Posts by Xander

14

You Do not REALLY Love Me, WT Dec 15

by jgnat in

a paragraph in next weeks study had me seeing red.

then i thought, why should i have all the fun?

regular readers of blondie should be able to pick out the manipulative language.

Xander

to real love for God

What is 'real love for god', anyway?

I don't believe in a single all-powerful deity, but whenever I read 'real love for god' I remember sitting in a park. Locally we have a very large arboretum. VERY large, with some gorgeous ponds and pavilions overlooking them. I remember sitting in a bench on one, up on a hill, with a clearing through the forest enough to see the pond. It was early spring, so there was still patches of snow on the ground, although, the green grass was mostly dominant. The smell of wet, muddy earth just filled the brisk, fresh, air. Holden Arboretum has several pavilions with fireplaces in them, and this one was roaring away at the back, even across the room you could feel the warmth and smell the wood burning.

Across the pond wound one of many paths, and a deer was standing there eating, peaceful as could be. And sitting there, I was too.

THAT is 'real love for god'. Not a church. Not some religion. Not following a list of rules you had to consult each and every moment of the day.

Just sitting in a spot, at peace, and thinking of all the good you can do for the world.

Edited by - Xander on 20 January 2003 15:19:13

7

Drug War Blaspheme

by Ransford in

posted to: http://forums.crosswalk.com/[email protected]^[email protected].

i would appreciate getting opinions on the scriptural status of drug prohibition.

is there any evidence that the early christians had any prohibitions against using drug plants?

Xander

there was no such thing as a "drug problem" before we had drug laws. For example, a thorough search of the microfilm records of The New York Times from 1910-1914 did not reveal any heroin overdoses or drug crimes before drugs were outlawed (i.e. robberies, murders etc done because of drugs). Crime and drug use became entwined after the drug laws went on the books, not before.
No one was robbing, whoring and murdering over drugs when addicts could buy all of the heroin, cocaine, morphine, opium and anything else they wanted cheaply and legally at the corner pharmacy. When drugs were legal addicts held regular employment, raised decent families and were indistinguishable from their teetotaling neighbors. Overdoses were virtually unheard of when addicts used cheap pure Bayer Heroin instead of the toxic potions prohibition puts on the streets.

And interesting quote, to be sure.

And I think one others must consider. Granted, there WAS violence using drugs as the casus belli (see 'The Opium Wars', which was really just a thinly veilled excuse to expand into China), street level violence and drug-fuelled gang warfare was unheard of when narcotics were legal.

It would be fair to say if drugs had never been MADE illegal, their would be much less 'gang violence' today, and drugs would not have such a bad rap.

HOWEVER, that said, drugs HAVE been made illegal, which has caused a...paradigm shift...would you say? For example, the drugs in usage have changed into harder stuff, since quantities must be lower. Nations exporting drugs as a legitimate business have changed over to gun-toting cartels. Gangs are now in charge of local distribution, and have money to back them up.

Do you think, if drugs were legalized now, the cartels and gangs would just go away?

It's too late for that - the damage of prohibition has been done. No going back NOW.

65

do beer commercials cross the line?

by DanTheMan in

jw
friends

i was hoping to enjoy the championship game between the eagles and the bucs.. but no more than 5 or 10 minutes into the game, a budweiser ad comes on that uses a very obvious double entendre (a conversation between a man and woman that revolves around the very large sweatshirt she is wearing.

she makes comments like, "small ones are ok, but big ones just feel better.

" the commercial closes with her remarking about his "small hands".).

Xander

Nono - was raised a JW, but QUITE the 'true believer'. Totally bought everything they were selling. Even went through guilt periods when I through out all kinds of stuff (really pisses me off - when the CO came through preaching how Star Trek and SciFi in general was evil, I pitched the better portion of my first edition Trek paperbacks...from WAY back....)

Anyway, then I just always looked at what the world did as trivial and not related to me. So, I was never offended by anything specifically, since I was 'considering the source', as it were.

Now, little bugs me firstly because I've reconsidered what is really important. Being offended over advertising is silly, because it's just advertising. And, in the commecial you noted, what's to be offended by? It's not like *I* would ever be involved in a conversation like that. And, what of it if someone else is? And, so a company wants to run with that theme to try and sell their products to wannabe-cool-people.

