Feedback needed please

by MrMoe 55 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  expatbrit

  Another thought.
  The kinds of things she'll see on those videos are still happening today. Adults and children are starving, being butchered in atrocious ways, being tortured in concentration camps, today, right now.

  One of the more justified complaints against the Western world is how we stick our heads in the sand while others suffer and starve and die. One of the reasons we do this is because we shield ourselves from reality to a large extent. Cushion ourselves in our comfortable lifestyle and avoid seeing things we find unpleasant and disturbing.

  Perhaps if young adults are given a more realistic education, their generation will be more empathetic to the suffering of others, leading to a less selfish world.

  Expatbrit
• 

  MrMoe

  Dan is correct about how most of those effected by this would be the girls. In my conversation, the boys were not really all that disturbed, they in fact laughed periodically throughout the videos as the girls sat there and cried.

  I DO agree that adolescents should be exposed to human travesties. But, to see a live execution -- an d I stress the one with a small child being impaled on a pitch fork -- is sick. If it bothers me and it bothers her, then it would be a personal choice. Why force a child to watch something that they play over and over in their mind? Why force a young lady to witness live executions to later have nightmares? And, thus far, 3 videos have been shown.

  Now, just to let you know, the Principal of the school has returned my call. He said that this was a course intended for the 12th Grade Honors History IIII Class. He said he was disgusted that she took it upon herself to use the incorrect study matter, that was not intended for the children to see. He also said the videos were copyrighted and could not be edited, but the teachers were supposed to fast forward through the scenes.

  To teach a child empathy is one thing. To expose them to death, gore and an violence is another. They were also reading a book and using other forms of study to learn about the Holocaust. This was plenty. Anyhow, the principal said he will speak with the teacher and the videos, if not the course itself, will be stopped.
• 

  Andee

  If your sister-in-law were my kid, this is what I would do.

  First off, I would call the teacher, the principal, the superintendent, and the school board and inform them that I will not allow my child to complete some of the assignments. I would expect her to be given alternative assignments that would be given the same credit as to the assignments that originally given. If any of the above people balk, I will then go to the press, ACLU, and every other organization that might help me publicize some of these clearly outrageous tasks.

  I, like you, Moe, find the child being tossed then murdered by impalement to be particularly disturbing. That would give ME nightmares! I would go to the mat with the school before I would EVER allow my kid to watch that. I truly question the sanity of your Sister-in-Laws instructor. What value is there in viewing such heinous acts? Does this woman have children of her own???

  Now, the books and boxcar assignment don’t bother me as much. Books at least keep the violence at a distance. The boxcar I think is interesting, actually. 14? I’m on the fence about that age doing such a thing.. I’m thinking maybe more at the age of 16 or older. I think that, perhaps, children this young cannot cope with powerful emotions such an experience might bring.

  As far as the news and movies that depict war and violence. My children are still relatively young. However, I try to never let them see the local news. It’s just one act of violence after another. Children do not have the life experience or the point of reference to put these events in proper perspective. They get the impression that the world around them is much more violent than it actually is.

  As for seeing movies such as SAVING PRIVATE RYAN or SCHINDLER’S LIST, imho, no one under the age of 18 should see them. For the same reasons that I stated for the local news. These stories are based on real experiences and kids know it. It’s not the same as seeing some slasher movie. How often have we, even as adults, comforted ourselves when we watch a violent fictional movie or TV show by telling ourselves, or our children, “it’s not real, it’s not real blood, he or she didn’t really die”?

  If watching these acts is intended to teach empathy, then why is it that so many people that experience war and violence first hand, become to harden to human suffering?? One would think that these people would be the most sensitive of all.

  Andee
• 

  hillbilly

  I've worked in law enforcement and industrial accident investigation. Take my work for it, there are "realities" that I would not wish on anyone. We dont show everything because it just IS NOT necessary to make the point. ('cept in court, and sometimes the judge will screen things if they are not germain)
  Got to ask---when was the last time you saw a ravaged human body up close before the mortuary worked on it----just what I thought. Ever been shot at? shot anybody?- just what I thought? Been on a fire call to collect a dead kid's body?-just what I thought.

