Isn't God Awesome? (page 14)

sinis

Jesus Christ, I thought I was going to grow mold watching that painfully slow video...

hillary_step

Perry,

I also have talked with many atheists over the years and know when they are posturing and gasping for air, like you are now doing.

I can only judge you from the posts that you have made on this Board but I suspect that you have never talked with athiests, you have talked AT atheists. This is a typical methodology employed by fundie nit-wits such as yourself and Vinny who do not understand even the basic premise under which science and philosophy work as disciplnes, due to the fact that you are both blinkered by your conclusions. Then ignoring every salient point made by the opposition without any due thought, you declare yourself winners of any debate that challenges the Bible.

The post Vinny made above for example, trying to prove that God need not have had a beginning is actually encapsulated by one premise, 'God did not have a beginning because the Bible says so'. While the both of you have your intellectual parameters set by a group of nomadic, sheep-herding primitives you will never understand what these debates are actually about.

You are my research. Please answer the 10 questions that I posted above so that I can determine if your source of the knowledge of good and bad is better than my Source. I mean, this is what you are claiming isn't it? Perhaps you have never really sat down and considered the overwhelmingly ridiculous implications of what you "posit".

There is so much information contradicting your shallow viewpoints Perry. Find them yourself, think about them, do not allow religious books written thousands of years ago to do your thinking for you. As a start. Have you heard of Stanely Milgram? His experiments? Learn from them and return with your analysis of what they mean in social terms. You will understand the premise of social conditioning in moral values quicker than you would like to admit.

You also accused me of ducking out of your last 'challenge' regarding social conditioning. I asked you to prove this by quote and you have not done so. I am not above ignoring arguments from people who have little to offer me intellectually but I would like you to prove your assertion.

Apart from that, until I can see that you and Vinny actually understand the basics of the subject that you seek to illuminate us mere mortals with, I see no point in furthering this discussion.

Remember, read Stanley Milgram as a starter. Then I can then provide a reading list for you that will further your knowledge.

Cheers - HS

JamesThomas

Mouthy:

J I see where your picture is the court jester. Very fitting LOL.......Didnt they used to call them fools>>?
O.K. so it took the foolish thing in the world to put the wise to shame... Are you teaching Perry???
Well MY vote is for Perry!!!! In MY book you lost....Your rudeness to Perry was petty, small minded, cruel.

Dear Gracie, actually I would be the first to admit I'm a fool, which is why I use it as an avatar. If you read my posts at all you will see I have no animosity towards people, only some beliefs and ideas. We are not our beliefs.

Interesting that the little story you have created in your mind about me ignores the positive statements where I tell Perry "the truth of what he is is the light of my life", and instead you embrace what you see as negative, even "cruel". I told him I meant it endearingly, and that was the truth. Perhaps what really pisses you off is my not embracing your god. This, I understand. Whenever I mention our true Source as being infinite and without end, it most always angers Christians who tenaciously argue for a lesser god. Even -- it seems -- in a thread they start about how "awesome" God is. If it weren't so sad, I'd wet my pants laughing (at least then I would have an excuse).

That I do not embrace your idea of God, dear Grace, does not mean I wouldn't like to give you a big old hug and kiss....or several.

j

bigmouth

Hi guys!! It's me! Can I play too???

JamesThomas

Perry:

Hillary,You pulled the same disappearing act on me several weeks ago when you said that you would "posit" your souurce of the knowledge of good and bad in something called "social conditioning" .

Here, is a 10 minute Richard Dawkins piece on shifting moral zeitgeist, that is related and enlightening.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ9JMUFIVqE

j

hillary_step

James,

Hillary,You pulled the same disappearing act on me several weeks ago when you said that you would "posit" your souurce of the knowledge of good and bad in something called "social conditioning" .

This may be true, but I certainly cannot recall 'dissappearing' from the discussion, especially given the ease with which this issue can be laid to rest. I have asked Perry to clarify his statement, and also given him a starting point from which he can properly educate himself on this subject.

I am nothing, if not philanthropic.

HS

LtCmd.Lore

So how does the holy spirit know the difference between right and wrong?
Here we reach what really is the bottom line for you isn't it?

Nope, acctually I never really thought of that question before our conversation on this thread. But I'm adding it to my list of unanswered questions about god, since somehow: "The self-existing one is also self-knowing." is more like a cop-out than an honest attempt at answering the question...

I'm trying to a have a philosophical discussion about the nature of good and evil here. You claimed that atheists can't figure out where morality comes from. And I responded with a link to a comprehensive answer to that exact question... you didn't like the answer, so I summarized it. You didn't like that either. But I did my best, and described in relatively good detail where morality ultimately comes from for atheists. I didn't insult your motives, and I thought I was being pretty friendly all things considered.

So when I asked you a question about where your morality ultimately comes from, I expected a better response than you just insulting my motives for two paragraphs and then finally giving me a single-sentence curt non-answer.

If you ask him he'll manuever you into a position where you could believe. He did it with me and millions of other folks who have asked. If you would just walk with him a while you'd see the masterful way in which He slowly changes your desires into that which brings maximum freedom, harmony, peace and many other things.

I was a christian for 16 years. I honestly loved god more than my own parents at age 9. He didn't do diddly squat. So don't tell me that I have to go to him, I already did and it didn't work.

The only time I feel peace and harmony is when I have a clear head and can really think things through. God makes that impossible.

You'd be surprised at the inner peace that comes from atheism. So right back at ya': If you would just leave god out of your life, you'd see the masterful way in which you can pursue your desires and attain maximum freedom, harmony, peace and many other things.

I'll bet you can't tell me that you were an atheist for 16 (Or even 2) years can you? Well as someone who's been on both sides of the coin, I can honestly tell you that I'm much happier now.

If you ask him he'll manuever you into a position where you could believe.

'Here we reach what really is the bottom line for you isn't it?' You believe in god because you want too.

Quite frankly, after our discussion, I'm no longer interested in your opinions on morality. By your own admission you can't determine right from wrong by yourself, you have to get it from the holy spirit... Why in the heck would I want to be a part of that?

Why is god omni-benevolent? Because he decides what's good and bad, so therefore if he murders innocent people and torments them forever it's good... It's hard to be labeled evil when you're the one who makes the definitions.

If there is no logical basis for gods moral decisions, then it is nothing more than his personal opinion.

Lore

JamesThomas

H.S.

That was a quote of Perry's to you from farther up the thread. I just placed it in my post as basis for the Dawkins link.

j

LtCmd.Lore

Something else I just thought of:

One of the first things a parent want's their children to learn is how to tell the difference between right and wrong.

A mother want's her child to know what's right, and not have to ask her every time something comes up.

She doesn't want her 32 year old son calling her from out of town saying: "Hey mom, I'm hungery, should I go to McDonalds or should I kill my neighbor and take his food?"

So why would god want his children to have to turn to him every two minutes and ask the 'holy spirit' whether they're doing the right thing?

Lore

free2beme

Spirit is amazing

Blessed be

Isn't God Awesome?

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