Posts by TMS

When Charlie M. left Bethel in 1959 he was very tight-lipped about his experience. All he would say: "I learned this is an organization of imperfect men."

He privately dissuaded me from even thinking about Bethel service.

Obviously, the "imperfect men" disclaimer is used as a buffer from stumbling over the actions of individual adherents to a "perfect" cause. The reality is that all these causes are really imperfection squared:

Imperfect men following the imperfect rules of imperfect men imperfectly.

TMS

67

Spirits/Entities - A question for all.

by Nemesis in

i would like to ask a question if i might: how do ones here view spirits?

(not the alcoholic kind) i have left the org.

now for at least 5 years, although i did go to the memorial last year, but not where i used to go to the hall; i was not df or da.. .

TMS

Do you have an explanation, TMS?

No, teejay, I have no explanations anymore, just observations.

A seemingly sane JW sister once sought help in removing an entity who was sexually assaulting her. My instinct was that she was not making the story up.

My wife's experiences occurred primarily before her baptism. She was encouraged to call audibly on the name of Jehovah. That seemed to work initially and then she began to experience a sort of paralysis and was unable to move her lips.

Of course, these experiences took place in an area noted for such things. You may recall a few years ago the University of Texas student who was lured by a beautiful hispanic woman to a satanic ritual in Matamoros, where his body was offered in sacrifice. This is the area I'm referencing.

TMS

67

Spirits/Entities - A question for all.

by Nemesis in

i would like to ask a question if i might: how do ones here view spirits?

(not the alcoholic kind) i have left the org.

now for at least 5 years, although i did go to the memorial last year, but not where i used to go to the hall; i was not df or da.. .

TMS

Before my wife and I married, she lived with her grandmother in a community noted for witchcraft, voodoo, cursings and spirit activity.

My wife's grandmother had lost a daughter, Aurora to illness. Aurora, a couple of years before her death, had lost an infant child.

The small front room of the grandmother's house contained a large mirrored dresser with a picture of Aurora's baby in front of the mirror. During the night, drawers in the dresser would open and shut. A baby's cry could be heard clearly. Sometimes the room light would turn on. Once, when my wife got up during the night to check on the noises, she passed the tall dresser just an instant before it tipped and fell face down on the wood floor.

When my future wife cried out to her grandmother about these goings on, grandma said not to worry. It was just Aurora coming back to see her baby.

TMS

14

Not if, but when...

by teejay in

jw
friends

i was raised in the truth.. it was about six weeks past my fifth birthday when my mother was contacted by "jehovah's people" and a few months short of my sixth when she got baptized a half year later.

that was the summer of 1962.. because of my experience with the truth from such an innocent age when thought patterns were first being formed, one of the tricks that was played on me one of the lies that was passed along is that some of those of my generation happened to be among the most fortunate of all of mankind since some of us would never die.

if i did my best; if i tried hard enough and did everything that was within my power to do; if i found favor with the most high god, i might well be one of those who'd never taste death at all but live right through this world's end into a global paradise.

TMS

Dear friend, teejay:

a topic near to my heart: death! LOL!

I equate the new world/system/order hope with the teenage invincibility syndrome. Teenagers are not, of course, more courageous than their adult counterparts, just unaware of the dangers.

Twenty years ago when my employer first offered 401k, it seemed like money-down-a-rat hole in my new order mindset. It wasn’t only that death in this system seemed mathematically unlikely, but “where was my trust in Jehovah?”

Now, like you, I not only think about death. I incorporate it. My wife and I discussed just this morning that we had finished our last bit of unfinished business. Finally, a happy son.

Sort of a euphoria has set in for us. Most everything looks good, smells good and tastes good. Even North Texas terrain with its stark winter dormancy looks good. The goldfinches look good. Mr. Redbelly Woodpecker looks good.

Take care.

Tick, tick, tick . . . . . .

TMS

67

Spirits/Entities - A question for all.

by Nemesis in

i would like to ask a question if i might: how do ones here view spirits?

(not the alcoholic kind) i have left the org.

now for at least 5 years, although i did go to the memorial last year, but not where i used to go to the hall; i was not df or da.. .