So, what? Again, that's not me, so I don't care.

I don't think 'this world' is even bad for teens or kids. If they are taught that it is something fun, and desirable to have, then such advertisement or entertainment could sucker them in. It's not that hard for them to grow up at least a little aloof, though, which I don't think is a bad thing. As long, of course, as it is for a good reason - like, say, they are have an above average education, and they don't want to waste time with 'trivial' things.

You just have to really take a step back and consider what you have been taught - not just from the JWs, but from youth on (if it is different for you, it wasn't for me, obviously). Reconsider what is important, what you need to get offended about, what really has any meaning at all.

Things like commercials don't matter. They aren't worth getting worried about unless you live your life by them.

65

do beer commercials cross the line?

by DanTheMan in

jw
friends

i was hoping to enjoy the championship game between the eagles and the bucs.. but no more than 5 or 10 minutes into the game, a budweiser ad comes on that uses a very obvious double entendre (a conversation between a man and woman that revolves around the very large sweatshirt she is wearing.

she makes comments like, "small ones are ok, but big ones just feel better.

" the commercial closes with her remarking about his "small hands".).

Xander

mmm...

*scratches head*

No

Even when in the b0rg, I never took is seriously. Of course, then, it was "*sigh* - look how the worldlings fight amonst themselves for ratings/sales volume/etc. How trivial"

And, now it's more "*sigh* - look how corporate America fights amonst itself for ratings/sales volume/etc. How trivial"

37

Peace March around the World

by JH in

jw
friends

i watched the news on tv, and i saw reports of thousands of people all around the world asking for peace instead of war.

do you think that these peace rallies will really make a difference?.

do you think that these peace rallies will influence the president of the united states?

Xander

The extremist Arabs have promised that they will continue to seek to repeat the events of S11 until the US converts to Islam

True, but they are no more dangerous to us than the KKK (extremist 'christians', if you will - the direct parallel to the extremist 'muslims' the Al-Qaeda is).

Extremists can only reach out and attack us, like they did, if they can convince at least SOME of their population that their position is justified.

Yes, no matter what we do, there will always be Muslims who will hate the US no matter what. Just as, no matter what blacks or Muslims do, there will be KKK members who hate them no matter what.

But, unless we are feeding their position by our actions, a small vocal minority cannot hurt us. People of minority have proven time and time again in this country the KKK is wrong, and so the population of the US as a whole does not support them or believe them, and are CERTAINLY not willing to die for them.

The same will happen in Muslim countries if groups like the Taliban/Al-Qaeda/extremists are proven wrong time and time again about Westerners. The problem is, we AREN'T proving them wrong. We are doing to them exactly what the Taliban/Al-Qaeda/extremists is telling them we are doing.

Let these protestors go to Iraq and protest there.

You Iraqi?

I'm not, so I'm just wondering what you think gives you the right to decide how other countries should be run, or the right to try and affect change in them.

Edited by - Xander on 20 January 2003 13:59:23

65

do beer commercials cross the line?

by DanTheMan in

jw
friends

i was hoping to enjoy the championship game between the eagles and the bucs.. but no more than 5 or 10 minutes into the game, a budweiser ad comes on that uses a very obvious double entendre (a conversation between a man and woman that revolves around the very large sweatshirt she is wearing.

she makes comments like, "small ones are ok, but big ones just feel better.

" the commercial closes with her remarking about his "small hands".).

Xander

It is a shame that people just see these commercials as funny and harmless and don't recognize that they are the carefully crafted creations of ad agencies who conduct endless research on how to manipulate our emotions

So this is a 'with me or against me' kind of thing? People either hate the commercials and turn them off like you, or are being manipulated by the ad agencies?

Why does one have to care? What if you watch the commercials, note the stupid attempt to control the masses into buying something, and just ignore it? Does it really effect you that much?

Why, I wonder? Got some issues you need to work out?

than our society is lost without a map.

I think our society is doing ok. Could certainly be better. What is holding us back?

Well, mostly people who feel the need to be offended by everything are what is REALLY causing society to fall apart.

