Posts by 4horsemen

64

To Larc: ON ECONOMIC STUFF

by You Know in

jw
friends

your essay is full of generalities, half truths and down right misinformation.

you craft words to minimize advancement and preach doom and gloom.

also, your hero, larouch is long on problems and short on solutions.

4horsemen

Just some random thoughts...

-There is actually more gold in the bowels of the Fed Bank in NY than in Fort Knox.

-Gold is one of the leading indicators of inflation. If you look at any monthly chart of gold you will see a sideways to declining graph. It is actually the increases in productivity and cheap(slave?) labor in other countries that has kept inflation in check. The price of gold has been stagnant which is in part why central banks have been quietly selling price spikes, to get out from underperforming returns.

-Demand for gold is fairly constant. Silver however is not. Example, Kodak a major commercial for silver. Its market demand was cut significantly and one day it will cease its silver consumption. All this brought about by the world of digital cameras. There is absolutely no reason to speculate in silver or be involved with it at all, unless you need it to produce your end product.

-The Fed is not taking rates to zero. So if you have thought about refinancing your mortgage dont try and time the bottom. This is close to it. The next stimulus can come from a variety of avenues. The problem is there is so much pork in the U.S. govt that any tax cut will cripple a program(s) that probably does help those intended. If the govt could ever be held accountable the pork programs could _easily_ pay for the public work maintenance necessary

-All industries eventually cycle. Growth, maturity, and inevitable decline. When 71% of Coca-Colas revenues come from _outside_ the U.S. how can they possibly keep making $$$ through increased sales, licensing agreements etc to justify a rising stock price. They cant. Eventually Coca-Cola will sell to all those who want it and demand will be flat. Expenses never are though, and so Coke must adapt or go out of business. Simple. Like IBM as you mentioned Iarc.

-Iarc, here is 2 increases in productivity for you. It took 30 years to get the processor(brain) in computers to 1gh. It took less than 2 years to get to 2 gh. Also, why the focus on economic productivity? The biotech world is sci-fi esque. The gentleman with the artificial heart lived 59 days before his recent death. Now, what would have George Harrison paid for 2 months of life? What would you give for 2 xtra months of life? This simply was not possible even 5 years ago.

"The problem with govt is those most qualified least want the job, and those least qualifed most often seek to get the job." -author unknown

64

To Larc: ON ECONOMIC STUFF

by You Know in

jw
friends

your essay is full of generalities, half truths and down right misinformation.

you craft words to minimize advancement and preach doom and gloom.

also, your hero, larouch is long on problems and short on solutions.

4horsemen

My post got cut off.

In short the tendencies of the world are for the most part found in WBTS. Explaining away the inconsistencies is no different than Greenspan opining on why Larouche prophecies dont have a snowball's chance.

Everyone gets what they want. Those in religion or those who buy shares in Enron. Each of us though have a responsibility to make certain they are not buying in to a house of cards. The kicker is it's ALL a house of cards.

I'll trade you 3 eggs and a head of lettuce for that Watchtower, You Know. Since my $$$ are worthless. I'll need the kindling since power companies are going to be bust. Good thing I own a farm. I guess.

Caveat Emptor

64

To Larc: ON ECONOMIC STUFF

by You Know in

jw
friends

your essay is full of generalities, half truths and down right misinformation.

you craft words to minimize advancement and preach doom and gloom.

also, your hero, larouch is long on problems and short on solutions.

4horsemen

You Know,

I enjoy reading your posts. I even share (some) of your financial perspective. That said, I want to draw a parallel to religion and get your comments...

Let us suppose your (financial)experts are correct: The time is coming to pay the piper. A worldwide financial depression!

But Jah does NOT show up.

Now what?

The parallel. Please, tell me exactly how or rather what is the difference between the current financial system where the strong abuse the weak, the clever trip up the unaware, the rich take from the poor AND say the WTBS?

The examples too numerous to mention. But just a few: Blood flip flop. Organ transplant inconsistency. Mexico/Malawi. The _failed_ end times prophecies. The obliteration of the 1914 "generation". The doctrine/procedure changes.

This is not a matter of straining the gnat and swallowing the camel. It is not even a question of faith. I have faith there is a god. His name might even be Jehovah. Though Yahweh is probably more accurate.

BUT, I fail to see the difference between the financial powers that be in their manipulations to further their own agenda AND the WTBS manipulations.

