Insomniac- everything you have stated is all about materialism. I had everything when i was married, 2 holidays a year, new cars every other year, as many new clothes as i wanted, eat out when i wanted, as much jewellery as i wanted, my husband had a very good job, so he provided all those things, AND i had a family, so just because you get married and have kids doesn`t mean to say you still can`t have all those things! Also, kids don`t stay young forever, they do grow you know! I`ve heard a lot of women who have started out with your attitide, and have regretted it later on, but you are entitled to your view, but i would rather be a `mum` and have `love` than material things anyday!
Womens Right`s are they Wrong?
by dido 87 Replies latest jw friends
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dido
looking_glass- i don`t think the opening thread has done a disservice at all, it`s my opinion and i believe it, and i think that women rights hasn`t necessarily done women any favours, but give them more respnsibilities and to act like men, domineering. Some women are afraid to have children, or are to selfish that they don`t want to have to put someone else first, and a lot are to worried about losing their figure. As far as being a wts teaching, women `s role was around a long time before the religion.
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Fe2O3Girl
I am a feminist. I am eternally grateful to the women who fought and sometimes paid with their lives, so that I have the vote, the right to own property, the right to divorce, to earn the same pay for the same job, and even the right to have a job at all.
I didn't have a child until my mid-thirties because until then I was not in a stable relationship and a settled economic situation. I did not want to start a responsible job and then immediately go on maternity leave. As it is, my colleagues did have to cover when I was off work, and I got maternity pay through the government. Why should the childless subsidise my family? Well, one day we will all be too old to work. We will be pleased then that there are younger people around to be doctors, caregivers, police, taxi drivers or cleaners or any number of essential services.
According to the media in the UK (and the Daily Mail is the worst), a woman's place is in the wrong. If we have don't have children we are wrong. If we have children, but we work, or claim benefits, or don't work, or are too old, or too young, we're wrong. We are all supposed to have children in wedlock in our mid-twenties, to a man who can support us all. Meanwhile, back in the real world...............
I applaud any person who has thought seriously about what it takes to bring up a child, and decided that they don't want to. It is not selfishness at all. It is a serious and responsible attitude. If only more people gave family life that much thought.
By the way, I am at work now. My lovely little son is at the swimming pool with his dad - who is his main carer. We did the sums and decided we could manage on one wage - my wage. Isn't that terrible?
The vast majority of families in the UK don't have the choice. Most working mothers aren't "career women", they are just working hard to support their family, and they deserve bouquets for it, not brickbats.
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chiddy
As Jerry Hall once said;
A women needs to be a top chef in the kitchen and a prostitute in the bedroom
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dido
Fe203girl- of course women in the uk have a choice, what rubbish! Some women jus don`t WANT to stay at home and bring up their own kids, i see that as unnatural, and i see men at home as lazy and irresponsible. What`s wrong with getting married and having kids in mid twenties? Ask a lot of men, and they admire women who want to stay in the role that was intended for them, `barefoot and pregnant`, let`s face it we are the weaker vessell, so women should stop trying to act like men!
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Mary
Dido said: I had everything when i was married, 2 holidays a year, new cars every other year, as many new clothes as i wanted, eat out when i wanted, as much jewellery as i wanted, my husband had a very good job, so he provided all those things, AND i had a family, so just because you get married and have kids doesn`t mean to say you still can`t have all those things! Also, kids don`t stay young forever, they do grow you know! I`ve heard a lot of women who have started out with your attitide, and have regretted it later on, but you are entitled to your view, but i would rather be a `mum` and have `love` than material things anyday!
Dido, where do you get off judging the rest of womankind by your standards? From what you've written here, you were lucky enough to marry a man who was stable, had a decent enough job where you didn't have to work outside the home and provided you with all the material things you wanted. That's great that you were able to find someone like that, but the average woman isn't that lucky. There are a ton of things that can go wrong in a marriage: adultery, mental or emotional abuse, lack of responsibility, alcoholism, drug abuse, prison time. You sound like a typical Witness whose gone through life with a pair of rose coloured glasses on. You're content with being a wife and mother and think the rest of womankind should be the same way. Well guess what: everyone's different. Not everyone's content to be a stay at home mom: many women want to use their brains in a job where they get a good salary and are able to enjoy things in life. Not everyone has a mothering instinct and not everyone wants to be a mother. If your husband had say, taken off with another woman when your children were still very young, and you suddenly had to go out and find a job to support yourself and your kids, (as many women have had to do), then I think you might be singing a different tune. Given the uncertainty of marriage these days, education for a woman is just as important as what it is for a man. Case in point is a sister at the Hall, whose hubby took off after 25 years of marriage. She was also a stay at home mom and never worked outside the home. Her entire life was her family. The kids are grown and gone and she has no husband now to support her. She also has no skills to land a decent paying job. This is a scenario that is all-too-common these days. For you to suggest that women are better off "barefoot and pregnant" and totally reliant on a man to support them, is out of touch with reality as what the WTS's view of women is.
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chiddy
Well said Mary ,Dido gets on my nerves at times
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Fe2O3Girl
Dido, I can assure you that my husband is as hardworking and responsible as they come. And there is not much masculine about me! Unless you think that being capable and intelligent is masculine. In what sense am I "the weaker vessel"? Because Paul said so?
Why is a man looking after a child lazy and irresponsible? Is child care easy? Is a woman caring for children lazy and irresponsible? I am sure that SOME women don't want to stay at home with their children, but they are the minority. Have you looked at the property prices in your area recently, then compared that to the salaries offered in the job section? Where I live, there aren't many jobs for more than £20,000, and not much property for less than £100,000.
As I didn't leave the WT until my early twenties, and I had a lot of growing up to do, mid-twenties would have been the WRONG time to start a family. I met Mr Fe2O3 when I was 26. We spent a few years really getting to know each other.
Lots of people still start their families in their twenties, and that may be the best time for them. It wasn't the best time for me, and by extension, it wouldn't have been best for the child. The reasons were not primarily my career, but being settled in our home was important. Was that irresponsible?
To be honest, Dido, from your comments I don't think we will reach a consensus. You may think that you are inferior to men, but I know I am not. My marriage to my equal is the treasure of my life.
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dido
Mary- when i met my husband, he had nothing, we built it together, i supported his role, he supported mine, we started off renting one room, but we BOTH worked hard. By the way, i wasn`t a typical` witness at all, he was an unbeliever, so i had problems after i became a jw, which added to the deterioration of my marriage. Just because you are a stay at home mum doesn`t mean that you don`t use your brain. You are free to do what ever you please, any hobbies, arts etc., once you get the jobs done. I would hate to be stuck in a stuffy office all day, and same thing day in day out. at least when you are at home, you can chose whether you want to go out on a nice day etc. I got divorced after 25 years of marriage, (due to the wts) and have managed to `survive`, i have my own business, and home, despite being a stay at home mum. The whole structure of society has broken down because of the breakdown in role`s. You always point out the negative examples, there are lots of positive ones you know.
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Dansk
Divorces are starting to cost men too much these days... in the near future there will be a more balanced approach.
Absolutely right! Men will stay single
Ian