Posts by trevor

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

You make a good point. It all comes down to ego. Once someone has a belief that they identify with, a threat to their belief becomes a threat to their ego which in the fickle human mind equates to a threat to their very life. Absolute defence is then called for.

To lose a debate feels like death. The mind throws up every trick and diversion it can, like a mouse running from a cat, it become a life of death situation - in the mind of the believer.

In all this mayhem the reality of our precarious existence and the search for understanding is lost and obscured by insults, counter moves and rhetoric.

A sad waste of life itself...

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

trevor

Little Toe

If such a universal consciousness were not "conscious" in the sense that we might normally attribute it, why might it exhibit many of the mannerisms of a conscious entity?

Well, we as humans may be the manifestation of consciousness that was working at an unconscious level for millions of years. If all that exists is of God and God, then we are a part of God.

Or we may be thinking too much of ourselves and are just advanced bacterior that is damaging the planet while a perfect invisible intelligence looks on dispassionately. I have given up dogma and the defence of belief. I am just squirreling around for nuts to bury that may help me through the winter if I can remember where I put them!

Ross - I have read your posts with interest over the months and not always commented to avoid clashing with you as on the occasions that I have, you have been so reasonable and helpful. You have helped me mellow and understand the essence of Christianity and its many colours. You are an open minded fellow who while having a connection with Christianity and Calvinism due to your personal experiences still has the capacity to seek and explore. The opposite of a closed mind.

As this thread demonstrates - the more closed the mind the more excessive verbatim.

Where your travels take you is an unknown road but I would venture to suggest that the further you go the more uncomfortable you will become with labels because labels are restrictive and as an ex JW you have proved that you are not a person that is prepared to accept limits.

trevor

42

Does Being A Jehovahs Witness Lead To Disorders?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

does being a jehovahs witness lead to disorders?the life of being one of jehovahs witnesses was a challenging one at best .

and an agonizing one at worst.

i recall the days of my black depression .

trevor

All religion leads to disorders of some degree. Although, initially, there is a feeling of comfort and hope, cognitive dissidence creates an imbalance in the mind where everything has to be edited and slotted into a preconceived belief system.

The freedom that the mind needs to explore and grow as real experience provides lessons, is impaired. This leads to bigotry and a compelling need to defend ones beliefs against anyone that threatens the balancing act of belief.

trev

7

Seeking forgiveness from those who shun you

by cyberdyne systems 101 in

jw
friends

what i'm wondering is if you have hurt people by your actions and they happen to be jw's and your now disfellowshipped, and therefore they shun you, is there really anyway to say your sorry (other than submit to the congregation elders, and eventually (maybe) be reinstated).. this is kinda the situation i'm in.

i have done things that have hurt people, one's i see in connection with my family.

i want to be and say i'm sorry and regret things i have done, and yet it was never leaving the witnesses that i'm sorry for, rather my own actions that got me df.

trevor

cyberdyne systems 101

Unfortunately you are not dealing with rational people who are able to choose whether or not they will accept you or your apologies. You are dealing with a people who belong to a cult. This requires a whole different set of rules to those which apply to normal relationship. Understanding how their minds works helps but in the end they live by rules that are cast in stone.

You have hurt them and they hurt you. Why not just call it a draw? Sometimes we just have to move on and find a new way in life that does not include JWs.

trev

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

trevor

My impression was that LT was introducing a little humour into the debate. Simple as that.

13

Why did/do Jewish folks not believe Jesus was their messiah?

by Kudra in

also, what would constitute the presence of the messiah today (or whenever he does come)?

could a jewish guy just say that he is the messiah?

how would he prove this?

trevor

A lot is lost in translation with Jewish folks. They struggle to understand the difference between accepting a prophet and a profit.

450

Isn't God Awesome?

by Perry in

http://wonderofitall.com/

trevor

If you presuppose that the universe may have some form of consciousness then what would differentiate it from all the answers above that label it "God"?

This is sensible and interesting question by little Toe.

If we are prepared to allow for this possibility, we have to ask whether universal consciousness is the same as believing in God. Even as humans we recognise the different function of unconscious mind and conscious mind. Is the only consciousness in the universe that which humans and animal experience? Is our collective consciousness the same as the consciousness that the universe may be driven by?

An unconscious intelligence that manifests in the adaptation and evolution of living things is not the same as a God that gives direct commands and warns of Judgment Day. A God that requires worship is a huge step beyond accepting an unconscious intelligence pervading the universe and therefore all living things.

The Atheist versus Believer debate is like arguing about whether heads or tails is the right side of a coin. The existence of the coin that we hold in our hand is a reality, the rest is rhetoric and changes nothing.

I do not have the answers. What I do know is that the more words we use in our search for truth, the more we are prone to get lost in the word games that our conscious minds play and the more we become entrenched in a belief system that we feel a need to defend.

trev

22

Is it proper for men to tip their hats to women?

by ThomasCovenant in

apologies if you all have read this before.. watchtower 1952 15th april pages 254-256. it is the woman that is commanded to show respect and recognition of the mans position of headship, and women who rebel at it are not so much rebelling against men as they are against god.gen.

3:16; 1 cor.

11:2-10; eph.

trevor

In many ways Satan has taken the woman from the position assigned her by God, taken her from the home and its duties and put her into politics and commerce and religious leadership, and thereby caused much of the modern breakdown on the family front

This article was written in 1952 - before women's lib got a grip. In polite society women were treated by men and with deference which in its own way was part of the control of women that was culturally accepted at that time.

The set up of the Watchtower Society depends on maintaining submissive obedient women with men holding all key positions and the patriarchal Bible supports this male dominated set up.

This has nothing to do with Satan, God or spirituality. It is a man made set up.

Big organisations now see the advantages of harnessing women to the workplace and promoting them to head positions. The government see the revenue that this brings in extra taxes.

In any case most of the 'Brothers' wore hats from door to door, when I was growing up in the UK. They always touched or tipped their hats to women on the doors.

What I did notice about my father, was that he would touch his hat to most women. If she was particularly attractive, he would take it right off for moment. Very Freudian...

Trev

8

Belief And Non-Belief-Are They The Same?

by choosing life in

after reading the frequent threads on atheism verses theism, i find that both are very passionate about one thing, their beliefs.

atheists may not believe in god, but they are firm believers in the abscence of a god and evolution.

theists, on the other hand, are just as firm in their belief in a god and usually creation.

trevor

Belief and Non-belief are two sides of the same coin. They are both activities of the mind seeking to establish a substantial reality through the use of words. Belief is allowing ourselves to accept something that we have no evidence of. Just hope and illusion in place of experience.

While we debate whether or not we believe in a certain school of thought, reality slips away unnoticed.

James Thomas hits the mark again.

trev

77

Does A School Yard Bully Attitude Take Over This Discussion Board?

by The wanderer in

jw
friends

does a school yard bully attitude take over this discussion board?growing up, i can recall such times when a rival would want to pick a fight .

with me and when we met, he would bring along two of his friends and i .

sometimes, i would knock their block off and sometimes, it was the other.

trevor

Ooh! This is starting to look like a school yard fight.

Scratched knees and cut lips. Torn knickers and tears. Sounds great to me.

It takes me back to those wonderful days when fighting at school was allowed, even encouraged.