"Millions Living Now Will Never Die" Was this not a keynote speech? Even a book? Yes, there is new light. Yes, we must have faith. Yes, we are all imperfect men. Yes, all have sinned and fall short of the glory of god.

However, when 99% of those millions are DEAD, and even if those who said such things suspected if not outright knew what they were saying was untrue, is this not similar to those stocks analysts who say buy when they are selling you their inventory?

It doesnt seem that the WTBS is any more enlightened than anyone else. Especially for a orgainization which claims Gods direct channel status. The arguments you make for the end of this financial system could just as easily be turned to a religious nature (with track history of misrepsentation(s)) and used against your religion. Or any other for that matter.

40

ENRON & SYSTEMIC COLLAPSE

by You Know in

jw
friends

a few days back i made a comment on the collapse of enron on this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=16970&site=3.

an excerpt from my post read: "enron is a classic example of the hollow and predatory nature of the so-called new economy, which some imagine to be a new and improved way to make money!

instead of actually producing gas and energy products, enron got into buying and selling futures sales of non-existent gas and electricity.

4horsemen

You must forgive Mr Larouche.

In his opinion he is the only man "intellectually qualified" to be Prez in 2004.

Apparently he forgot Pauls admonition "For whenever a man thinks he is something when he is nothing he is deceiving his own mind"

Other than that Mr Larouche's one great wish is to outlive Kissinger.

40

ENRON & SYSTEMIC COLLAPSE

by You Know in

jw
friends

a few days back i made a comment on the collapse of enron on this thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=16970&site=3.

an excerpt from my post read: "enron is a classic example of the hollow and predatory nature of the so-called new economy, which some imagine to be a new and improved way to make money!

instead of actually producing gas and energy products, enron got into buying and selling futures sales of non-existent gas and electricity.

4horsemen

Not quite.

I trade futures (does that make me the Antichrist, YK?). The markets Enron was in COB electricity futures, natural gas (and not the natural gas futures that trades on NYBOT\NYME) is amazingly thin. There are very few participants. Usually less than a handful. And it's not John Doe from a JW board. Not Mr Larouche either. Big corporations. As a rule in thinner markets, manipulation is far easier. Enron made a killing when CA. had its problems. Part of the problem for Enron is/was when CA. came in and rigged their own shell game at Enrons expense. Enron's own shennanigans were rendered impotent. The other market participants simply did not deal with Enron. No trading reveneue, cant pay debt on time. Can pay debt on time, regulators downgrade your bond rating. Crappier bond rating, the sooner you have to make payments at a higher interest rate. Enron's debt was a staggering 50%+ of expenditures. Their accountants tried to cook the books, but Dynergy got lucky and found some aberrations. Of course, it is the workers and small stockholders, and some bond holders who will get the shaft.

Moreover the "futures" markets for electricity are no such thing. It's more like a brokers/hedgeing market. Its called a "spot" market. Which means cash. FERC is a farce and that market is pretty much like the Wild West. A true futures market would have not necessarily prevented CA. problems because there was a supply shock but certainly it could have helped to ease them.

Interestingly it is also the natural gas, unleaded gas, crude oil, and heating oil futures markets which are heavily dominated ie manipulated. Could it be because the suppliers are also market participants? Nah. Nothing like making money on the product which you use to create a money making product. You dont think Sadam Hussein bought oil futures _before_ he invaded Kuwait do you?

You Know. YOu might enjoy this book. "Creature from Jekyll Island" by G. Edward Griffin. Discussing that most powerful institute today: No, not WTBS. The FED.

When you're done you'll be convinced the Day of Jah is near. Of course it happened the same way with Rome, Spain, UK and on and on...

See you in Sheol.

"When a man says that he has integrity, the only thing that proves is he cant be bought cheap" -author unknown

6

Catch phrases

by DB in

jw
friends

i must say, i am enjoying some of the catch phrases, if you want to call them that, which appear after the signatures of some posters.

examples: lauralisa's "if the world didn't suck, we'd all fall off"; battman's "the only informed witness is a former witness", and many other examples that do not immediately come to mind, or that i cannot remember exactly (saintsatan has a good one about faith, but i forget the exact phrase at the moment).. anyone else notice these cool phrases, or have any favorites they'd like to mention?

4horsemen

Wax on. Wax off?

