France to Fine Women Wearing Full-Faced Islamic Veils

by leavingwt 54 Replies latest social current

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  leavingwt

  bttt

  France's burka ban went into effect today. Some women have defied the law.

  "France's new ban on Islamic face veils was met with a burst of defiance Monday," The Associated Press reports from Paris, "as several women appeared veiled in front of Paris' Notre Dame Cathedral and two were detained for taking part in an unauthorized protest."

  . . .

  An estimated 2,000 or so of France's 5 million Muslims would be affected. As Eleanor reported, women who do wish to wear such veils say the law infringes on their personal freedoms.

  But as the BBC writes, "the French government says the face-covering veil undermines the basic standards required for living in a shared society and also relegates its wearers to an inferior status incompatible with French notions of equality."

  http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2011/04/11/135312495/as-french-ban-on-veils-goes-into-effect-some-women-defy-the-law

  On a related note, I saw my first burka, here in the Deep South, on Saturday. As I was exiting Best Buy, a woman wearing a burka was entering, with her husband and children. Our summers are oppressively hot, so I can only imagine how warm a solid black garment must be.
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  nugget

  The burka is not a requirement of the Muslim religion it is an added restriction placed on some women in very strict households. France is a very secular society and resists the imposition of religion. On one hand it can be argued that muslims chose to settle there knowing that the country was less tolerant than others.

  However this law assumes that any woman wear the burka does so because she is oppressed by the men in her life. This ignores the fact that whilst some women are forced to follow this mode of dress, others make a positive choice to wear it. So how do we feel about other women who wear clothes we personally find objectional and would we like our choices restricted? Surely a better approach would be to educate these women as to how they can dress whilst still honouring their faith. Persecution just makes people more hard line.

  JWs exercise this level of control of what is considered appropriate dress for women so I am not big on control now I have left.
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  skeeter1

  What happens if a woman does not wear the burka? That is the million dollar question.

  Frenchmen are Frenchmen first. This is the national ideal of France. To be a patriotic Frenchman. While one can be of another religion or following, you are to be a Frenchmen first. Religions are tolerated, until they remove the stateman from the citizen I think the Burka and Hijab fly in the face of the national French norms. Or, at least that is what I learned when I read the below book.

  In a way, having a law that requires the women remove their headcoverings provides for future religious freedom. The women carry around this heavy, all encompassing uniform that identifies them as Muslim. They can never be anything else. Unless they remove it. And, if they remove it...are they rejecting Allah (or their branch of Islam)? If removing the burka is considered the equivalent of rejecting Allah, what happens if a woman does not wear a burka? Will she be killed? Honestly, I think the men who rule her will not let her go out in public burka-less. These Muslim women are at the verge of being jailed in thier home. Besides, the men can beat the sh** out of the women if they are covered from head to toe!

  
  Why the French Don't Like Headscarves: Islam, the State, and Public Space - Paperback (Aug. 4, 2008) by John R. Bowen Buy new: $20.95 $15.38 33 new from $13.60 18 used from $12.55 Get it by Tuesday, Apr. 12 if you order in the next 4 hours and choose one-day shipping. Eligible for FREE Super Saver Shipping.
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  J. Hofer

  it is against the law in many countries over here (germany, austria, switzerland, italy...) to use bandanas or other forms of disguise to intentionally hide ones face, with the exception of some carnival or similar celebrations. why would extreme muslims be treated differently?

  additionally, it's a threat. how do you know the person that's hiding in burka isn't planning a robbery or something? how would you feel when someone approaches you and you can't see her (or his?) face? how would you identify a criminal that uses a burka?
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  skeeter1

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGsF8_QXKBU
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  aSphereisnotaCircle

  This ignores the fact that whilst some women are forced to follow this mode of dress, others make a positive choice to wear it.

  I would venture to say that most women who wear burkas do so by there own choice.

  If the watchtower had said that wearing a burka would please Jah, I would have very much wanted to wear one, of my own "free choice".
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  palmtree67

  J.Hofer:

  additionally, it's a threat. how do you know the person that's hiding in burka isn't planning a robbery or something? how would you feel when someone approaches you and you can't see her (or his?) face? how would you identify a criminal that uses a burka?

  Good point. How do you even know for sure they're a woman?
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  leavingwt

  Some states already have laws that would make wearing a burka illegal.

  http://plancksconstant.org/blog1/2011/04/banning_face_covering_will_never_happen_in_america.html
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  tenyearsafter

  I don't believe it is the burka that is the issue so much as the covering of the face. The argument goes that it makes identifying someone (such as during a police contact) very difficult and thus could even pose a safety issue to police officers. The face veils are likened to a man wearing a ski mask in public...also something that would be an issue. Many states have laws against tinted windows in cars for the same reason...
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  Kudra

  Seeing a woman in a burqua really boils my blood. But I feel the exact same way when I see women giving "talks" at the Kingdom Hall sitting at the side table. Cause they are in no position to "teach before men". Cause they have a vagina and not a penis. WTF.

  Yeah, it is a "choice". I agree with Sphere, it was totally my "choice" to be all subservient in my actions towards men at the Kingdom Hall but REALLY? I mean REALLY? It was only because I was told this from birth or that somehow I believed some authority figure who told me that things that are acceptable for men are NOT acceptable for women. The whole inequality between the sexes SOLELY due to religion PISSES ME THE FUCK OFF.