Posts by Xander

62

JW Kids - More Frightened Than Most?

by Englishman in

jw
friends

ive recently been in contact with a couple of ex-jws that i knew in my childhood.. what has surfaced is the amount of fear that we experienced as young children when we were involved with the witnesses.

i accept that children often do develop irrational fears as part of growing up, but what i am talking about here is a deep-seated fear of being harmed.. many young children that i grew up with in the witness religion were of an unusually nervous disposition.

i recall how when i was first taken to meetings that i found the whole experience somewhat sinister and strange.

Xander

Two biggest fears growing up:

1) The great tribulation would start, and we'd be imprisoned/executed (that this would occur before I lost my virginity became a serious concern in my teen years - I kept seeing major world events happening that the society said was fulfilling scripture and thinking 'not yet, just a couple more years, PLEEEEASE, wait just a couple more years...'[8>])

2) DEEMINZ!!! They get into your house from old books! They get into your house from TV programs!! They attack you in your sleep!!! DEEMINZ, DEEMINZ, EVERYWHERE!!!!!

Uhhhh...I'm over all that now.....

11

Hotel California

by lv4fer in

jw
friends

elder concerned and elder faithful came by last night, to address some of my concerns/statements as to why i haven't been at the meetings.

we talked for and hour and a half.

i told them i didn't believe that it was god's spirit directed organization, i said i didn't believe that only 144,000 were going to heaven, i told them one did not have to be a jw to get saved, and they still want to come back and talk to me again.

Xander

Further, from BBC News online:

Article "'Hotel California' for Sale":
"A Mexican hotel which is rumoured to be the inspiration behind The Eagles' hit song Hotel California is up for sale for $1m.
...
But the band deny they ever set foot in the hotel, and insist they song was about surrealism and not property.

Instead, they say the 1976 track reflects the cocaine-fuelled Los Angeles rock scene of the time. "

11

Hotel California

by lv4fer in

jw
friends

elder concerned and elder faithful came by last night, to address some of my concerns/statements as to why i haven't been at the meetings.

we talked for and hour and a half.

i told them i didn't believe that it was god's spirit directed organization, i said i didn't believe that only 144,000 were going to heaven, i told them one did not have to be a jw to get saved, and they still want to come back and talk to me again.

Xander

that inspired the song

Hotel California is a metaphor for cocaine addiction. See "You can check out any time you like but you can never leave." This comes from the published comments of Glenn Frey, one of the coauthors.

43

Happy JW Marriages the Impossible Dream?

by IslandWoman in

while it is not impossible to have a happy marriage in the jw religion for many it is hard, for some it is very hard to maintain happiness in their marriage.

the watchtower raises the bar so very high in every aspect of life, marriage included.

the watchtower literature encourages a jw married couple to be practically perfect, or at least that is the goal set before them.

Xander

Of course, we know that it is not the only reason, but that wouldn't disqualify his statement

Depends on your audience. If you are talking a person who went to AA, but is still an alcoholic, and tell them that, they will assume they can't be helped and go off and kill their liver.

If you explain AA is NOT the ONLY thing that was the reason, but the person had to be willing to change to begin with, then they might still have hope.

To bring it into this example - saying the JWs were the REASON your parents marriage succeeded could cause someone reading this now with a rocky marriage to figure 'hey, I'll go join this cult, and it will fix my marriage'. Which is completely false.

Submissive does NOT equal inferior

Yes, but the WT teaches the wife IS inferior - 'an inferior vessel, the weaker one'. Go tell a woman she is inferior and weaker than man and she should be more submissive and see how long your relationship lasts. The only time it will work is if she is already brainwashed to think this attitude is okay. Hint: look for someone wearing a burka.

I HAVE heard elders encourage talking about thoughts, goals and feelings

That DON'T involve the WT? Really? Not 'goals pertaining to what to do in the new system'? Or 'feelings about when your entire family will be destroyed'?

Well, that's a pleasant surprise.

Of course they are programmed....

I can't understand how you are trying to justify this as an acceptable answer in any way, shape, or form.

dealing of feelings and emotions between marriage mates

But, only WITHIN THEIR RULES! The society counsels AGAINST marriage counselling, etc., which can really help people.

43

Happy JW Marriages the Impossible Dream?

by IslandWoman in

while it is not impossible to have a happy marriage in the jw religion for many it is hard, for some it is very hard to maintain happiness in their marriage.

the watchtower raises the bar so very high in every aspect of life, marriage included.

the watchtower literature encourages a jw married couple to be practically perfect, or at least that is the goal set before them.

Xander

You are either making the assumption that a good number of JWs are unhappy in their marriage or you have actually talked to a lot of JWs who have told you they are not happy

The problem with JWs who claim they are happy in their marriage is the same as the alcoholic you mention a few times. If you asked an alcoholic if he has a drinking problem, he's going to lie to you. Because he needs to for his own sanity.

Hence, the only people valid to talk to for 'JW marriage success stories' are those who are no longer JWs.

With the apparent exception of YOU, I've never met an ex-JW who was happier with their marriage IN the org than they were with it OUTSIDE the org.

Which tells me that the WT's marriage policy is a failure.

5

Crystal Blue Persuasion

by BONEZZ in

jw
friends

anyone remember that tommy james song?

dub legend says it was written about the "truth" book.

i've listened closely and i guess it could be true.