As long as many people continue to judge others based on their own personal standards, we are doomed.

Humanity cannot grow to any brighter future as long as we are continually held back by the 'lowest common denominator' - IE., the strictest conservatism.

11

Deuteronomy and her missing hand.

by Valis in

11. in case men struggle together with one another and the wife of the one has come near to deliver her husband out of the hand of the one striking him, and she has thrust out her hand and grabbed hold of him by his privates, 12. you must then amputate her hand.

your eye must feel no sorrow.

deuteronomy 25:11-12. .

Xander

How can people read such things and still believe that any god at all was ever responsible for this book?

I mean, it's just so obviously written by a men alone, it's not even funny.

I can just see it now...

bible writer 1: "Hey, and you know what, I really hate getting my balls grabbed by some bitch when I'm beating up her husband!"

bible writer 2: "Yeah, that really sucks!"

bible writer 1: "No kidding! We should do something abou that!"

bible writer 3: "Hey! I got an idea - make grabbing a guy's nuts in a fight a hand-chopping-off offense!"

bible writer 2: "But didn't we already used that one for a guy stealing one of my daughters without paying first? Or, wait, was that just general stealing?"

bible writer 1: "No problem, we'll just add a bit about not feeling sorry for her and call it even! HAH! Let's see Saria try and grab my nuts next time! Haha!!"

------------------------

~~5 thousand years later~~

------------------------

bible student: "I must live my life by the words of our loving creator, written in this holy book...."

Edited by - Xander on 16 January 2003 18:13:41

18

So Graham Norton

by joelbear in

jw
friends

this is my new favorite tv show on bbc america.

i watch it every day having recorded it the night before.. how do you all you brits like the show/?.

joel

Xander

Oh, gods, Father Ted is a riot.

But, yeah, it does really, REALLY offend some people here. (Gotta remember, something like 90% of the US population lives their lives, every day, looking for something to be horribly offended by and crusade against, so....)

15

Question: ONLY ANOINTED ARE UNFORGIVABLE ?

by Liberty in

minimus got me to thinking in his thread about the unforgivable sin and judging apostates.

i hope someone with a clearer memory than mine can confirm or deny what i remember.

i have some vague memory that the society taught that only members of the "anointed class" (144,000) could commit the unforgivable sin against the the holy spirit because only they had been called by it personally and, therefore, only they could reject it consciously and willfully.

Xander

Not true as of when I left (2 years ago).

By the time the unforgivable sin could be from anyone. Indeed, it was taught from the platform that if you THINK you performed an unforgivable sin, then you have.

I don't recall what justification they used for that, but at least the feeling in the congs then was quite certain that pretty much ANY working against the organization, including as little as doubting them to yourselves, was an 'unforgivable sin', so we must never even let doubt creep into our mind lest we lose any chance at all of entering paradise.

Course, our hall was always a little more ascetic than others - the scripture reading to the effect of 'you must do this, and this, and this, and this, and then MAYBE you will be allowed through the gate' was ridiculously popular to remind people that no matter HOW good they were, or how PERFECT witnesses they were, god may still smite them in the big A if he feels like it for no particular reason.

I don't know why they felt the need to instill such terror in kids - I mean, they told us point blank that no matter WHAT we did, we weren't going to survive into the new system. Unless, maybe, god felt like sparing us. But, don't count on it - it's not very likely.

34

Latest Watchtower PRAISES United Nations Relief

by minimus in

jw
friends

the feb. 15, 2003 wt.

has an article entitled, life in a refugee camp.

the whole article praises the unhcr, which is the united nations high commissioner of refugees.

Xander

GENERAL "NY" CORPORATE HEADQUARTERS, SUBSIDARIES, SPECIAL OPERATIONS:
Watchtower Bible & Tract Society (dba "Jehovahs Witnesses") Buffalo, NY Headquarters
Mountainbrook Ltd Partnership (dba "Watchtower Educ Ctr") Patterson, NY Headquarters
Watchtower (dba "Kingdom Farms") Lansing, NY
(snip few hundred lines)Watchtower Corp (dba "Jehovahs Wtnesses Kingdom Hall") Macon, GA

No, they're not hiding anything at all.....

Why do you ask?