LittleToe, how are you doing? Boy it's good to be back on this website, and it's always good to see your posts on here as well!
I'm just now getting around to replying to your post where you said this:
UnDFed:
What does it mean to "believe that Jesus is God"?
In my own case I had previously been taught that Jesus was second only to the Father, and one who had provided a ransom for sin. I only had the WTS framework to go by.
In coming to realise that he was more than I had been taught, and desiring to go directly to him, there was an implicit understanding that what I needed was only to be found with him. I can't say at that point I had any genuine comprehension of what God truly was, nor any of the intricacies of I AM. What child of God does?
For that reason I suspect that you may be putting the hard definitions of words and theology above grace. Be careful not to shut the narrow gate...
Good questions, LT! Thought-provoking questions. (there you go, provoking my thoughts again LOL).
When I say that the Bible teaches that a person must believe that Jesus is God in order to be saved, I do not mean that a person has to understand exactly how God could be a Man, or exactly what God is. As the Apostle Paul said in Romans 11:33 (NLT), "Oh, how great are God’s riches and wisdom and knowledge! How impossible it is for us to understand his decisions and his ways!", and as Isaiah 55:8-9 (NLT) says, “My thoughts are nothing like your thoughts,” says the LORD. “And my ways are far beyond anything you could imagine. For just as the heavens are higher than the earth, so my ways are higher than your ways and my thoughts higher than your thoughts." -- no one will ever understand everything about God or His ways or His exact Nature or Being. No one can fathom all of the mysteries of God. The finite mind cannot understand the infinite.
That being said, however, the Bible makes it clear that one must believe certain things about Jesus Christ in order to receive salvation by grace through faith. Notice what the Apostle Paul wrote in Romans Chapter 10:
Romans 10:9-10 (ESV): because if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.
Now, most likely, considering the context, what did "Lord" (Kyrios) mean to the early Christians when Paul wrote that? Paul and the other disciples used the Septuagint as their Old Testament, and in the Septuagint, the Greek word Kyrios ("Lord") is used in place of the Divine Name YHWH around 6,000 times! So, it is my belief that Paul was saying that in order to be saved, you must confess and believe in your heart that Jesus is Yahweh, and that He was raised from the dead, especially considering that in Romans 10:13, Paul quoted Joel 2:32 (which said "Everyone who calls on the Name of Yahweh will be saved") and applied it directly to Jesus Christ.
Also, consider what the title "The Son of God" meant in the minds of the 1st-Century Jews, (in the certain way that Jesus used the phrase) as shown in John 5:18 (LITV):
"This was why the Jews were seeking all the more to kill him, because not only was he breaking the Sabbath, but he was even calling God his own Father, making himself equal with God."
And, also see John 19:7 (EMTV):
"The Jews answered him, "We have a law, and according to our law He ought to die, because He made Himself the Son of God." "
And, Luke 22:70-71 (NLT):
"They all shouted, “So, are you claiming to be the Son of God?” And he replied, “You say that I am.” “Why do we need other witnesses?” they said. “We ourselves heard him say it.” "
Then check out what the Apostle John wrote about Jesus in His Epistles:
1 John 4:15 (ESV): Whoever confesses that Jesus is the Son of God, God abides in him, and he in God.
1 John 5:5 (ESV): Who is it that overcomes the world except the one who believes that Jesus is the Son of God?
1 John 5:12-13 (ESV): Whoever has the Son has life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have life. I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God that you may know that you have eternal life.
1 John 5:20 (ESV): And we know that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true; and we are in him who is true, in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.
In light of John 5:18, 1 John 5:20, John 19:7, and Luke 22:70-71, what did John mean when he said that you must believe that Jesus is The Son of God in order to have eternal life within you?
The Apostle Paul wrote that salvation comes only when you call upon Jesus as Lord in faith, and that this faith comes only AFTER hearing the Gospel. (See Romans 10:14).
Paul also taught that you must believe in Jesus Christ's death and resurrection in order to be saved. And yet, how many people truly understand everything about how or why Jesus' death and resurrection were necessary and what He accomplished when they are first saved? But still, to be saved, you must believe that He died for your sins and rose again, even if you don't know exactly how or why.
