For Perry: There was no global flood, so stop looking for Noah's Ark (page 5)

PSacramento

Lets remember something, the whole "all the world" or "al the land" in the ancient world was thrown arouns like us saying, "that Ipod is everywhere".

Roman ruled all the world.

Alexander ruled all the world.

NO ONE has ever ruled even half.

As a former JW, yes I look at the 45+ years I was active with a mixture of regret and anger and resolve. I became a half descent theologian during that time and became friends with Seminary trained theologians. Nice broad study and exposure to Eastern and Western Christianity, plus my own search through Judaism and Existentalism. The early Bishops developed a metaphysical theology about God and the essence, nature, being issues. I can certainly quote Justin without agreeing or disagreeing with his conclusions. In the instance I quoted he was trying to stem the violence and intolerance rampant in the various Christian communities.

So are you joining the list of Baptists, Fundamentalists and Evangelicals here trying to save the sinners from a literal Hell.

Silly kids, Trix's are for kids. The Bishop's tried to avoid the contradictions in their metaphysics but failed, but its just philosophy, no harm trying...........oh wait they did go on an intolerant killing rampage for 1800 years didn't they. God forbid that bright minds could see through the Bishops crap.

Perry

desigs,

It seems like you went from one group of people who told you what to think about the bible to another group who told you what to think about the bible. Lots of people just read it for themselves and believe it.

On your other point, you know as well as I do that the Catholic Church killed millions of Christians who would not partake in their heiarchy. So, why try to paint all Christians (pastors) as murders? That is deceipt. You know better. You should be ashamed of yourself.

designs

Perry,

The Protestants were no better than the Catholics after they came on the scene. Luther and Calvin were murderers and should have spent the rest of their lives in Jail. That you know about them. The Founding Fathers of your persuasion make the GB and their evil deeds look like amatures.

Born Again smorg-again, what a cruel joke your group has been to humanity. And as usual you make poor connections. I have tried to get exposure to a broad spectrum of cultures and view points from Eastern philosophy to Calvary Chapelites. Real working experience, Informed conscent. That's why I reject your views.

OnTheWayOut

OTWO,

How about this reasoning:

Just replace matter with "God" and the "Abiogenesis Theory," it could be the "Creation Theory: Explaining how life must have come from something, but ignoring how God came from nothing."

All you do by believing in God is make the "Then a miracle occurs" easier to understand, but everything left of that is "a mystery" far too difficult to even begin to explain.

leavingwt

Perry:

Lots of people just read it for themselves and believe it.

That is a terrifying thought. I hope that they do more than just read it. I hope they consult some commentary on which verses to ignore or re-interpret in light of evidence.

However, if they just stick with the Golden Rule, everything should work out nicely.

Perry

OTWO,

All you do by believing in God is make the "Then a miracle occurs" easier to understand

I agree. So, which is easier to believe? - God or this:

For example, in a 1979 interview with *Dr. Donald Fisher, the state paleontologist for New York, Luther Sunderland, asked him: [Fossils Date the Rocks]"How do you date fossils?" His reply: "By the Cambrian rocks in which they were found." Sunderland then asked him if this were not circular reasoning, and *Fisher replied, "Of course, how else are you going to do it?" (Bible Science Newsletter, December 1986, p. 6.)

[Rocks Date the Fossils] "The rocks do date the fossils, [Fossils Date the Rocks] but the fossils date the rocks more accurately. Stratigraphy cannot avoid this kind of reasoning . . because circularity is inherent in the derivation of time scales."—*J.E. O'Rourke, "Pragmatism vs. Materialism in Stratigraphy," American Journal of science, January 1976.

[Rocks Date the Fossils] "Trilobites of many kinds are common in Paleozoic rocks. About half the fossils of the Paleozoic are trilobites. But trilobites aren't found in rocks younger than the Permian period".- University of Hawaii website

[Fossils Date theRocks] The succession of organism as has been determined by a study of theory remains buried in the rocks, and the relative ages of the rocks are determined by the remains of organisms that they contain."—*R.H. Rastall, article "Geology," Encyclopedia Britannica, Vol. 10 (14th ed.; 1956), p. 168.

Stratigraphy is the oldest of the relative dating methods that archaeologists use to date things. Stratigraphy is based on the law of superposition—like a layer cake, the lowest layers must have been formed first. - archeology.com [Rocks Date the Fossils]

[Fossils Date the Rocks] "The paleontologist's wheel of authority turned full circle when he put this process into reverse and used his fossils to determine tops and bottoms for himself. In the course of time he came to rule upon stratigraphic order, and gaps within it, on a worldwide basis."—*F.K. North, "the Geological Time Scale," in Royal Society of Canada Special Publication, 8:5 (1964).

How do we know this picture represents millions of years OTWO?

Perry

The Protestants were no better than the Catholics after they came on the scene. Luther and Calvin were murderers and should have spent the rest of their lives in Jail.

designs,

You know full well that I am neither a Catholic nor Protestant and neither are millions of others. Further, I have pointed out to you the tens of millions of indigenous Christian peoples called by numerous names that were slaughtered by the Papal Bulls over very long periods of time. The record of these peoples' faith, gentleness and perserverance are unparalled in ALL of human history.

Even though you know all about this history, you still try to paint a different picture. Shame on you!

Lwt,

I hope they consult some commentary on which verses to ignore

Didn't you take anything of value with you by leaving the "WT? If we learned nothing at all it should be not to put our trust in men too much. How would you know which commentaries to use?

The Wt told us which scriptures were ok and which ones were poorly worded. That didn't work out too well for lots of folks.

Perry

All this Catholicism talk reminds of .....Where's BTS????

Questions for BTS -

Explain how you can believe that Jesus is God and at the same time God could: a.) deliberately tell a lie about Noah's Flood b.) not know that the story was a lie c.) knew that the story was a lie and deliberately deceived his listeners with the story anyway.

designs

Perry, I've sat through worship services with your fellow so-called 'Born Againers', I always try to get real life experiences in forming opinions. Nopw you just have to convince your fellow Fundi, Stepehn, to stop calling the Catholics his brothers.

Calvary Chapel, Baptist, Assembly of God, Presbyterian, SDA, LDS, Catholic and on, I've been with them all over the years. So shame back at you.........isn't this fun, the shame shame game, geez I've been drug down to the 3rd grade level by a Fundamentalist

Blackwater, the private Evangelical kill for hire group, aaah Bush's favorite.

For Perry: There was no global flood, so stop looking for Noah's Ark

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