For the ladies. Do you think that when you.....

by NotaNess 236 Replies latest jw friends

  • eclipse
    eclipse

    Notaness. were you gawking at a woman who was dressed sexy?

    Just wondering where this thread is coming from.

    Go ahead and stare at the women who like to dress sexy. Looking doesn't hurt anyone.

    The ones that yell at you are probably just grossed out at being gawked at.

    But I get it, if we're gonna wear revealing clothing, we better be prepared to be stared at.

    Heck, I check out everyone, and if you're hot and wearing sexy clothes, I will look at ya, but I try to be discreet.

    It's one thing to be gazed upon politely by a stranger and another thing to be leered at.

    But, if we women want to dress sexy, we should expect to be stared at.

    There are alot of men out there who don't know how to look using discretion.

    Most us normal women just ignore the creepy guys looking, unless they're really creepy

    Then we just get weirded out and scared.

  • John Doe
    John Doe

    I don't know what NotaNess intentions were with starting this thread other than the original post I read of his.
    People telling him to grow up because he asked a question and phrased it in a way they don't agree with I found a little harsh.
    His comment here:
    Funny, how I'm trying to encourage the ladies(but not in the easiest of ways), to not dress so revealing, and to actually GET a little more respect from people
    I found completely unnecessary and don't exactly see where that comes into play with the discussion- I don't think any grown woman needs to be encouraged in how you think she should dress. At least I certainly don't want your advice on the matter.

    It's been said by me and others and I will say it again; SOME women purposely dress revealing because they WANT to be looked, it is a fact and to say that's just not so is incomprehensible to me. Making any moral judgment on these people or how they choose to dress to go to the grocery store is not my intention here.
    In fact I know someone that I stopped doing things in public with (and I think this is a very valid point to this discussion) because of this. She was a very curvy girl who wouldn't wear undergarments of any kind then dress incredibly provocatively which made it only obvious she had no undergarments on. Now I don't care if someone doesn't want to wear undergarments but I don't want to be shown that you don't wear them (because it's very visible with the clothes you chose to then wear). Anyway this girl would then make a huge scene and completely embarrass me and everyone around when people would look at her. She would yell at them saying "keep your eyes to yourself" and things like that. I know her I know she loved the attention she got and I have since seen in my lifetime many women who seem to be subscribers to this same sort of "fashion" sense as some have described it. I don't care how anyone dresses as long as it doesn't affect me. But I strongly believe and will continue to believe that this is something some women do because they like the attention. Even if it is not positive attention. I do believe there is a valid point in that statement that NotaNess made with his first post on this topic, although I can't say I agree with much else I've read from him thereafter.
    Hey Misa, why don't you tell us what you really think? ;-)
  • nvrgnbk
    nvrgnbk

    Me too. It's a contest.

    Did you done bring it?

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    I am not sure if anyone has stated this TRUTH... but, believe it or not... the REALITY is... that most women dress... for other WOMEN. More often than not, it is what we see IN, ON, or ABOUT other WOMEN that drive our choices in personal presentation. Truly, more often than not, men are merely a secondary consideration, if anyone (beyond the woman herself), is considered at all.

    On ther other hand, another TRUTH is that, more often than not, men look at women regardless of what they are wearing (unless, of course, they are wearing nothing!) as the majority of men look at the FACE... first. Regardless of the BODY, if she has a "pretty" face, she will be "attractive" to a man, because men are virtually always attracted to visual "beauty." Even a gay man (which is why some of them get involved with/get married to whatever particular woman they do, although I acknowledge that there are exceptions to every rule).

    The initial attraction of the FACE is the purpose behind imposing the full abeyah in Muslim society. This is because a man can see a woman with every inch except her face covered, and based on that little bit of exposure begin to wonder what's under the garment (although not really caring too much if it's not what some would consider "attractive," as the imagination can make things be whatever one wishes them to be). However, if a man see's an "unattractive" body only, with no clue as to the face, he is almost assuredly to be disinterested.

    After the face, body parts are next, of course, because, again, men are attracted to and by "visual" manifestations (which accounts for a great deal of their lack of faith - if they can't SEE it, they have a heck of a hard time believing it), and an "attractive" body, like an attractive face, like an attractive ANYTHING (think CARS)... is virtually irresistible. Just like women and shopping (again, acknowledging the exception to the rule): we often "can't help it."

    Women should simply understand that if you make a visual presentation of some level of "attractiveness"... it is going to be looked at by men... AND by women! Thankfully, most (men and women) want only to look, but not touch (again, there are the exceptions, from both genders).

    Men should simply understand (and woman should simply acknowledge) that women LIKE... to be LOOKED at! By other women as well as by men (and, actually, the by other women WAY more than by men - just like men like to compare their accomplishments with other men, versus with women). Men should also understand (and women really should acknowledge) that to achieve this end... being looked at... women will pretty much do whatever THEY feel they NEED to do to have that happen. BUT... that does not necessarily translate into wanting anything MORE than just being looked at.

