Profoundly Shock, Sadening and Traumatic Account of Mary Aguilar (page 4)

Scott77

But hang on..... isn't quitting drinking exactly what an alcoholic should be doing??

Nobody said it has to be easy to take responsibility for your own life. But it's the right thing to do.

Sigh

Quillsky

What do all these sighs mean, Scott? While other people are posting personal stories and eloquent views (which make us think, and reconsider our respective attitudes) you post sighs and sad faces?

I deeply appreciate your contructive contributions and criticisms in as far as dealing with the abused victims is concerned. However, I respectively disagree with your earlier statements in which somehow, implied that victims of abuse would have done more to stop the abuse. However, when you recently stated that 'personal stories and eloquent views (which make us think, and reconsider our respective attitudes', it effectively made a big difference to what I had earlier in mind. It was kind of game charger. By the way, do you have any friend who migh have been a victim of abuse? Unless we have been in their shoes, its very difficult to comprehend the extent of abuse the vicitims are subjected to.

Scott77

Quillsky

Thanks for your reply, Scott77. No, I can't think of a personal friend or relative that has been physically abused, but I mentioned my personal example of having been emotionally abused and only realizing afterwards, when people who had observed evidence of it said "I wondered why you stayed", and I truly wished they'd rather said something at the time.

I still believe that there is such a thing as a victim mentality, and sometimes "tough love" - including calling a spade a spade - is the best thing you can do to help them stop what is often a cycle. I have read of many cases where women go from being physically abused by a parent and then by a series of men, and I do think "Surely you can see a pattern here? This can't be a coincidence. Why are you allowing it?"

However, this is certainly complicated by, especially in the case of women, financial dependence and children. If I sound hard-hearted I understand, but I'm really not. I just wish abused women would take responsibility, not for the abuse but for recognizing it and then getting away from the abuser.

Edited to add: I've just recalled that a good friend (not an ex-JW) was abused by her gun-toting husband (now ex-husband). He continues to occasionally torment her with threats on her life, but that has lessened over the years since she left him, mainly because she has taken a "keep away from me with that crap" stand. I admire her tremendously for that.

dinah

Quillsky, your advice could get a woman killed. As Jamie Bowers said, a woman is in the most danger of losing her life when she leaves. I had to move back to my hometown, so I would be guaranteed police protection. I had to get restraining orders, which are worthless. Usually by the time you can call the police you are dead before they get there.

My Dad installed new doors, thicker door frames and new deadbolts on his house and kept me there. He took me out for target practice, and made sure I knew how to operate a gun, just in case.

My ex found out where I was working and tried to follow me home one night. Good thing my car could outrun his.

It was a nightmare that continued for the better part of two years. I could never be alone and I was terrified.

It is hard to leave after years of being told you are worthless, stupid, ugly. They keep you isolated from friends, family. If you make friends, they won't let you keep them. They won't quit until they have control of everything--what you wear, who you can talk to.....they tend to be extremely jealous.

It's bad being in that situation, but when your religion tells you to simply, "Be a better wife" that is simply criminal. I wonder sometimes, if I had still been a Witness at that time if I would still even be alive.

Quillsky

(((Dinah)))

I think perhaps my advice is right for some people but not all? Thank god for your dad, he seems like a good man.

misocup

I went through the same thing with my mother and alcoholic father, and then later my JW husband.

Now I understand why my elder brothers never helped my mother, and why when I went to the elders for help they ignored my situation and blamed me.

My mother and I had to go through all of that abuse to protect the reputation of an organization. In effect LYING to the general public and other JW's about the health of the organization. The phrase "whitened sepulchres" comes to mind.

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone. 24 Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel.

25 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess. 26 Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. 28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.

Uphold the reputation of the org. rather than Jesus teachings. Isn't that EXACTLY what the Pope was and is doing?

Don't worry, I'm wearing my headscarf.

babygirl30

If a stranger pounces at you on the street and takes your purse, that's one thing. If you keep going back again and again and again to a man WHOSE BEHAVIOR YOU KNOW AND CAN PREDICT, well that's your choice. "Poor me" doesn't work for me.

I agree with you ... to a DEGREE - and I have lived through abuse. What you fail to understand is that the 'poor me' attitude SOME women who suffer at the hands of abuse have - is because they don't KNOW any better. Like those of us 'born' into the org. Things didn't FEEL right, we may have even admitted they weren't right, but we were TOLD we didn't know any better...we couldn't fend for ourselves...we wouldn't make it out there in the world. So when that is drilled in your head - that without the org, you will die and/or the world will chew you up - WHAT do you think you're going to believe? WHY do you think some stay IN the org for so long?

Studies show that the average woman returns to her abuser 7 times! Picture that...this man tears you up, kicks your ass, makes you THINK you are worthless - and you stay (or go back). Why? Because THAT is how long it takes for her to either get the 'cojones' to leave him, or, she finally gets an escape plan together. NOT easy - NOT safe.

But even though I have gone through an abusive relationship, I do NOT consider myself a victim - I am a survivor. A victim means that I am NOT in control - and although he didn't like it, I AM in control of my life and my choices NOW...back when I was in that relationship, I was out of control (so to speak). I do not LOOK for anyone to pity me and what I went through. Instead of it bringing me down, it's strengthened me and empowered me to stand up for myself now.

babygirl30

One more thing: in the org, a woman (who is being abused) has to suffer TWICE as much because (1) her loyalty to her husband comes into question, and (2) her loyalty to the org can also be questioned. THAT adds up to a 'cycle' of abuse that CAN seem never-ending to someone that has been demeaned.

Scott77

	One more thing: in the org, a woman (who is being abused) has to suffer TWICE as much because (1) her loyalty to her husband comes into question, and (2) her loyalty to the org can also be questioned. THAT adds up to a 'cycle' of abuse that CAN seem never-ending to someone that has been demeaned.
	babygirl30

Hi babygirl30 ,

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Profoundly Shock, Sadening and Traumatic Account of Mary Aguilar

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