  I'm always suspect about people who think they know the "reality" of violence and think we need to see more of it to" understand" it.
• 

  bboyneko

  thank you hillbilly, watching a video of a graphic death does not help you understand it or compare to actually being there.
• 

  sf

  Have a sift thru these:

  < http://google.yahoo.com/bin/query?p=Nazis+Women+jehovah%27s+witnesses+military+services&hc=0&hs=0
• 

  sf

  And these:

  < http://google.yahoo.com/bin/query?p=Nazis+Women+Watchtower+jehovah%27s+witnesses+military+services&hc=0&hs=0

  sKally, happy trails...wcrestnpeace
• 

  expatbrit

  Hillbilly:

  As a matter of fact, I have seen bodies in real life in a disturbing state. It impressed upon me exactly what violence can do to a human body. It made me cringe and retch. It also emphasized to me that there is probably nothing short of outright self-defence which could make me inflict that sort of damage on another person. Lesson learned.

  I do not advocate the mental torture of children by enforcing these kind of things upon them (and in this case, we were not talking about a child, but a fourteen year old). But I don't think a "head in the sand" approach is wise either. Surely gaining a greater understanding of the harsh realities of violence will serve to cultivate an abhorrence of violence. This is especially relevant in these days of removed push-button warfare.

  Bboyneko, watching a video of a real event will help you understand it better, since humans learn very well through visual means.

  Learning about the holocaust by watching Disney's "Princess Cohen in Auschwitz" will only increase the already woefully lacking standard of historical knowledge in young adults.

  Expatbrit
• 

  waiting

  Hello Moe,

  Dan is correct about how most of those effected by this would be the girls. In my conversation, the boys were not really all that disturbed, they in fact laughed periodically throughout the videos as the girls sat there and cried. mr.moe

  Interesting....girls crying, boys periodically laughing throughout the videos. So much for any empathy.

  As you've called the school, and have gotten an answer - this seems a situation where a teacher over reached her guidelines, and the videos will be stopped. I am glad that the 12th grade will see them. Perhaps the boys won't laugh at them then.....but I doubt if many will change towards having more empathy by the time they reach 18.

  Hopefully the girls will have grown to be able to view the actual world around them. Maybe they'll be strong enough to visit the website dealing with the plight of Taliban ruled women - as they are being brutalized & murdered as we discuss this.

  As for not having to see all gore and pain to realize it happens - that's true. The German people knew that 6 million Jews were being moved from town - lots of them spit on them as they were forcefully moved - or burned out. But the German townspeople had no empathy for the Jews as persons, in general. They didn't care enough to do anything. Some most likely laughed periodically too at the dirty Jews. After all, they weren't really humans anyway.

  I agree that guidelines should be put in place - but to shield too much, to not see the world - as has been brought out - is one of the main things which disgusts other nations about us.

  waiting
• 

  Julie

  Greetings all,

  Interesting situation Moe. There's no way in hell I would let a teacher force my daughter (or son for that matter) watch graphic videos of executions etc. Like Andee said, books are one thing, a bit more distance there but videos, that's quite another.

  LDH,

  I found this interesting:

  :This is like White Flight out of the city and into the burbs--idiots think that as long as there's no 'darkies' around, they're protected from the big bad inner city! Yah right. Which is why all these little white suburban kids are shooting up school. Columbine, etc etc.

  While I realize that the big school shoot 'em ups have been committed by white kids I fail to see what some neglected white kids taking out their anger on their schools has anything to do with the White Flight out of the cities after all the race riots. Interesting too the way you make it sound almost like an every-day occurance.

  And as far as us "idiots" who participated in the White Flight, call us what you will but after our "Flight" I personally was never *again* mugged at knife-point for my lunch money, our home was never *again* burgalurized and no members of my family were brutally robbed *again*. You seem to have some anger issues over so many whites fleeing the cities where they were not wanted and that had been made very clear. After all the violence we were subjected to we assumed the attitude of "Hey, ok you want the city that bad, it's all yours." Not our fault the cities never fully recovered from the riots we fled from.

  One person's idiocy can be another's survival,
  Julie