Xander

Well, hell, I'm wrong - it IS a religios song:

According to Tommy James himself, "when I wrote Crystal Blue, it was taken from the book of Revelation: the imagery of the new Jerusalem."

Huh, another charming urban legend bites the dust. Ah, well...

5

Crystal Blue Persuasion

by BONEZZ in

jw
friends

anyone remember that tommy james song?

dub legend says it was written about the "truth" book.

i've listened closely and i guess it could be true.

Xander

Yeah, and the reference to 'Jehovah' being god's name was put in Indiana Jones & the Last Crusade because one of the producers was studying...

They have a little bit of a self-inflated opinion of themselves.

(Incidently, I hear tell the song was one of the many peace, love, and harmony songs typical of the era. The reference to 'Crystal Blue Persuasion' is the very new at the time picture of the earth hanging like a jewel in the sky taken from the moon.)

25

Beyond the Rainbow!

by Smoldering Wick in

jw
friends

i remember hearing stories of an elderly brother who would go to the door and ask the householder what their favorite color was.

if the householder responded blue...he would pull out the 'truth' book, if his/her response was green it was the...well, you get the idea.

this old brother had a book in every color and always placed them.

Xander

that determines which colors are the next up to be popular

Ahhh, so THESE are the people to blame for 70s and 80s offices, no?

because I miss Smoldering Wick!

Now, whatever happened to SW?

43

Happy JW Marriages the Impossible Dream?

by IslandWoman in

while it is not impossible to have a happy marriage in the jw religion for many it is hard, for some it is very hard to maintain happiness in their marriage.

the watchtower raises the bar so very high in every aspect of life, marriage included.

the watchtower literature encourages a jw married couple to be practically perfect, or at least that is the goal set before them.

Xander

this thread was started saying that the WT advice for married couples has a negative impact

Single success stories are nice, but if the OVERALL affect of the WT advice results in 'failure' (either divorce or unhappy marriages), then the policy is a failure, and should be ceased.

then they helped, didn't they

OK, I notice you did say the WT only 'helped' - I had read your above post to mean that the WT was the reason, which was the point I was argueing.

he was already a practicing Catholic, but that didn't seem to help

No offense intended, but he obviously wasn't a very good Catholic then, their policies on marriage are just as strict as the society's.

help everyone that I have seen

How many marriages have you been in? 1? Right. The problem with the society's solution is that is makes the marriage LOOK like a success to everyone but whose in it. Indeed, the participants in the marriage will tell their closest friends only how happy they are. In fact, they probably continually tell THEMSELVES how happy they are. "Really, I'm happy". "This is a godly marriage, and that brings me peace". "I'm supposed to be filled with joy, and I am". "A three-fold cord can't easily be broken, and so our marriage is strong". While looking into a mirror trying to force a smile.

Maybe you DO have a happy marriage applying WT counsel. Good for you. I have found in my travels, though, it is the exception rather than the rule.

a desire to be part of the world and not being able to
I'm just saying that adds to day to day stress for each individual. That they are married then compounds the problem. Want to go see a movie together? Better make sure you don't stumble anyone. What if the wife REALLY wants to see it? But, the husband is a little concerned about its content stumbling someone if they saw them.

Just a small example of the type of tension it creates that is simply not a concern if you aren't a witness.

please explain how this advice (coupled with the advice for how husbands are told to treat their wives) is detrimental.

I'm sorry, this is just idiotic. Why don't you ask a women, any women, why she has a problem with the concept of her being inferior to men and needing to be submissive.

This is wrong as the WT DOES encourage an open communication of feelings between marriage mates

Yes, they say that on paper. But, then, they proceed to schedule away every free moment of your life. I'm sure you've heard the parts: "Everyone has the same 168 hours a week. If you sleep 8 hours a day, that leaves 112. The, if you work 40, that leaves 72...blahblahblah" as they detail how much time should be spent on personal study, ministry, meetings, etc.

Ever once here an elder EVER mention time to sit down and have a nice dinner, and NOT TALK ABOUT RELIGION or spirituality? Just thoughts, goals, feelings?

Didn't happen, did it?

everything about them and blame them for everything that went wrong in their life

No one is doing that. I'm just arguing that, overall, if their meddling in personal relationships is an overall failure, they should STOP DOING IT.

12

Paradise is here, now.

by metatron in

jw
friends

i wondered thru one of those massive upscale gourmet supermarkets.

and thought about 'paradise'.. they had every kind of cheese i have ever heard of - and then some!.

i have never seen so many different kinds of cheese in one place.. i concluded that a state of perfection can't offer anything .

Xander

For those of us lucky enough to be in rich nations - and
own computers, enjoy!

Paradise, in practical terms, is already here.

Well, the computers I'll give you - they are kinda needed.

But, I think paradise could be enjoyed in much simpler terms. I don't need the lavish lifestyle, just time to enjoy what I DO have.

Working nonstop for almost all my waking hours just gets old. REAL paradise would be being wealthy enough to just enjoy what I already have. Spend a couple months just camping in the woods, etc.

Time is the only commodity really worth anything, and time is what the society always promised in its utopian future.

Only, if you think about it, time is what causes their whole vision to fall apart. Not everyone CAN be living a paradasaic (?sp?) lifestyle - the net work done by a nation today divided among all its inhabitants STILL amounts to working almost full time hours.