God and Suffering (page 8)

beksbks

Evil is the absence of God.

And what exactly does this mean in real human terms? Take a look at arguably the most civilized happy nations on earth, they also happen to have the least amount of religious affiliation.

restrangled

Perry...you lost me.

I was taught my entire jw life, and to answer others asking the question why is there suffering, why doesn't god stop this, etc. etc. was:

He is letting mankind prove themselves incapable of ruling themselves. Not only to us, but to Satan who questioned him in the beginning, and also to all the angels watching.

AS far as judgement: I guarantee you most xJW's on this site will tell you they were not only judged but condemned for all time. Where you get the idea there is judgement after death as a JW is beyond me.

If you are not a JW...maybe you get a pass. Once a JW and you fail....you are dead in their eyes.

r.

Perry

Perry...you lost me.

I was taught my entire jw life, and to answer others asking the question why is there suffering, why doesn't god stop this, etc. etc. was:

He is letting mankind prove themselves incapable of ruling themselves. Not only to us, but to Satan who questioned him in the beginning, and also to all the angels watching.

And I am saying that this explanation is false, is a ruse, a red-herring, and is not taught in the bible. We are God's enemies at birth...children of Adam. There is nothing to prove. We are vessels of wrath awaiting judgment and destruction because of our father Adam.

AS far as judgement: I guarantee you most xJW's on this site will tell you they were not only judged but condemned for all time. Where you get the idea there is judgement after death as a JW is beyond me.

And this is a false judgment because the WT has ZERO authority to judge...as do the rest of us. My point is that in Heb. 9: 27 the bible clearly states that judgment is AFTER death ...not before as the WT teaches.

If you are not a JW...maybe you get a pass. Once a JW and you fail....you are dead in their eyes.

I was a 4th generation witness and Regular Pioneer. The bible says that ALL will be judged after death. Believers have a choice to be judged now and accept the punishment of death, die to themselves and be re-born. Unbelievers deny themselves this option and will be judged at the Great White Throne after the thousand year reign of Jesus here on earth.

I realize much of this may be new to you....but the point as it relates to this discussion is that God can (1) simply eliminate freewill to stop sin/suffering or (2) he can judge the perps.

He has stated clearly in scripture that he will preserve freewill and use the instrument of judgment to deal with sin and suffering. This is the biblical explanation of how God exists along side of evil. He has defeated it at the cross, suffering its consequences himself and later he will judge it.

Understand?

startingover

I've seen discussions like this go on and on. Bottom line, everyone on this thread is going to get old and die and cease to exist, like it or not. I know it's hard for some to accept, but that's reality.

AK - Jeff

Perhaps the thread should have been titled:

If God is really there, Is He more like Hitler or Mother Theresa?

Perry, I have tried to resist personal attacks on the delusional, but you make such an easy target on this subject. You are probably the most self-righteous poster I know of on this board. You openly defend God with wild assertions that don't even compute for those of us too ignorant of, or uninterested in, your personal theological interpretations of the Bible.

I did not start a 'hate God party', sir. I asked a perfectly sound set of intelligent questions, accompanied by what I found to be well rounded opinion written by another. You have spent the entire thread defending some goofy assertions about how liberal Jehovah's Witnesses are. No one likely gives a shit how liberal Jehovah's Witnesses are in your mind, sir.

What we do care about, as witnessed by the many logical comments here rendered, is the original thought - That God seems to be either cruel or non-existent if he would allow mankind to continue suffering [whether or not mankind are in Perri-theology his children]. Defending God with some assertion that he is no longer responsible for them because they are all born in sin is ludicrous. Even according to your limited view of the world - God created mankind didn't he? God set the entire thing in motion! Surely he must be part of the picture, isn't he?

I find it absolutely appalling that anyone can be so fiercely committed to defense of God that he can just wave his hand and ignore the entire plight of man with a legal clause that excuses the maker of man.

Further - whether or not the people who have made comments here are atheists or otherwise is not the issue. I do not label myself atheist. But then, my worldview is not the point. Though admittedly, if your viewpoint espouses anything near the 'proper Christian position' on these matters, you have aided my opinion that I would want nothing to do with such evil based theology in my personal life. Whether or not I, or any other posters here, or Jehovah's Witnesses in general are too liberal theologically is not the issue.

You seem intent on just attack without purpose - against atheists, Jehovah's Witnesses, those too liberal in perspective, those who read Dawkins instead of your Bible.

The issue is: WHERE THE HELL IS GOD, AND WHY DOES HE NOT CARE ENOUGH TO HONOR HIS PROMISES SUPPOSEDLY MADE IN YOUR LITTLE HOLY BOOK? Why do people on this planet seem to care about the suffering - but your HOLY GOD doesn't? There - nice little pointedly clear questions if you care to answer them.

And no bullshit about how nice skydaddy made man, man failed, therefore skydaddy can just walk away except for those who 'come to him' on gravel-filled knees and become his children.

Rant over. Carry on.

Jeff

cofty

Jeff -

Looking forward to a straight answer hahaha

Witness 007

God is dead.........thats why we have so much suffering. The only help you will get in Haiti is a man with a shovel.

JimmyPage

God is a Republican, you damn liberal morons!

THE GLADIATOR

Why does God allow suffering? Well he is not responsible. As in all good fairy tales the dragon is to blame. He walks around like a roaring lion seeking to devour. It's all in the bible so it must be true.

I know God exists because I have a bible that tells me it was written by him. Irrefutable, unshakable logic, no less?

I can apply this same logic to the dragon and prove his existence also.

The inn I drink in is called the George & Dragon. Although I have met George, I have yet to meet the Dragon; but the dragon must exist because the inn exists and is named after him.

All things become clear if you use ‘Perry logic.’ Apply it twice daily for miraculous results.

Deputy Dog

AK-Jeff

Actually, the initial post is not my original ideas if you note, Deputy Dawg.

Maybe not, but it was you who characterized them.

Why? Because an ancient book says so?

No. Because we all deserve much more suffering than we receive.

Define sufficient grovelling. To most who like to follow skydaddy, there is never enough grovelling. And never grovel outside the 'approved' group.

And cofty

Exactly! That is why religion should not be dismissed as harmless. In my opinion people who left the borg and got stuck in religion have yet to complete their escape

You're still thinking like poor little beat up JWs and with that type of thinking there is no escape. When will you get past that. There is no amount of "grovelling" or works of any kind, by any group, that will get God off your back.

We're not accepted by God, for anything we've done, will do or by association with any "group", but, on what Christ has done.

God and Suffering

Share this