According to the Apostle John, you must also believe that Jesus is The Christ (The Messiah) to be saved. People may not understand or know exactly what it means when Jesus is called "Christ" or "Messiah," yet the Bible says that people must believe that He is the Messiah to be saved. (See 1 John 5:1 and 1 John 2:22).
John also wrote that in order to be saved, you must believe that Jesus truly became a real Human Being. Now, no one understands exactly how God became a Man (this is a huge mystery), but the Bible says that we must believe it in order to be saved. (See 1 John 4:2-3 and 2 John 1:7)
It is my understanding of the Scriptures, that this is how salvation works:
1:) God The Father draws a person to Jesus Christ (John 6:44) and the Holy Spirit enlightens that person to be able to understand basic spiritual things (the things of the Gospel message which are required for salvation), at least to a certain degree (Hebrews 6:4).
2:) That person, once he has heard or read the Gospel message, perhaps searched the Scriptures or otherwise investigated the facts about Christianity (Acts 17:11), and has been drawn by The Father and enlightened by The Spirit, then makes his decision -- he either receives or rejects Jesus and His Gospel of salvation. (A person may delay and put off his decision for many years -- and a person who rejects Christ at one time in his life may end up receiving him before he dies, just look at Manassah).
Now, once God has enlightened a person, if that person is like the Apostle Thomas and he is truly searching for the truth about God, and he just needs more information and facts in order to be sure and relieve his doubts, then God will not reject such a one, but instead God will make sure that this person receives the necessary facts and information to make a decision to receive or reject Christ's free gift of salvation by grace through faith. (See Psalm 9:10; Matthew 7:7; 1 Chronicles 28:9; Hebrews 11:6)
The Bible also says that no one will seek God on his own without God drawing and enlightening him first (Psalm 53:2-3).
Jesus saved the thief on the cross next to him, and most likely this thief did not have a real great understanding of how Jesus could be God or Lord or Savior, however, it does appear that God revealed to him a divine revelation about Jesus, because just prior to his being saved, he was reviling Jesus along with the other thief. According to certain Bible Translations, such as the King James Version, Analytical-Literal Translation, English Majority Text Version, Literal Translation of the Holy Bible, and Young's Literal Translation (1898), the thief acknowledged Jesus as "Lord."
Even if the thief did not confess Jesus as "Lord" with his mouth, it is clear that the thief trusted in Christ as a King, and as the One who had the power to save him and resurrect him, and he prayed directly to Jesus for salvation.
God also revealed the necessary facts about who Jesus was directly to the Apostle Peter. (See Matthew 16:16-17).
So, bottom line is, these are the points I am trying to make:
1:) To be saved you must believe that Jesus is God, Lord, Savior, Christ, and that He came as a real Human Being to die for your sins and rise from the dead.
2:) You do not have to understand all the details, or how everything fits together, or exactly how God became a Man, or how Three Persons can be One God. We never will understand it all completely. God is infinite and we are finite.
3:) If God is drawing a person to Jesus, and that person truly wants and desires to know Him, God will bring that person to the truth.
4:) To be saved a person must repent, and come directly to Jesus, and call upon Him as the Lord of his life, to trust in Christ completely for salvation, and in Christ ALONE. Not any good works or anything he has done or will do.
When I was born again and saved by Jesus in July 2001, I had come to the realization that Jesus was God, but I did not know exactly what that meant or how that could be, or what His relationship was to the Father and the Spirit exactly. I even continued to struggle with the idea of the Trinity for a while after I was first born again (after being brought up as a JW for 19 years). But I did know that the Bible said Jesus was God (John 1:1; 20:28) and that to be saved I had to pray TO Jesus, to repent, and trust in Him with all my heart and soul and mind -- to give my life over to Him.
I continued to pray earnestly for help in understanding the truth about the Deity of Christ and the Trinity, and I have studied those subjects more than any other subject, and I am so thankful to my Lord Jesus Christ for guiding me into the wonderful truth of His Holy Scriptures. Amen.
