Some incredible new publisher statistics and Graphs

by jwfacts 66 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  jwfacts

  And I think I know why - how many times have we seen a poster elect that it was now a bad idea to join the witnesses, now that they had found this site [or others like it] and learned the 'truth of the truth'? In the days of the 4000 hour publisher, they likely would have joined. Now they learn the truth before it happens to them. GO INTERNET!

  This is where the WTS is really hurting. Finding people from the territory will become very difficult where people have Internet access. People research on the internet before buying a PC, car or home, they also do their research before buying into a religion. The WTS may be able to manipulate a member to not look at the internet, but they can not similarly control bible studies.
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  LittleToe

  Kids are becoming Christians all over Scotland, too, mainly from un-churched homes.

  The numbers attending a local Scriptural Union, in one Secondary school on this wee island, has grown from 24 to 100+ in the last four years.

  Is the WTS attracting so many of the younger generation?
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  blondie

  Is the WTS gaining new teenage members? They can't even hang onto the ones they have. One reason the WTS has pushing younger and younger baptisms is that by the time many teenage JWs get to be 15 or 16 they realize the wisdom not to get baptized so they can choose a non-JW life with more likelihood of their family staying in touch with them.

  One day we counted the teenage JWs in our old congregation: out of 20, only 1 remained. The rest had either been df'd or were unbaptized and stopped attending when they were 18. A few struggled to come back when they married and/or became parents, but one by one they dropped out again.

  The WTS hopes that when they become parents that they will come back rather than have their children die at Armageddon. But even that is not enough for them to swallow the hypocrisy.

  Blondie
• 

  slimboyfat

  Kids are becoming Christians all over Scotland, too, mainly from un-churched homes.

  According to Brierley's figures, the number of children (0-15) attending church decreased by -21% between 1994 and 2002: 124,400 down to 98,420.

  In the 15-19 range the decline in attendance was -31%: 34,560 down to 23,800 in 2002.

  Between the ages of 20 and 29 attendance was down -34 percent: from 55,290 in 1994 down to 36,710.

  Wishful thinking springs to mind.

  Slim
• 

  AuldSoul

  LittleToe,

  slimboyfat isn't that far from you. Maybe you guys could get together and hash it out in person.

  sbf, I wonder whether Brierley's figures were skewed because of focusing on "mainstream" religions to arrive at the numbers. Religions outside the mainstream have been growing at rates that dwarf the growth of JWs for years now. Since JWs are certainly outside the mainstream, one would expect them to get their share of the bounty from among those leaving mainstream religions, but they are not. Care to explain?

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
• 

  slimboyfat

  AuldSoul,

  I know "LittleToe" from the glory days his grand eldership.

  In fact, he scrutinized my baptism, as I explained in one of my first threads.

  Groups like the Pentecostals and New Churches have a modest increase in Scotland, but their membership is tiny and has little impact on the overall figures.

  There are around 10,000 who attend Pentecostal meetings in Scotland, a similar number to the Witnesses in Scotland.

  Brierley is a Christian who wishes denominations to succeed by the way, so his figures are pretty trustworthy, and are acknowledged by social scientists as the best indicator of religious practice in Britain.

  A bit more reliable in showing the complete picture than "I know this church where they are getting loads of young people to attend", for instance.

  Slim
• 

  slimboyfat

  AuldSoul,

  A little further in reply: the only Christian groups Brierley excludes from his "attendance survey" are non-Trinitarians, mainly Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons and a few other very small sects.

  He includes Pentecostals, independent churches, house churches and even the closed Brethren in his surveys. So if there was any major upsure in any denominational sector to balance out the decline he would catch it. The fact is that there are a few very small churches that are increasing at modest rates, like the Pentecostals and, strangely enough, the Salvation Army. But their increases do nothing to offset the dramatic decline among the churches as a whole.

  Slim
• 

  AuldSoul

  sbf,

  Suppose someone says, "Killer bees are moving northward at a very fast rate!"

  It seems to me that the time period in question is now, not four years ago. If I examine data collected from a time span of 8 years ending four years ago and conclude the person doesn't know what they are talking about, would that seem reasonable to you? It would not seem reasonable to me.

  LittleToe: Kids are becoming Christians all over Scotland, too, mainly from un-churched homes.

  This would be present tense, not past tense.

  LittleToe: The numbers attending a local Scriptural Union, in one Secondary school on this wee island, has grown from 24 to 100+ in the last four years.

  I am a little rusty with my math, but as I recall 2006 - 4 = 2002. 2002 also equals the terminus of the data you supplied. How would data collected that far back indicate anything about present conditions? I don't get it. Please explain.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul
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  slimboyfat

  Give me a break AuldSoul, I mean are you serious? You will not accept the data simply because it is a few years old? Do you know how hard this data is to collect? How long would you say it is reliable for then? A couple of weeks?

  Please think sensibly:

  On the one hand you have Brierley's data which is comprehensive if a little dated, and on the other hand you have LittleToe's anecdote which may be "up to date" but is anything but comprehensive.

  It is simply ridiculous to give more weight to one anecdote than to a mountain of solicited data simply because the data is a couple of years old. There may be slight room for debate about that were we talking about a phnomenon prone to sudden changes and shifts of direction.

  But the fact is that Brierley's 2002 census church census was only the most recent in a long line of such surveys that have shown one consistent pattern right from the 1960s - extensive, sustained, and increasing rates of decline in church attendance in Scotland.

  I am through arguing with you because it is plain you would are black white.

  Slim
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  AuldSoul

  Slim,

  My point is, you criticised LittleToe anecdotal reference to growth from young people within the last four years using data collected prior to the last four years. It isn't "plain" at all.

  You want a break, I want you to give LittleToe a break. You cannot use data collected prior to the period he referenced as a viable challenge to his statement of personal observation.

  Respectfully,
  AuldSoul