letter (I have previously posted it on H2O) where I was accused, among other things, of being materialistic. (If you move to a different country, enjoy a good life style, are successful at work, and reap the benefits...you must be materialistic.)

  The hardest thing for JW's to accept is that you can examine religion and find theirs lacking. To them, there has to be something else, materialism, sexual misconduct etc. They cannot accept that people can reject their teachings and even worse still have a faith/belief system.

  Regards,

  Thirdson
  (South of the border but still north of you)
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  22

  Their Time Will Come.....

  by ISP in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  despite an abundance of evidence that hits at the heart of the wts, it should be no surprise that many seem to ignore everything and continue.

  you may wonder why particularly as many of us were in the wts and did not ignore the comprehensive mass of proof against the claims and teachings made.

  typically brothers can enjoy themselves as elders.

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  Thirdson

  Oh....who's that young new poster in the back?...why it's brother Farkel.

  Welcome to the board. This place will really rock!!!

  You made some good points. I wonder how my oldest brother (an elder)feels. He never responded to my last e-mail when I asked some difficult questions concerning the blood doctrine. I wonder if he believes the lies or knows the truth and lives the lies.

  Best regards,

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  39

  The dilema of Uncle onion.

  by uncle_onion in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  my dilemma.

  those of you who know me personally and via the web will know that i am a studious person.

  now take a look at genesis 36:31. this verse says these were the kings who reigned in edom before any israelite king reigned.. at the time of writing genesis, they were no kings of israel.

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  Thirdson

  Uncle,

  Just be because Jesus quoted a well known fable to his Jewish listners doesn't make the story true.

  If Noah's flood was really global why do we have polar ice caps with a 400,000 year history? How could they exist and at the same time have a world with an entirely different atmosphere and ecosystem capable of flooding the world? The fact that many different cultures have flood legends doesn't mean a Noah style flood. During the last ice age sea levels were lower than they are now. A land bridge existed bewteen Britain and France and the Black sea was not connected to the Mediterranean. The global rise in sea levels could be imbedded in many culture's oral history and give rise to the numerous flood legends today. That event coupled with local flooding could be the reason for the legends from Mesopotamia.

  As for Moses, he didn't write all of the Pentateuch for sure and no-one knows the real individuals for the sources. What is known from an examination of the text is that there are 4 different sources.

  Read the Flood account, there are two different accounts woven together. Read each event and you will see it described twice, from how God felt, to how many animals are taken in, from the time duration to the bird used to detect dry land. I was surprised at first but on re-reading the account it made sense.

  I hope this helps.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  21

  Christmas Shopping

  by Duncan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  dear all.

  i'm a new chap here, one of the old h2o refugees who seem to have been streaming to this place recently.. englishman suggested i post my "christmas shopping" post as a kind of introductory-hi-and-how-are-you.

  hope you like it, despite it not being terribly seasonal at the moment.. i'll look forward to posting here in the future (original stuff i mean, not just reheated "greatest hits" like this).

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  Thirdson

  Hi Duncan,

  Welcome to this place. You know most people already but it is good to meet up again.

  Regards,

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  15

  Meet the Parents!

  by ShaunaC in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  well, i went to see my parents last night.

  it was the first i had seen or spoken to my mother in over 8 months.

  i also was able to see my nephew who is almost 2 and whom i haven't see in exactly a year.

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  Thirdson

  Hi Shauna,

  Welcome to this board. I greeted you on H20 but I have been posting less and less there as this board has surpassed it in quality.

  I have a similar problem with my parents although we converse regularly they never ask too much in depth about me. I also live 4000 miles away which makes visiting infrequent. The good thing is that you are moving on with your life and moving to somewhere and someone better. We can't live our lives just to please the unrealistic expectations of our parents. While we care and love them for who they are we need to find the important things and pursue our own happiness, freedom and dreams outside of the crushing walls of JWdom and the judgemental attitudes of those of live within.

  Best wished to you,

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  52

  Neanderthals and the Bible?

  by uncle_onion in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i am doing some research on neanderthals.

  we know that this species existed and by very recent dna test we can tell that they are definitely not human.has any one done anything on this subject or the accuracy of carbon dating?

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  Thirdson

  Uncle,

  I found the full article on Early Australians. It is not quite what I said earlier but that the difference in early Australian's mtDNA compared to modern humans doesn't discount them as being modern humans and thus Neandertal mtDNA differences does not infer a different species. We could well be related if not sharing some ancestry.

  Thirdson

  This is the article from Scientific American.
  

  HUMAN ORIGINS
  DNA from Ancient Australians

  The study of modern human origins has traditionally relied on fossil and archaeological data, and genetic studies of living populations. But in recent years researchers have succeeded in retrieving ancient DNA from fossils, adding a compelling new data set to the mix. So far, scientists have focused on DNA from Neandertals, a population of archaic humans who inhabited Europe and western Asia. The sample size is small (DNA from three specimens has been analyzed), but the results indicate that Neandertal DNA—at least the DNA from the cell's energy-producing organs, the mitochondria—differed from our own. As a result, a number of researchers concluded that Neandertals must therefore have been a separate species. Critics, however, have charged that without mitochondrial DNA (mtDNA) data from anatomically modern humans of similar antiquity for comparison, such differences are virtually meaningless. Now new research published today in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences is filling in that gap, and the results may force some scholars to reconsider the evolutionary position of the Neandertals.

  Gregory J. Adcock of the Australian National University and his colleagues retrieved and studied mtDNA from the fossilized remains of 10 ancient but anatomically modern Australians, including a 60,000-year-old specimen known as Lake Mungo 3 (LM3). Intriguingly, like the Neandertal mtDNA studies, analysis of the LM3 sequence revealed an mtDNA lineage that no longer exists as such in living humans. "If the mtDNA present in a modern human (LM3) can become extinct, then perhaps something similar happened to the mtDNA of Neandertals," population geneticist John H. Relethford of the State University of New York at Oneonta writes in a commentary accompanying the PNAS report. "If so, then the absence of Neandertal mtDNA in living humans does not reject the possibility of some genetic continuity with modern humans." That is, the much maligned Neandertals may well be among our ancestors. —Kate Wong

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'
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  4

  MORE ON 144,000 GOING TO HEAVEN

  by Bruce144 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  1. the fallen angels left their abodes and cohabited with the daughters of men.

  jude 6, gen. 6: 2-4.

  2. they were placed into tartarus, after the flood, a lower debased position.

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  Thirdson

  Hi Bruce,

  I asked the question the other day if "fallen angel Bruce" had posted here yet. It seems that "speak of the Devil and who should appear?"

  Welcome. Thanks for the manifesto, can you keep it in its place and in its own topic and not post it in every thread.

  We'd appreciate it.

  Thirdson

  'To avoid criticism, say nothing, do nothing, be nothing'