The Friends Ain't So Friendly

by StAnn 53 Replies latest jw friends

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  StAnn

  I've been thinking. A lot of posts I read here say things about how the JWs are all victims; how people feel so sorry for them; how people believe that the JWs they know are really good people who are trapped in a lie. Then I read a lot of other posts about the cruel things the JWs do, like shunning, ignoring df'd people on the side of the road with a flat tire, refusing to be charitable to their fellow humans, delighting at the impending deaths of millions of people, and blaming all of their coldness and heartlessness on the fact that they're just following orders from the GB. Deep down inside, they don't WANT to be heinous people, but they have no choice....

  I'm beginning to doubt this scenario. I think the JWs would have made perfect Nazis. We talk a lot about which came first, i.e., do JWs attract crazy people or just make people crazy? In this context, I wonder, do JWs attract cruel, heartless people or do they make them cruel and heartless?

  Saying, "I was just following orders," doesn't wash with any of us for the Nazis. Why do we use it as an excuse for the JWs? Would anyone here honestly say that Nazi soldiers were victims, that they didn't want to kill and mutilate Jews but they were just following orders, so it's okay? How can we have a double standard for the JWs, who have ruined as many lives as the Nazis took in their concentration camps?

  I think that, if people have any goodness in them, any divine spark, any human decency, they won't be able to remain in the Borg. It will eat them alive to "have" to be cruel and they won't be able to survive the internal battle between their humanity and the Borg and they will leave. Thus, I think that people who are able to stay in the Borg for many, many years and be happy and devoted are probably just heartless, cold, evil people who found a belief system that lets them indulge their true, sadistic natures.

  StAnn
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  jamiebowers

  You are probably right, but it's difficult to face it, because these are people we love.
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  VM44

  The JWs might appear nice and friendly, especially when a person first meets them, but it is all a facade. They will turn on an individual in an instant!

  They are (in general) not very nice people when it comes down to it.
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  StAnn

  Jamie, so you're still up too, huh? It's been raining all day down here in SW Ohio and I'm all achy from arthritis.

  I guess why this hit me so hard is that I'm thinking about my own relatives. I have a JW brother (an elder) who is deep into geneaology. I've thought, "He's totally disinterested in the family that he has that is living unless they're JWs, but he's completely fascinated by the ones who are dead!" Since none of our ancestors were JWs, I don't know why he's so interested in learning about them.

  But I digress. I think that, if I really look at my family, the ones who are still JWs are the ones who were the most heartless and most cruel as children. They're just mean and evil and this religion lets them indulge their despicable personality traits while telling them that they're superior for doing it. Kinda makes you worry about what's in the DNA stew you're passing on to your kids.

  StAnn
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  BabaYaga

  I like your "divine spark" reference. My beloved friend, who also happens to be my bishop, says that everyone has the divine spark... but some of them hide it so well you will never see it.
  
  Mention has been made on this forum of the cult personality vs. the real person. Sometimes you see the real person shining through... but if they catch themselves... they call the cult personality out to squelch it.
  
  I do see your analogy of the Nazis. Hell, they say Hitler was wonderful to his dog. Perhaps the answer is that there is no one who is perfectly good, neither is there anyone who is PERFECTLY evil.
  
  Whatever the answer is, my beloved ones are still in, and I love them.
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  jamiebowers

  I have a JW brother (an elder) who is deep into geneaology. I've thought, "He's totally disinterested in the family that he has that is living unless they're JWs, but he's completely fascinated by the ones who are dead!" Since none of our ancestors were JWs, I don't know why he's so interested in learning about them.

  Maybe he's thinking abouy meting them after the resurection

  I think my mom stays in, because it's her only source of credibility.

  Been raining here too. Going to bed in a minute,
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  nameless_one

  When I first read this, it disturbed me and agitated me but I couldn't really put my finger on why. After much thought, it has crystallized for me: It bothers me because it almost reads like a self-referential grandfather clause. How many people on this board were in the borg for years, devoted and gung-ho and convinced that "the truth" was true? Are those who exited before you or with you righteous and good and OK, but those still in after your departure are evil sadistic bastards by nature? For every ex-JW here, there was someone who woke up and got out before you did. There will be others who wake up and get out after. Does the hopeless sadistic Nazi clause kick in and apply only after one's own personal exit?
  
  I don't mean any disrespect, and I do acknowledge that there are plenty of Witnesses who are indeed "heartless, cold, evil people who found a belief system that lets them indulge their true, sadistic natures." But I also know that there are others who have goodness, divine spark, and decency, and have been in for many years -- and still are.
  
  I agree that those who have a conscience and a brain and a genuine moral compass don't do well in the organization. Maybe they leave in a blaze of glory, maybe they fade away, maybe they stay because they don't know what else to do, maybe they fall apart mentally and psychologically, a million other maybes.
  
  But I don't think it's fair or accurate to say anyone who's still in is evil and sadistic by nature. Most people on this board were in at one time, many for a LONG time and many in a very devoted way.
  
  Again, I don't mean any disrespect here, but this thread has really bothered me.
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  r.a.m.

  I do think that nazi's didn't want to do what they do, just like rapist don't really want to rape. But they have no love and without love you are consumed with darkness. If they knew love and light, they would be happy, not just follow awful orders.
  
  NO WAY does it make it okay!! Not for nazi's and not for cruel witnesses. But I don't think anyone wants to do bad things. However, they CAN fight it. They just don't know how to.
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  cognizant dissident

  I think the JWs would have made perfect Nazis. We talk a lot about which came first, i.e., do JWs attract crazy people or just make people crazy? In this context, I wonder, do JWs attract cruel, heartless people or do they make them cruel and heartless?

  Gee, I was a JW my whole life, and I never ignored a df'd person with a flat tire, delighted in the impending death of anyone, treated anybody in a cruel or heartless manner, or did anything remotely heinous or "Nazi-ish". I'm also pretty sure I'm not crazy. I think you are painting JW's with a pretty broad brush.

  Cog
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  FlyingHighNow

  delighting at the impending deaths of millions of people,

  My sister has said to me in the past, "I can't wait til armegeddon and all those worldly people are gone. Worldly people cause all of my problems. I hate worldly people."