TMS

SusanHere stated it succinctly:

When it comes to spirits, visions, etc. it is a very simple matter. Those who have had them, believe in them. Those who haven't, usually mock those who say they have.

Very true. . . . .

TMS

6

JW Legalism's Bitter Fruitage

by metatron in

jw
friends

there's been so much suffering in this organization - that could.

have been prevented by building up individual consciences - instead.

of emphasizing cult-like obedience to watchtower rules.. talk about "the road not taken....!.

TMS

metatron,

Lou Holtz suspended his three best players just before the 1978 Orange bowl. When reporters asked what rules they had broken, he simply said they had violated his "Do Right" rule.

Watchtower publications frequently used Proverbs 14:12 to show that we were not individually equipped to "do right":

"There exists a way that is upright before a man, but the ways of death are the end of it afterward."

The myriad talmudlike Watchtower rules actually weaken our resolve and ability to "do right" without being told just as the OSHA mandated back brace allows the back muscles to atrophe.

TMS

33

I've Cried for Days

by Smoldering Wick in

jw
friends

i have been separated from the jws now for 4 years.

the first year, i went into a deep and severe clinical depression.

i think that's what happens when you are 3rd generation jw, born and raised.

TMS

For some reason thread didn't go back to the top. Let's see if this does it.

TMS

33

I've Cried for Days

by Smoldering Wick in

jw
friends

i have been separated from the jws now for 4 years.

the first year, i went into a deep and severe clinical depression.

i think that's what happens when you are 3rd generation jw, born and raised.

TMS

Dear Sister,

Sorry to have contributed to your pain.

Your sister-in-law and I set a series of irreversible consequences in motion back in ‘93 when we invited our just DF’d son back into our home, a decision we have never regretted for a millisecond. All the theocratic trappings dangled in front of us seemed like so much “refuse” when compared to the most precious thing to ever enter our lives.

We tried to act with dignity while keeping a low profile. Both of us had severe health issues, which in my belief were hastened by the tremendous emotional upheaval we experienced. Our view of matters has been in the developmental stage for nine years now as your sister-in-law and I have discussed for thousands of hours every aspect of our lives, beliefs and regrets.

The “reliable source” you mention is our only reason for living. Those years ago he did not miss a meeting , working nights while in a DF’d state for eighteen months. He worked hard for reinstatement, not because he wanted to be a JW, but because he loved us. For the next several years, he worked hard to physically “set us up” in our new location. What a “wicked” individual!

I’m sorry about the unpleasant visit with S. It seems she said some very unkind things, although her motives were probably good. Its almost impossible for a JW relative to discuss these issues in a dispassionate, reasoned way, not unlike the religious fundamentalist who calls a radio talk show to make a point, his voice cracking with emotion. He can’t conquer his nervousness because he is representing the “rightness” of his whole way of life, not just expressing a viewpoint or opinion.

I’m hopeful that the pain of this unpleasantness will subside quickly. I’m happy that you are at least able to take control of the direction of your life at a relatively young age.

Our best to your family.

Your brother,

TMS

9

Memories of Hillary - Part I

by Duncan in

jw
friends

upfront disclaimer: .

i know its entitled memories of hillary, but an awful lot of this post is, in fact, all about me and our hero doesnt actually get much of a look-in in this part.

but i need to tell the story right, and it starts with me.

TMS

a bit of Duncan:

when I ever did get out some books to study at home, my mum would be around with “ Oh, Duncan – studying the wisdom of men! You know it’s all foolishness in the eyes of Jehovah! Do something else – read up for the bookstudy!”

Educational sabotage?

Over forty years ago, I proudly selected non-academic courses that would be of practical help to my pioneer career: wood shop, metal shop, boy's home economics, automotive engines. All these classes were against the grain of my natural aptitude.

Unlike Duncan, I never recovered secularly, but still find myself in an entry level job just eighteen months from retirement.

Two small reminders from "All Those Years Ago":

1. notes in red on a homework assignment by my English teacher, Mr. Ewoldt: "TMS, this is another one of those assignments, that in retrospect, you will wish you had put effort into."

2. 1962 Theocratic Ministry School Schedule: 31 talks are underlined, meaning that I volunteered to give them on "short notice", usually ten minutes or so.

TMS