15

One of the greatest problems for the mankind...

by Erich in

jw
friends

one of the greatest problems for the future of our economy is only known by few "insiders".

even wts do not know this matter.

since i'm a patent-expert, it's perhaps my own business to talk about it.

4horsemen

Eric,

Would you rather be living now or in a real depression ala 1929-32?

Thought so.

It is credit which eventually kills all great empires. Same will happen with United States. When? I dont know, I am not You Know. Guess I'll just have to keep on living.

Im not a evolutionist, but Darwin was right about who survives.

22

JW statistics 2001 -- www.jwic.com/stat.htm

by Osarsif in

jw
friends

jw statistics 2001:.

http://www.jwic.com/stat.htm.

4horsemen

Up or down. Whats the difference?

The average dub in the USA will probably say,

"Well, I see in the "rich" countries our numbers are going down. Didnt Jesus say it would be easier to pass a camel through a needles eye than a rich man to enter the Kingdom? Guess the end must be close. By the way hon, grab the mop so we can clean those 14 offices _after_ the ministry school. I swear it's all those people with college degrees deflating my janitorial purchasing power that makes this system so ready to be over. Thanks. Dinner ready yet?"

Why ask why?

11

Have we judged God?

by joelbear in

jw
friends

a very interesting conversation that i have been having with a very nice jehovah's witness in private has led me to ask this question.. have we judged jehovah based on the conduct of humans, our families, people in the congregation, even governing body members?.

does this distract us from a direct view of god and his personality and purposes?.

don't just jump on me, think about my point and let me know what you think.. joel

4horsemen

Joelbear

Yes, in part I have judged God, not by the people in the world specifically, but rather those in the WTBS organization who claim to represent him. Guilt by association.

Again, the simplistic JW argument goes as follows... "If you were mad at your brother, would you stop talking to or blame your father?"

These quotes and quips are quite clever. But just like the Bible what you use to condemn others curses you, and so one could argue this... "if you went to a restaurant and the food was terrible and the service substandard, would you blame your fellow patrons or the management?"

What, if any, responsibility does mighty Jah have when the WTBS make rulings (by majority vote!)on things like blood, 1914 "generation", no part of the world mantra applied to Mexico/Malawi, college, holidays, etc, etc?

And these same things are later covered up, changed, altered, or outright negated.

Then again, I suppose one could also say dont judge God by others or those who claim to represent him. Judge him by the personal relationship you have with him. That begs the question: Why be part of organized religion at all? Being in it is somewhat like being in a high school for adults.

"Life is a tragedy for those who feel; a comedy for those who think" -The Bard

26

Rome was especially ruthless

by Yadirf in

jw
friends

i found this interesting picture on a site someone here referenced today.

can you fathom being treated this way (persecuted) as apparently some christians were under the government of the roman empire?

(also, look at the ones impaled round about the arena there.

4horsemen

Yardif wrote:

"I'll ask you the same question that I did Skeptic:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Why is it that you automatically condemn God for bringing about the destructive forces of Armageddon when you don’t even clearly understand the issue? And if you think you do understand the issue, I’ll be quite for a moment and allow you to explain it to me. What is the issue, if you can tell me?"

Condemn is the wrong word. Question is a better word.

Why do they "goats" have to die at GT? Why cant they be pardoned?

A parallel...

The Israelites were delievered from Egypt. But before they saw the 10 plagues etc. As God's people, one might think they had better understanding of "true" religion than the other heathens.

YET, despite being God's chosen nation, despite having more awareness of the 'true' god, despite witnessing the 10 plagues, they STILL were faithless. How many times did they murmur, whine, argue angainst Moses? Moses was upon Horeb less than 40 days before they had Aaron make the golden calf. Only some of those were killed for their idolatry.

Later, whining again they refused to believe they could defeat the promised land residents. Here is the parallel... Instead of Jah whacking them out, he had them wander 40 years in the desert. Til the faithless were dead of natural causes. It may have been a crappy existence but it was life nonetheless. No flaming swords from the heavens.

Contrast that with today. I would wager more than 9/10 the world has never had a personal witness. I would wager further that 99% of the world could not tell you 3 major beliefs/tenets of the Witnesses. Quick, name 3 main beliefs and explain them regarding Hindus. Times up. For your lack on knowing, Kali is going to kill you. Why?

How about this from a 'loving' god. A god of 'justice' Why not remove Satan, his demons, and his system first. Then let the 6 billion have 40 years free from that influence, and see what you will see