Let's play a game - Follow the WTS $$ trail

by watch the tower 126 Replies latest watchtower scandals

• 

  Oroborus21

  Not this nonsense again.

  re: Phillip Morris stock.

  It is NOT OWNED OR EVEN CONTROLLED BY THE WTS!!!!

  The WTS is only a 3rd Party beneficiary of the Trust controlled by the administrators of the Henrietta Trust. There has never ever been any proof that that the Administrator who has the responsibility of managing the trust assets is a JW or under WT control. Most trust administrators are banks and other such professional personnel. Most likely the persons who establised the trust, the Rileys, wanted to benefit the Society created the trust and have the actual administration being performed by professionals.

  There is no evidence whatsoever that either the WTS has actual knowledge of the trust assets and even if it did, it would have no power to say to the adminstrator to change or divest itself of the objectionable portions of the trust.

  the Society's only option would be to reject the gift entirely which seems entirely unreasonable.

  re: JP MOrgan, et al.

  This is even sillier. The Society like anyone has the right to hold stock in such common funds and has no control over the underlying holdings or management. The Society said long ago that investing was not objectionable for a Christian. And given that millions of dollars are entrusted to it and that it is a nonprofit corporation, it actually has a duty to the public to make prudent investments with its capital and attempt to increase its capital if possible.

  -Eduardo Leaton Jr., Esq.
• 

  magoo

  to O21.........

  ....did you notice what the # on your post was? 666, not that that REALY means anything

  magoo
• 

  Legolas

  to O21.........

  ....did you notice what the # on your post was? 666, not that that REALY means anything

  magoo

  

  
• 

  Honesty

  Can you get me re-instated, O21?

  I have been lied to by the SEC and need to return to the cult Joe Hoba.
• 

  Lady Lee

  wait one minute here. I know I have been out a long time but somehow some things never change

  a JW cannot

  • work in a store whose sole product is cigarettes, cigars and pipe tobacco
  • cannot work at the cigarette counter in a store
  • cannot smoke

  But you think it is OK to own stock in a company that sells tobacco products as part of their revenue is OK!?!

  Have I got this right?

  Lee (who is spending her time wondering if I have lost a few of my marbles class)
• 

  Scully

  re: Phillip Morris stock.

  It is NOT OWNED OR EVEN CONTROLLED BY THE WTS!!!!

  The WTS is only a 3rd Party beneficiary of the Trust controlled by the administrators of the Henrietta Trust. There has never ever been any proof that that the Administrator who has the responsibility of managing the trust assets is a JW or under WT control. Most trust administrators are banks and other such professional personnel. Most likely the persons who establised the trust, the Rileys, wanted to benefit the Society created the trust and have the actual administration being performed by professionals.

  There is no evidence whatsoever that either the WTS has actual knowledge of the trust assets and even if it did, it would have no power to say to the adminstrator to change or divest itself of the objectionable portions of the trust.

  the Society's only option would be to reject the gift entirely which seems entirely unreasonable.

  Really?? Entirely unreasonable? The WTS would expect that of one of their followers. You know how they go on about "a little leaven ferments the whole lump"? Why does this lofty principle apply when it involves Joe or Jane JW, yet the instant it involves positive cash flow for the WTS it is ok to turn a blind eye to it or bend the rules?

  It is also interesting to note that the WTS has never withdrawn or retracted its statement about thoroughly investigating the source of income that derives from investments, and strongly discourages association with "unethical" investments (ie, those in opposition to Bible Principles™).

  By considering the background of a company, an investor can also ensure that his money will not be used to support an unethical enterprise. —See Awake!, February 8, 1962, pages 21-3.

  You really believe that the WTS - which publishes a detailed manifesto on how people can make financial donations in umpteen ways - has no clue about what stocks are held in the Henrietta M. Riley Trust? Can I interest you in some waterfront property too?
• 

  Gerard

  The Society like anyone has the right to hold stock in such common funds and has no control over the underlying holdings or management. The Society said long ago that investing was not objectionable for a Christian. And given that millions of dollars are entrusted to it and that it is a nonprofit corporation, it actually has a duty to the public to make prudent investments with its capital and attempt to increase its capital if possible. - Oroborus

  Yes, most likely all that money is legitimate. The point is: where does it go from there?

  I can't find the relevant post but someone calculated that the WT's accounts in JP Morgan were worth something like $2 billion USD.

  Follow the money. That's your key to the Ivory Tower's demise.
• 

  Oroborus21

  lady lee and scully,

  Once Again for emphasis: it is not the WTS that OWNS the stock.

  Further the WTS doesn't even CONTROL the Trust or have any management authority over the Trust Administrator.

  It would be an entirely different matter if the Society actually owned the stock or could say what the underlying trust assets should be.

  Additionally, for all we know the Rileys told their lawyer or banker or whoever to set up the trust and are not even involved themselves in selecting the stocks. VERY FEW investors are, especially ones that are large investors. They intrust the job to professionals. As far as I have ever seen no one has ever stepped forward to provide evidence of the Riley's JWishness. Who are these people? WE only assume that they are JWs but they might not be. And again even if they were, we can't assume that they are paying attention to the actual holdings of the trust or considering the implications for others.

  Finally, it is a small point but the stock that is held is actually of the parent company which has numerous nonobjectionable subsidiary companies such as Nabisco.

  Bottom line: All of this is just a lot of hot air and smoke that opposers of the WTS are trying to sensationalize to no end.

  -Eduardo
• 

  SWALKER

  LL, no you are not losing your marbles!!! I once owned a convenience store, which I very rarely visited, hired the work out to non-witness, and could NOT sell cigarettes!!! (That was about the time the info came out that a witness couldn't have anything to do with cigarettes) Do you know what that did to the business??? I had to take a loss and sell it just to get out from under the pressure. The community was very upset and no one could understand the reasoning that you can sell alcohol, but not cigarettes. From their point of view, the cigarettes were the lesser of the 2 evils.

  Now, to Mr. Obo, that's such small pocket change compared to the WTBS...why should they have to not accept trusts that make them money? Because they MAKE THE RULES and it has cost a lot of JW's tons of money. I had to work for 2 years to get back even from that fiasco. What is it that you don't understand????????

  Please don't insult the intelligence of this forum with your nonsense claiming that they may not even know about this trust's investments. You can rest assured they account for and are very well informed of every last dollar in the entire organization.

  Swalker (still fuming over that issue)
• 

  SWALKER

  Obo said:

  Additionally, for all we know the Rileys told their lawyer or banker or whoever to set up the trust and are not even involved themselves in selecting the stocks.

  I invested in stocks and I would have been df'd in a New York minute if I would have had any Phillip Morris holdings. We were instucted that if we did hold stocks in questionable companies that we should SELL them, irregardless of the consequences.

  They should hold themselves to the same standards that they dish out for the rank and file.

  Are you on their payroll by any chance????