    Bottom line:

    Gentlemen - Surely you understand that just because a lady wants to be LOOKED at doesn't mean she wants to be TOUCHED. Nor does it mean she even wants to be APPROACHED (actually, she most probably wasn't dressing for you or someone like you, but someone like her!). Both touching and approaching are unacceptable, unless you've been given some [very obvious] indication to the contrary. Great art is created to be LOOKED at, not fondled. And because "beauty" is SUCH a requirement of women in society, most of us try to present ourselves as "works of art." However, just because you can SEE the beauty of the Mona Lisa doesn't mean you get to fondle it... and it certainly doesn't mean you get to take it home! Really, it IS up to YOU... to control the... ummmm... "results" of your... ummmm... "attraction"... however, it may be manifested. If that means taking your leave, take your leave. If it means closing your eyes, well... you get the point. Best advice: Look. Go ahead. But do it DISCREETLY (if you can muster that)... and from afar... until you are INVITED to do otherwise.

    Ladies - If you don't WANT to be looked at, then you might want to rethink making an "appearance." This can be accomplished by LOGICALLY considering your personal "presentation" in light of the possible outcomes that you DON'T want (i.e., Guys ogle exposed breasts; I don't want guys ogling my breasts; maybe I shouldn't expose my breasts). The contrary (i.e., guys ogle exposed breasts; I don't want guys ogling my breasts; I am going to expose my breasts anyway, but guys better not ogle them!) really doesn't work. Really, it doesn't. If, however, you DO make an appearance, you really should reasonably EXPECT to be looked at. Ogled, even, depending on your presentation. So what? So, just don't take it personally. You got what you wanted: looks. Bask in it. Otherwise, you really are being a hypocrite.

    I bid you all peace.

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • John Doe
    John Doe
    Great art is created to be LOOKED at, not fondled.

    Most sculpturists would disagree.

  • SixofNine
    SixofNine

    Great art is created to be LOOKED at, not fondled.

    It just seems like they ought to teach you that before you ruin the 8th grade class field trip, y'know?

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    May you have peace!

    Although I would agree than "many" sculpturists would take this position, I would not agree that "most" do. Those that do tend to include features of their art that invites touching/fondling, etc. 'Cause that's what they want viewers to DO.

    The majority, however, don't actually create their art for us... mere viewers... but for themselves, as an extension of themselves. That we appreciate it and want to view it... is our privilege. That we would touch or fondle it would, more often than not, be considered an "assault" - upon the piece of art, if not upon the artist him or her self.

    Again, I bid you peace.

    A slave of Christ,

    SA

  • AGuest
    AGuest

    who caused all that commotion back then, my fellow Borg-ite! Thankfully, they were considered only "crown" jewels. You know, as opposed to the "family" kind?

    (LOLOLOLOL)

    Peace!

    Shel

  • sweetstuff
    sweetstuff

    Coolhandluke: what's more of a statement of "LOOK AT ME"? Wearing a shirt that shows I am a woman, or branding your flesh forever by means of body modification. And starting a thread about it, no less. Do you see the irony in your statement? You may want people to judge you for other things yet you choose to get tattoos for your own personal reasons, but still you choose to you sit on your high moral horse and suggest that because you are "above" such things you don't "judge" yet you can see why other's shouldn't dress a certain way or show certain things unless they are looking for a certain reaction, when you yourself buck conformity because it's right for you? I think I am going to be ill.

    I got to admit, I think I am more disappointed in you for this attittude than I would be with alot of people. You dare to be different, that kilt wearing, tattooed larrikin who's strong and independant, yet, I'm a 30 something baggage carrying flirty floozy who's just begging for attention right? LOL Oh, wait, that's not how you see me, but you would never date a woman like "me", ROFL. This is priceless. Really, it is.

    As for me being a mid thirties woman with "baggage", define "baggage" please. Do you have no issues from your past? Would you want people to "assume" because you have tattoos that you must have "baggage"? Have all your past relationships worked out perfectly? Are you in a successful longterm marriage? What gems of wisdom from your baggage free existence can you share with someone as misguided as myself.

    And btw, I like your tattoos, I respect your right to be an idividual, the difference is this, I would never assume you must be inferior in any way because of it (morally, mentally, socially), yet, because I have breasts and some of them, that's right, some cleavage appears in my avatar, I must be "looking for a certain reaction" right? The look on my face is just asking for it, right? What is the intent of your avatar picture?

    We all, men and women express our sexuality in different ways and forms. Some are more comfortable with it than others, some reveal it in their dress, purposefully, or without realizing it. Some in the way they conduct themselves, some may be very conservative day-to-day. But in private can be voyeristic, liking to be "seen", as long as they believe its a private matter. Yet be the first to point a judgemental finger in public at others thinking their secrets protected.

    In the end, human sexuality is a very mysterious thing and the less judgemental we all are, the better.

  • wanderlustguy
    wanderlustguy
    Did you done bring it?

    Oh I been done brought i... crap...where did it go...

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